BH seems a little lackluster, granted I was championing nerfs for him, but I think with the changes to blessed not working with his old melee combo and the fact WHC can outpace him with ranged now he doesn’t have much of a place, he also suffered a lot (in a casual perspective) from scrounger nerfs since his most frequent load-out was volly-xbow or crossbow crit builds. Currently I feel like he is the only class who doesn’t really receive much play, just figured I would bring this up, I don’t have many suggestions on how he “could” be fixed, aside from maybe finding tools to make his wider variety of ranged weapons more appealing, currently BoP has better synergy with WHC due to the crit WHC provides (and the damage boost from tags), Crossbow is still good but BH is squishy and isn’t bringing a ton to the table in melee so its slow reload times (even with the talent) end up forcing him to engage quite often. Repeater Pistol is probably the best bet for him at the moment, but once again its upsides are similar to BoP but its overall a slightly weaker weapon.
My wife has nearly all her game time on BH. She still does fine with it, but she has to watch her ammo now. I’ve really only played it to finish the quest for complete all legend maps with each class. BH, shade and Pyro are my least used classes. I don’t think I’ve even done more that 20 rounds on BH in legend.
Still, I think he was one of the hardest hit classes with the balance changes and nerfs to scrounger. I very rarely see one in QP. Most of the games with a Salty are WHC or Zealot. They seem to be used about even right now.
@SmokerT69, I understand that BH is far from being unplayable, it is still not bad, but w/o Blessed Shots reset on melee kill in baseline it just becomes boring. All his ranged weapons relies on reload, and that’s the reason why Prize Bounty is the most optimal talent to pick on lvl 15. Also both Zealot and WHC are now outshining BH a lot, Zealot by having enormous amount of toughness and THP sustain and WHC providing lots of utility to his team, as well as having greatly increased headshot damage not even mentioning about crit-headshot kills on SV/Maulers, that are very valuable if you are playing something like deathwish.
I’m still a firm believer of giving his ultimate the “Temp health on kill” trait, so that he can use it to delete big targets with his ult and be rewarded for it.
Also, someone suggested in another BH thread that if they’re not going to make the “Blessed Shots resets on melee kill” a regular passive, at least make him get like a passive cooldown reduction to blessed shots when dealing melee damage. So instead of resetting the cooldown with a kill, you’d lower the remaining cooldown based on number of enemied hit / damage done in melee. This would then work on bosses as well, where you’ll have a hard time getting resets without nearby trash mobs to kill.
I firmly believe that would bring BH some much needed baseline synergy to make him more fun. Personally, I’ve barely played BH since 1.3(Bbb?) because he doesn’t feel particularly fluid without the reset on kill talent.
I don’t play BH ever, I just started messing around on Saltz (post getting him to 30 ages ago) Im a huntsman main, but im having a blast on Zealot and WHC, BH just seems meh, and some of my BH fanboy friends don’t even touch him anymore, and when they do the stat screen (which I know doesn’t really matter) is still pretty depressing.
BH is still the glass cannon he was before. Hits hard, but his effectiveness in melee is all player skill (and with his low HP and no survival Talents to speak of, requires quite high skill indeed to keep up in melee combat).
What did change was his ammo retention - and to a better direction, I’d say. I think he’s now at the spot ammo-wise where I think other ranged specialists should be: Can still keep up his ammo up indefinitely, but it requires paying attention in addition to sensible playstyle and some investment, and gaining (significantly) more ammo from weapon use needs particular setups. In addition, there’s some actual choice on lv15 Talents (although with Blessed Shots’ reset on melee kill moved there, the reduced cooldown has lost most of what little effectiveness it had).
So while the balancing did hit him significantly, I think the hit was very much warranted, and the other ranged specialists (primarily Waystalker and Huntsman; Sienna’s balancing works differently and RV’s problems lie elsewhere) need some checking next.
Well BoP doesn’t really have any Synergy with the WHC anymore either since the Clip addition there isn’t enough in the clip to synergize with WHC Ult.
