Infantry Lasguns

[Khorne_Dawg]

@FatsharkStrawHat

Hi, everyone! I am creating this Topic as a suggestion for how to improve the Infantry Lasguns in Darktide. The Infantry Lasgun is the standard issue rifle of the Astra Militarum and I think that it deserves better.

Firstly, the Mk IX (MG XII) is blatantly inferior to both the Mk IIb (MG IV) and the Mk VII (MG Ia) in DPS. This is not in any way complemented by its low RPM which also negatively impacts its Crit rate. The Mk IX is in dire need of a DPS buff so that it can actually keep up with the other two Marks while maintaining its intended niche of being the “DMR” Mark.

Secondly, the Infantry Lasguns should be fully automatic (while retaining their current RPMs) and also have a bit less recoil across the board. They are Infantry Lasguns, not Self-Loading Rifles. I have two key reasons to believe that these changes would improve both the effectiveness and the fun factor of the Infantry Lasguns without making them overpowered.

These two key reasons are:

1. The popularity of the “FullAuto” Mod amongst Infantry Lasgun users.
2. The general superiority of the Recon Lasgun (which is fully automatic and has negligible recoil) in both effectiveness and fun factor.

Thank you for listening to my TED Talk

[Dexta]

I agree with any and all buffs. Time for this game to come back from the dead.

[Ragnarok101]

Full auto breaks their identity relative to both autoguns and the recon lasgun, but they definitely need a bump (or enemies and other weapons need to be weakened).

Unfortunately Fatshark seems more intent on melee than rewarding precision long-range weapons so we work with what we’ve got.

[Khorne_Dawg]

@Ragnarok101

Full auto breaks their identity relative to both autoguns and the recon lasgun

To be honest, I’d find myself leaning towards agreement if it wasn’t for my friend highlighting that he uses FullAuto because Infantry Lasguns would otherwise give him Carpal Tunnel

I think that as long as their RPMs stay the same, making the Infantry Lasguns fully automatic would be an overall positive change.

[weeping.moon]

Infantries don’t work cause they are asking too much.

With reccon you have no recoil and so can spray. And with Lucius or bolter you have some nice damage so ads is rewarding.

With infantries you go ads and become vulnerable while have recoil and not that high damage.

Tune down recoil, increase dps or/and cleave so stacking damage oriented blessings wouldn’t be mandatory, add some blessing that grants damage reduction (overall not toughness specific) when in ads.

Or like this can be Vet left branch talent

Maniac damage isn’t great also, infantries suck vs waves of muties, especially if they are Nurgle buffed.

Those blessings are trash IMO

Salvo also takes too long to refresh, the only situation it’s efficient when you quickswap with MG12.

Those Blessings are outdated and don’t fit for how the game works currently. Why would you wait for salvo to refresh, when there are waves of specials or elites?

Those times when you can sit behind boxes picking out shooters like it was on release are gone, enemies are everywhere now on higher difficulties and you need to swap between melee and range a lot.

Mobility also can be buffed, why infantry lasgun has the same stats as bolter for example?

Also you don’t want to have a high stagger on headshot oriented weapon, it’s absolutely awefull to fully knock some enemy and wait till he get up so you can aim head again. Cause when it will happen there will be 10 other targets or melee situation.

@Khorne_Dawg

I think that as long as their RPMs stay the same, making the Infantry Lasguns fully automatic would be an overall positive change.

Make it toggable just like mod does. Those who want tacticool dmr feel will have it, those who don’t wanna kill their mouse will be saved too.

[Gideon404]

@Khorne_Dawg

The popularity of the “FullAuto” Mod among Infantry Lasgun users

I think the full-auto mod should just be integrated into the game as an option to reduce RSI. Separate from anything to do with the infantry lasgun.

[Frish]

@weeping.moon

Make it toggable just like mod does. Those who want tacticool dmr feel will have it, those who don’t wanna kill mouse will be saved too.

I like this idea. I took one look at the clip/mag size and noped out hard! It depresses me a bit to know how much I’d need to click to use the gun effectively lol, and each ammo pack is a real blow to my tendons.

Though it is an appealing weapons in other ways – single shot, accurate, laser beams, etc. I think even if it was full auto it wouldn’t lose it’s identity versus autoguns or recon lasgun. Recon shoots incredibly fast, and autogun shoots fast and bullets. Lasgun will still shoot relatively slow, but maintain accuracy.

[Gideon404]

I think we should distinguish between giving it a “full auto” ROF and just letting players hold down the mouse button and achieve normal ROF

[Khorne_Dawg]

Your post, especially the part about the Salvo Blessing, has reinforced my stance that the Infantry Lasguns (in their current form) are a relic of a bygone era.

