Hey Mez, love everything you’ve done for the community (I loved the mod pack you were curating for a while!)
I love the trauma staff and run something similar. I guess you went by “feel” to include defensive options. I had a couple of questions:
You skipped Perfect Timing - I really love it for crit builds since it’s 15% damage for free
I notice you didn’t pick up Wildfire but still go with In Fire Reborn as a keystone modifier. I’ve played around with Psychic Vampire instead and, while I don’t have numbers to prove it, it feels like I generate more warp charges.
I think this may just be the preferred defensive option for you but I usually go with Inner Tranquility for more potential spam but I doubt that it makes any significant different… maybe I should switch
I’ve found that if I’m hammering Venting Shriek often enough with this build, nobody can keep up, the damage is massive, the crowd control is massive, the only weakness is long range where Brain Rupture is slow and weak as always.
It’s exactly as OP as Conflagration staff in Vermintide.
Which is to say, you can solo Cata with it if you’re good, or die rather easily if you’re not.
One argument against it being OP, however, is that it’s an off-meta weapon - if most players are not using it, you can’t call it OP.
Thanks! I’ve been meaning to update the mod pack. I keep getting halfway through the process and getting side tracked
(1) I guess I could skip Empathic Evasion to get Perfect Timing, but… evasion is pretty good for being able to deal with scattered gunners. But might be worth the swap still.
(2) I should probably go with Vampire instead. That’s my usual on this pathway anyway and agree it’s more reliable especially in melee situations.
(3) I feel like the peril reduction is good when you’re ramping up from low to high peril, but once at high peril I’m alternating charged attacks and quick vents so rapidly I’m not sure the peril reduction helps that much. Plus in that situation I’m usually hitting the ult (Shriek) button as a quick as possible anyway.
Imo trauma has been the best staff since day 1. Yes, even back when it cost like 3x more peril or something per blast. I used to main it on both of my psykers, but after the first half year since release it got so boring I just had to switch out. And while the class overhaul almost a year ago gave us plenty of new kinds of builds with the trauma, it didn’t really change the core issue: Trauma more than any other ranged is a full all-rounder and a main weapon.
Aside from few exceptions, trauma will always be better than your melee or blitzes for almost every situation. Nothing really complements it much, because it doesn’t need complementing. Sure BB or DSIV / Deimos would deal with 1-3 crushers faster, but there’s almost always gonna be 5-10+ of them and another 100 of whatever else anyway. Sure EP assail is way faster at killing groups of ragers or gunners, but only if you had the shards charged, the group isn’t too big, and there’s nothing else in the way or draining the shots. Etc. But all those conditions? Trauma just doesn’t care. It’s going to debuff & CC & deal massive AoE exactly where you tell it to, not caring in the least what’s in the way with every single shot. Even if you get completely surrounded and no other weapon would suffice, for a trauma that’s just a regular tuesday and a yawn.
So yeah you’re right, it is OP. But how many good trauma users have you seen? How many good psykers have you seen even?
And that’s the thing. To use trauma well, you have to first master psykers, then the staff itself. Yet since release we’ve had no shortage of ppl complaining psykers are weak (yeah they really aren’t). I imagine many or even most ppl still think that today. Plasma however takes no effort at all. Just spam lights, you don’t even have to build a single talent point towards it, nvm learn its targeting & how to tactically use its CC & pushes like trauma. That’s the difference: accessibility.
Also sry for any spelling or funny logic errors. I haven’t been this tired in ages…
I think trauma staff is in a decent spot - I think it should have a longer range so it is more competitive with guns… but I do have one major complaint
AIMING ON GRATED STAIRS OR GRATES IS A NIGHTMARE O_O
… i’ve said it before, but there needs to be a ball of collision so that you can’t just lose your target into a hole…
also I think the coolest thing that could be added for trauma staff is the ability to aim it on walls or ceilings as well.
Yeah for the longest time I’ve played around with this idea that whoever designed the weapon deliberately made stairs into the staff’s nemesis like in Kung-Fu Panda. So part of an expert trauma user’s skillset is adopting this Sun Tzu mindset of deliberately moving the battle away from stairs into anything else. I’m not being serious ofc. it’s just a funny thought I’ve always had.