Really I think the only one who can use BoP well at this point is Zealot due to the power stacking (which is Ironic being that Zealots in Warhammer are only supposed to be able to use Bows and Crossbows)
Repeater has some synergy since it can be used in conjunction with the WHC Ult as it has a very short reload time. And so does Volley since its got a larger clip.
Still the real problem with BH and melee has more to do with all the previous melee weapon nerfs that were done to account for the Zealot’s power stacking. On WHC they really can’t be used that well either unless you do all Headshots and for that the Rapier is best anyway.
I think the only real melee weapon left usable on the other two jobs that gives them decent melee is the Axe/Falch dual wield (outside Rapier on WHC).
Please, keep your BoP ramblings in your own thread.
How long are you going to cling to the notion that the BoP are bad? They’re not. They work absolutely fine on all his careers, synergizing in different ways for BH and WHC.
Victor Saltzpyre is fine. WHC is incredibly strong with basically all of his melee weapons. Saying axe+falch is the only decent melee alternative for BH/WHC is just hilariously wrong, and leaves me wondering what the heck you’re doing with the careers if that’s your honest opinion.
At the end of the day BH is fine as a stand alone just not when compared to other classes. We want all classes to be played and BH isn’t being played, that is all.
Sums it up rather well.
This is very questionable opinion.
WHC- it has one of the best tallent lines in the game as well as 5% crit and “tag bonus” (I agree that it is prety clunky, but still very powerfull) and very powerful ult. His ability+talent kit not only gives him a lot of bonuses but also increases his teammate’s performance.
Zealot- it is the toughest career in the game against hits (he don’t have real DR agaist DOTs aka gas globes/warpfire), he got Flagelant, 150 base HP and insane amount of THP from Pleasure from Pain talent. Zealot also got 30% power stacks from missing health and crit tallent which makes him very powerfull in melee as well as giving him an opportunity to reach very nasty breakpoints for a ranged weapon.
BH- it has relatively good ammo sustain via Blessed Shots+ Scounger, he got ult that can delete one special on any range if you have line of sight with a prety low CD. But on the other hand he is the most fragile of all Salty careers as well as having only one talent that affects melee combat- 5% aspd on lvl 5, but you don’t realy want to pick that talent, because BH benefits a lot more from Swift Reload talent.
So what do we have BH has some ammo sustain from that guaranteed crit every 10 sec that don’t consume ammo + Scounger. He also has a lot better reload time than WHC/Zealot and a slightly bigger crit bonus (Crippling Strike talent), he also is the only one who can realy utilize Hunter trait, but he loses a lot of ammo sustain using it, and he is a lot weaker in melee combat then WHC/Zealot.
I want to reply to this with my 2 cents.
I’m not saying the post is inaccurate, just add a counterpoint.
Since the release of the balance patch, I’ve been playing mostly as Bounty Hunter and having a great time.
I’ve always felt that one crit every 10 seconds is a huge power, and luckily they have improved the repeater pistol to the point where, as a BH at least, it is no longer broken. It takes a very specific build but it’s possible to one shot any enemy besides bosses with the crit (assuming all bullets connect) and that, in my humble opinion, is what a full blast of that weapon is supposed to do. I’m having a lot of fun with it (changing career for Harder Better deeds). As a melee weapon I use a 1h axe, not the easiest weapon to use admittedly, but i’m enjoying it. My fun, to be honest, is mostly dependent on my use of the repeater, and it can be argued that it’s a very narrow playstyle. I’ll probably change career again if I could no longer do this.
With this in mind, I can attest it’s a very interesting class to play, even if there are safer choices (tanks or careers that can heal up with ultis, like WS or RV).
At the moment there are things in worse conditions, imo. I know I can’t bear myself to play shade without the DD, and those are too broken for me at the moment (not saying there aren’t good choices there, there are, I just don’t like their playstyle as much as I enjoyed the daggers’)
Then I would suggest trying that same Two Handed Sword on Kruber or even Zealot.