In the early days of Darktide, the Infantry Lasguns were infinitely more reliable because the enemy types that they struggle against (Carapace and Maniac) had significantly lower spawn rates than they do today, whilst the enemies that they were designed to counter (most notably Scab Stalkers) were a lot stronger.

I remember when accidentally running into a cluster of Scab Stalkers’ line of fire on Damnation was a lethal mistake. Remember all of those Reddit posts complaining about them? They’re basically just Groaners with dinky Lascarbines these days.

Example: In Pre-Class Overhaul Darktide, you’d only fight around ten Crushers or twenty Ragers in an entire regular Damnation mission. Nowadays? There’s a pack of Crushers or a cluster of Ragers in every second room.

In other words, I agree with you completely.

[Frish]

@Gideon404

I think we should distinguish between giving it a “full auto” ROF and just letting players hold down the mouse button and achieve normal ROF

Sorry yeah this is what I mean. However fast you can click is more or less however fast the full auto would be. “Same RPM” as @Khorne_Dawg said

Basically just QoL for the click spam.

[Khorne_Dawg]

@Gideon404

I think the full-auto mod should just be integrated into the game as an option to reduce RSI.

Yeah, CTS and RSI aren’t any good for anyone, full auto would greatly prevent these conditions from manifesting among any Infantry Lasgun users.

[weeping.moon]

@Khorne_Dawg

In the early days of Darktide, the Infantry Lasguns were infinitely more reliable because the enemy types that they struggle against (Carapace and Maniac) had significantly lower spawn rates than they do today, whilst the enemies that they were designed to counter (specifically Scab Stalkers) were a lot stronger.

And there were less doors and floor hatches. Now enemies are comming from more spawn points, but most blessings and mobility are the same.

Same with Ghost blessing, when there were runs that consists from dreg stalkers for 80% it was ok.

Like 1,2 sec immunity on hit - you shot some stalker, then you need to push the dog or several, defend yourself against ragers blob/toss a nade to control them, etc. That Ghost buff will be gone every time there is some danger besides range units.

[murphIV]

I think making them automatic with the same fire rate would be an awesome buff - you can still click it precision like when you want but there’s times it would be better to just hold it down for suppression purposes.

[Khorne_Dawg]

@murphIV

I think making them automatic with the same fire rate would be an awesome buff - you can still click it precision like when you want but there’s times it would be better to just hold it down for suppression purposes

Yeah, this is 100% what I’m going for with the full auto suggestion.

[Amelia]

i agree in buffing them as suggested

honestly even forgot the lasguns were existing,
sadly i never seen anyone using them anymore in auric+ after other stuff get buffed

one of the lasguns was used to be meta in the early days of darktide, but now all of them are pretty much not used anymore, because other stuff is more fun to use

lasguns should return to be fun again and used again

[Pirx]

this and to help mice last longer.

[dragomusic]

They are way too jumpy when ads-ing, which includes oddly horizontal recoil, have horrible hipfire accuracy (another advantage Recon Las have over them), have horrible muzzle flash when firing a crit shot, and only have mediocre damage.

I’m fine with them not having amazing damage and being more consistent if their other problems are fixed.

@Ragnarok101

Full auto breaks their identity relative to both autoguns and the recon lasgun

Tell that to the Mk IV (IIB) lol.

An absolutely miserable gun to use without full auto, in line with the Accatran Las Pistol.

[Khorne_Dawg]

@Amelia

honestly even forgot the lasguns were existing,
sadly i never seen anyone using them anymore in auric+ after other stuff get buffed

one of the lasguns was used to be meta in the early days of darktide, but now all of them are pretty much not used anymore, because other stuff is more fun to use

lasguns should return to be fun again and used again

Exactly, Infantry Lasguns are the standard issue rifles of the Astra Militarum. I really feel that they were left behind in the dust post-Class Overhaul. Simply put, the Infantry Lasguns were designed for Pre-Class Overhaul Damnation which doesn’t exist anymore, and they are yet to be reworked accordingly.

[Ol_Jakal]

Pretty sure you people need to stop with the spray’n’pray and aim when you’re using the stock lasguns. with the inverse damage falloff they’re better for long-range enemy management than that regardless.

[Khorne_Dawg]

@Ol_Jakal

you people

What do you mean by “you people”?

@Ol_Jakal

stop with the spray’n’pray and aim when you’re using the stock lasguns

In no way does this thread indicate that we’re doing so, please actually read everything before you respond.

@Ol_Jakal

with the inverse damage falloff they’re better for long-range enemy management than that regardless

We never questioned its capabilities at long range, that dig’s completely irrelevant.