“So we have this weapon that can do everything and handle any number of any enemies all around you, but how do we make it not completely OP?” → “How about giving it some massive glaring weakness?” → “Oh I know, STAIRS!”
Omg this would be a fantastic idea for a new staff! I love asynchronous balancing, and Darktide already has a lot of it! Imagine a staff that shot like a long but narrow beam of extremely powerful energy at a 90-degree angle from where you placed it for a few seconds. It would be near useless on the floor where it could only hit the feet of a few mobs at a time, but placing it on walls would let it cover everything, or on ceilings would make it hit the tallest mobs’ (elites & specialists) heads first! And it could afford to be ridiculously powerful considering how limited and hard it would be to use well.
That is ofc… if the placement worked. And didn’t behave like the stairs do for trauma.
I can see how this would be a nightmare to fix for the devs. the stairs have very small holes in them that you can shoot through if the stairs were made solid you wont be able to shoot through. and if the targeting particle for trauma was made larger than a bullet so it wouldnt go through stairs it would make it very hard to use it through cover I’m fine with it being bad on stairs if that means everything else handles fine.
I’ve been saying since day 1 that Trauma is massively underrated and probably the best clutch weapon in the damn game.
That said I think it’s OP in probably the least offensive way possible.
It only truly shines when your team is already struggling, in a good run with a good team you generally won’t notice its impact nearly as much. It’s kind of a safety net more than a win harder weapon in a lot of cases, which I think gets it ignored. It also needs a lot of consideration and use of terrain to really shine, in a wide open space it’s still strong but nowhere near as abuseable.
And of course it does doo doo cheeks boss damage (pretty much a general staff issue but especially noticeable here), on a class that is already generally the worst at that. Even more the case since they nerfed explosive damage against bosses rather than just addressing rumbler specifically like they should have. I miss lacerations + trauma at least making a decent contribution against burgles. Actually I miss lacerations generally but that’s another topic.
As others have said it’s very rare to see a really good trauma user, and significant portions of the player base just don’t seem to care for it at all. I don’t think the weapon has the popularity or wide use to consider nerfing currently, if that ever changes and it becomes widely used maybe we pick this back up but for now I think a nerf is unwarranted.
Fair point but tbh the game has a lot of wonk like that.
Take for example my pet peeve with how the weapon hit boxes are basically 2D. So about every weapon with a larger than point radius tend to not hit heads even when you clearly did (melee, Voidstrike, etc). Ofc I only play the shortest possible characters so that might exacerbate the issue but still. Made a pretty little drawing like so:
That, and how it’s only the first hit location per enemy that matters. Which is why you get stuff like weak little trash surviving bolter hits to the face bc their finger happened to be in the way. Darktide is hardly alone in this ofc, it’s a very common problem in games in my experience. I can only assume this is bc. it’s actually really hard to make game engines handle stuff like this well.
yeah basically. unlike all the other infinite cleave overtuned weapons it doesn’t have the same uptime because its a staff, and it doesn’t have the same face roll speedclears either. but when it gets tough goings, its the strongest weapon around. I also almost never see people slide while charging which is where it gets absolutely stupid to where using any other weapon in a game is totally a choice you made. so it never gets nerfed besides losing the boss damage it could do to beast.
Trauma staff is definitely slept on, though I’d disagree that it only shines when the team is already struggling. In my opinion the CC it brings to the table alongside decent elite damage and strong horde clear can just shut down any danger in a mission in the hands of a good player. The friend I usually play with has refused to play anything other than trauma staff (blazing spirit + warp nexus) psyker since he got his hands on it, and the difference in difficulty with and without him is palpable.
Other than that I think you’ve hit the nail on the head, trauma staff has a different playstyle than the other staves and guns, and that alongside some of the jank with the secondary fire through stairs and grates probably accounts for a solid portion of people who just don’t like it. It’s niche and requires some decent skill and positioning to utilize, and until it’s overrepresented I’d agree it shouldn’t cop any nerfs.
