Class Balance and the things I see

Its no secret that the last patch was HUGE for Witch Hunter Captain.

I really commend Fat Shark with this. The balance between all the Saltzpyre jobs has really leveled off quite a bit…

It used to be Bounty Hunter was superior choice and the Zealot was functional but second best, while the WHC was just nothing compared to them. But that has all changed now. The balance between all of the jobs is very narrow. When I play WHC I literally get a 50/50 kill split between Ranged and Melee with the WHC depending on weapon usage (unless I’m using Brace of Pistols which dont’ have enough ammo). And its competitive again with the other jobs.

Now you really DO see a good split.

Bounty Hunter 75% Ranged 25% melee power
Witch Hunter Captain 50% Melee 50% Ranged power
Zealot: 75% Melee, 25% Ranged power

And they ALL get their kills, All of them are strong now and are competitive with the Meta. While I admit its impossible to outright compare them side by side since you can’t play them all in one match togather. The reality is, they are very close now in balance and killing power. I am actually amazed at how close they all are now.

So I started thinking about why you ONLY see certain careers on other Characters and not the others.

Its no secret that Ironbreaker for Bardin is quite literally the majority choice, and its because the others just don’t have as much to offer, this one is in similar shoes to the Saltzpyre Careers. While admittedly half the problem with the Dwarven Slayer is more a player issue, and…and someone unable to find the Block button.

The reality is, its not as strong comparatively with the Ironbreaker, and a lot of that has to do with the fact his jump doesn’t provide much protection. I think what might help a great deal is a brief burst of Temp Health that would allow him to sustain a couple of hits when he leaps into a crowd like that, as getting hit in that way is going to be unavoidable. At the very least it will allow him to make some use of his Ult without getting crushed before he can move.

The Dwarven Ranger is so far down the Charts its literally not played anymore. While I see a lot of Dwarves in groups… its almost exclusively Ironbreaker with only a few Slayers. Yet having on in a group for the extra ammo or bombs is undoubtedly beneficial… but its JUST NOT beneficial enough to outweigh what the Ironbreaker brings to the table. You seriously need to go back to allowing the possibility of a Healing potion to drop for special kills. And it should be included with the other drops. So its a certain percentage chance that instead of ammo or bomb… a healing potion could drop.

Ammo is useless to a “meta” party consisting of Pyromancer, Waystalker, or Bounty Hunter as they have unlimited Ammo. So of course you’ll ALWAYs see Ironbreaker or Slayer. The Ranger just doesn’t bring enough to the table to outwiegh those options… but he would IF he could drop healing potions.

The Dwarven Ranger IS actually incredibly useful to ALL OTHER jobs… bombs and ammo are huge for them. You can bomb your way through any patrol and never run out of ammo due to all the special spawns. So the party would never run low on resources which is generally the largest cause for a party wipe. Adding the Healing potion back in goes a LONG way to breaking up those Meta Parties and bringing the other Jobs for the other characters into play.

That is the biggest reason there are Meta Parties… they have unlimited ammo and tanking… so much lower chance of party wipe. Why would they play any other job? Granted the new patch does have an impact on that with Ranged Damage coming down a bit and the melee on those Ranged Jobs no longer really being up to snuff… But there’s still not much incentive for the other jobs to be played.

Shade could go a long ways with that kind of support, and contribute a lot more. Same with Maiden. While Sienna’s other careers have more to do with Balancing the Staves… Kruber’s jobs would also find this a HUGE boon.

So I seriously think you need to add the Healing Potion back in as a lottery on the Dwarven Rangers Scavange type talents for the Ammo and Bombs.

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I have to disagree on Bardin stuff.

Don’t bring back heal pots. People get over confident when that happens.

Ranger is not weak. I play ranger on legend and it sure kills stuff. Shotgun makes short work of anything without armor like CWs. Just learn to aim properly and there ya go.

Ironbreaker is majority pick because it’s noob friendly with all the tanking boosts and thats okay. Not saying noobs only play it, but it is way easier than the other 2 careers.

Slayer is godlike on melee, but you need to know what you are doing. Jumping into the middle of an entire horde or patrol just gets you killed. You ain’t a tank and I have hard time understanding why people in this game thinks that way. Best 1v1 characters in the game for sure.


I agree… there is a meta, and there are some careers good but outdated.

Who cares if people get “overconfident”. That’s not the point of it.

That said… you’re absolutely right… Dwarven Ranger doesn’t suck… it just brings nothing to the table over what the IB brings.

This is why I recommend bringing back the Healing Potion drops.

There’s nothing wrong with Dwarven Ranger strength at all. Its pretty good especially with that shotgun. But its more a case to where it doesn’t have the benefits the others have. Its still very competitive from a strength standpoint.

But that’s not really what I’m getting at here.

IB lives more, but I find my groups succeed more when I play a class that kills more and is better in boss damage, since the majority of my group wipes involve a boss.

The passive on Ranger Bardin is one of the most powerful/useful/underrated skills in the game. If I am using any ranged class, this is career I am most pleased to see join my game. With the increased ammo talent, the entire group gains a significant boost to ranged combat.
I really have to imagine that the IronBreaker is being greatly overhyped. He is definitely not a bad career, but not as useful for the team as people seem to indicate. I agree with @Lettu in that he is most noob freindly, which is the biggest reason why he is so popular.

I … Do (appreciate a ranger)… as a WHC… but not as a Bounty Hunter… I have basically unlimited ammo… same with Waystalker or Sienna… so the Meta party is out for this job…

IE… all of the most played jobs… so you literally bring nothing they could want or need.

Except for a party with Kruber or Shade or Maiden or any one of a number of careers that just aren’t played as much. So most of the time you don’t bring anything to the table they want or need.

Having loads of grenades and shrapnel trinkets make bosses/patrols even easier to kill and not even mentioning how fast you clear hordes.

Just me I guess :upside_down_face:

Yeah but they don’t generally need help with bosses or elites.

Why is it a simple healing potion SO UNGODLY horrible that it wouldn’t at least be worth a try. A 1 in 10 drop rate isn’t horrible.

And by the way this comes from playing in those Meta parties where we’ve had a Ranger join, and the others ragged him so badly for no reason other than that he wasn’t playing an Ironbreaker.

I appreciated him because as a WH Captain the ammo was great. But the party neither needed nor wanted the spare bombs, and as a WH Captain I can wipe out a Rat Patrol just as fast as a Bounty Hunter. I’ve got the Ammo to do it with. Its the Chaos patrols that are more the problem.

What im getting at with heal pots is that when players get those, facetanking stuff isn’t such a bad thing anymore. You get too many potions that way like it was in beta.

Now you need to avoid taking hits :+1:t2:

It’s just my opinion. But saying ”brings nothing to the table” is wrong. I prefer ranger on my team any day if he participates in killing stuff rather than just holding up shield and standing still… There are good IBs who can kill stuff too without flamer and I have nothing against them.