You’re going to be surprised at how well it actually works on every other career but WHC and BH. It has neither the cleave nor stagger the other two can give it. And it can’t really compete with the Rapier.
Axe is another good example. For WHC and BH its only adequet at surviving in a Horde, and its not even that great against Armor at this point. Again Rapier will best it on just about everything with the exception of CWs, and actually it only beats the Rapier on CWs if you count stagger (which to be honest is significant)
BUT… if your’e only playing at Champion or lower, you never would know this or have seen it.
BoP cannot run sustained fire anymore due to the Clip addition.
So it no longer synergizes with the WHC’s Ult. The full clip is expended in half a second and you cannot reload before the Ult is done. Its really not much different anymore than using it on any other job at this point. You can get about 6 crits out of 12 shots. That’s not exactly “Synergizing” now is it?
There’s not enough in the Clip TO synergize anymore. It used to, but no longer does.
BoP does not have a “Charged Shot” either so it can’t be used in conjunction with Blessed Shots on the Bounty Hunter. Ergo the very reason the OP is telling you it doesn’t Synergize with BH either.
The OP was telling you the Truth about BoP and BH, but that one has been that way since the beginning of the game. Still it doesn’t change the fact it does not synergize with either the WHCs talents nor the BHs Talents anymore.
Sigmar curse you, stop the BoP ramblings.
More importantly the OP brought up Synergy and why those specific Ranged Weapons were used by the different Jobs.
Synergy is like the old BoP with the sustained fire throughout the WHC Ult. It no longer synergizes with WHC since the Clip addition. The only one that does is the Repeater Pistol as its the only one capable of sustained fire throughout the WHC Ult.
Like the Bounty Hunter and Repeater, where he can use the Charged Shot (which is all 8 shots fired at once), with Blessed Shots and score an Automatic Crit for the full 8 shots. And use his other Talent which makes Blessed Shots cost no ammo. So he can quite literally get a free Charged Shot with no ammo cost on either Volley or Repeater every 15 seconds
That’s weapon synergy.
Neither the Bounty Hunter nor WHC have any Synergy anymore with BoP.
I wouldn’t necessarily call the Zealot’s a Synergy with BoP either, but the Zealot is capable of stacking a good 30% Power in his Talents before he even gets to Equipment Power stacking (which can net another +40% power)… So really the only job that can really put the BoP to maximum effect at this point due to the Clip is the Zealot as theirs is on a Per Shot basis.
Neither Bounty Hunter nor WHC can do that.
EDIT: Irony being that the Zealot is the ONLY job that should not be using them at all given that in Warhammer they can only use Bows and Crossbows.
Ofc you are forgetting about WHC “tag bonus” which is equal to ~20% power, it’s less then Zealots 30% power from stacks, still decent amount helping you to achieve some breakpoints, not only for BoP but also for xBow or RP.
Acting like everyone who disagrees with you is a sub-Legend scrub is some A-class arguing, chief.
Didn’t even bother reading the rest of your comment, you’ll keep derailing threads like these forever no matter what people tell you.
No WHC Tag is equal to 20% damage not 20% Power.
The Zealot’s power stacking is upwards of 30%, and that includes Cleave, Stagger, AND damage. And it applies to ALL targets not just One specific tagged target.
This is the same thing when a Kruber Merc uses something like the Two Handed Sword. They also get 10% power from talents, +5% attack speed, and +5% for each target in the immediate area.
Its why the Zealot and Kruber Merc can make the Two Handed Sword work while WHC and BH will find it a substandard weapon. This same thing applies to the Axe and Zealot.
And pretty much exactly what the OP is telling you with regards to the melee and why the melee weapons are so substandard on Bounty Hunter and in truth also on the WHC with the exception of the Rapier.
They’ve been adjusted to account for the Zealot. Its why the Axe/Falch is the only real efficient one. It hasn’t been nerfed into the ground yet to account for Zealot so is still actually usable on the other two jobs.
Tag works well with X-Bow specifically because its a precision weapon and you can run around all day one shotting SVs with it. And its far more efficient than doing it with BoP.