In my mind only weapons that steal the fun to others cause they are too powerful should be nerfed. Usually you see that cause you tend to see them a lot used AND they record massive damages, usually 50% to 100% more than other weapons.
At contrary, weapons not used need a buff when they underperform by a lot.
In my mind, I see more purge or void staff than trauma or surge. Maybe trauma would need a nerf, but only when there would be a significant part of the community that would use it and be so efficient that the staff would record a lot more damages than other weapons.
Actually, the only one that I see recording such damages is the void strike staff.
Seems alright except you have to pigeon hole yourself. A grenade or gas bomb specialist will have a field day. I personally do not like builds without the ability to take out a long-range threats. Putting that responsibility on pubs is generally a bad idea, for me.
Oh yeah you just reminded me that I forgot in my last post here to big agree with your general point on peril economy being way too generous. They obviously didn’t intend you to run Scrier’s with a staff but peril is such a joke it’s a common enough Void pick.
That is actually the one nerf I’d like to see, make managing peril something you like, actually manage, not tap r here and there.
Wouldn’t mind Psyker getting a bit of their higher pre 13 max toughness back as a trade though
Thats how I see Boltgun and Bolt Pistol, to me they do amazing because I use them with my skill dynamics well, as for some other players, its more effort for them so its not deemed meta. That or its not satisfactory to the break points desired, or the effort to aim and hit targets
I like how @jtcLIVE has brought to mention before that Darktide has a “soft meta” where “you can play many weapons and win some fights against the meta”
In fact, I even have ran using Stealth Knife Zealot where I would totally crash and burn despite slash-slash-dodge (headshot elites & specialists as needed) apply-rinse-repeat etc vs my go full ham Fury Of The Faithful + Momentum or Chorus Of Spiritual Fortitude + Martyrdom armed with Heavy Eviscerator & Bolt Pistol or Boltgun Zealot Builds where I am brute force taking down everything (+3 Stamina, +1 wound, +21 Health curios bolster these builds for me)
Skill issues fluctuate with me as well, to where I need to warm up at Heresy before going Damnation then Aurics, helps to avoid some embarrassing crash and burns
You lost me at “bolt pistol”. It’s pretty craptacular by any sensible metric, and sugar coating with with the whole “meta” spiel is questionable. I don’t see how you can “do amazing” with it or even what “skill dynamics” means.
It was funny because a week or two ago, some reddit dude was telling everyone “it’s not for noobs, you just don’t know how to use it”. he then posts a vid proving opposite by playing rather poorly with or without the bolt pistol, more with the pistol out; it was a painful watch.
If any staff was OP to amazing, all the true duo videos would feature Pskyers. The truth is Psykers are the weakest class and its not close. They are factually the least likely class to clutch simply due to the clunkiness of how Peril works.
Trauma specifically sacrifices 50%~ kill power for 50% more crowd control vs Void or Purgatus, and it’s really not clear if that’s better in any way. I’d rate all Psyker staves an 8/10 or worse; the class is hard carried by Venting Shriek.
I run duos. I and everyone I’ve played with (with 1 exception) don’t use staves because they are incredibly boring and unfun, not because they aren’t strong. Anecdotal but that’s all I have.
It’s hard to put a pin in what “weakest class” is because of everyone playing different and using different skills, but for pure ranged gameplay Psyker is stronger than Vet imo.
Peril is beyond easy to manage and is why Psyker staves need to be made harder/more engaging. For staves it is essentially just a reload period, and for how fast you can quell down to ~50% peril and keep firing again it is incredibly fast.
Not true in the slightest.
Maybe I’m just being a jerk but I simply don’t understand how people have a problem with peril. The number is right on the screen. I get the occasional lapse of judgement but it’s not a deep issue.
Additionally it’s a complete nonissue for Purge since you get so many kills you constantly proc the peril reduction on kill talent.
Yeah for the longest time I’ve played around with this idea that whoever designed the weapon deliberately made stairs into the staff’s nemesis like in Kung-Fu Panda. So part of an expert trauma user’s skillset is adopting this Sun Tzu mindset of deliberately moving the battle away from stairs into anything else. I’m not being serious ofc. it’s just a funny thought I’ve always had.
