Nope. That doesn’t make any sense in this context. So what, I hide behind the wall for 2 seconds, then step out and have my aim thrown off by a bad mechanic? Seriously. You have to respond to threats quickly in Verm (especially Cata). Hiding behind cover arbitrarily doesn’t do anything. That’s not how it’s played.
I’m all for melee FF, mate, I come from L4D tutelage!
Similarly, you cannot use the “it’s not fair” argument for a random-based game. I tend to crack up at things like shown in the third clip - you got shot, your aim went off- sheise happens, it’s kind of part of the fun really.
And yeah, after being subscribed to Todd Cutler’s channel on YT, I don’t think it is unfair to treat crossbows that way - they are terrible weapons, very finicky and hard to aim in general compared to other ranged weapon types portrayed in the game.
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Welp, that speaks for itself.
^^ Well that’s a weak argument…
Yeah, I can also argue that sitting in a dead-end with a fence climbable by enemies behind you is not the best strategy either, but there you all were. The way you used crossbow in this situation (talking about 3rd vid) is more like I’d use BoP or rapier pistol, but hey - its just my opinion.
So how would you use a crossbow? How does it differ from other ranged weapons? Rapier pistol would also not deal with a gunner from that range.
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This isn’t mutually exclusive with this
Getting hit ever isn’t the result of skill. And friendly fire is friendly fire. In no game is FF a slap in the wrist and other co-op centric game has FF levels that just outright kill you.
Now in order
Exhibit A
Friendly fire. The only one I’m sympathetic on. But FF is FF and will be FF no matter what game you’re playing. With various levels of disruptiveness included.
Exhibit B
Poor target acquisition on you and your teams part as you all rush to kill the exact same SV leaving the rattling that you can hear free to spin up and open fire.
Exhibit C
Back to the wall where you can get flanked, no actual space to move besides a narrow doorway, and dead on to angles that allow a max range blight stormer. Getting hit is nobodies fault but your teams.
FS has the ability to provide or negate what throws your aim out of whack. Warpfire Throwers can still be aimed and shot through. Rattling gunners can’t. That’s by design.
If the main point of contention is rattling gunners, then you and yours need to get better about either preventing their fire or dealing with it’s targeting. Of which it will only open fire on somebody getting comboed or the closest person to enter it’s agro radius.
Look for yourself. It’s an old vid, but I don’t think x-bows were changed much since then. Compare to how the elf uses the volley in this particular instance XD.
Elitism. This isn’t about nitpicking our positioning or targeting based on your anecdotal, perceived skill. It’s about this particular crossbow mechanic, and that’s it. There are important differences between balancing a weapon, making a weapon feel good to use, and both. I have already said this, but I love the way crossbow handles otherwise. What I don’t like is having my aim arbitrarily thrown off by any tick of damage, all to the same extent no matter the amount of damage.
You aren’t justified in waiving off my claims by pointing out irrelevant flaws in the moment of the clip. The focal point is what happens with the crossbow and whether or not that should have happened, does it feel good, does it feel fair, did it reward my skill, and is it truly balanced. I don’t think that having my teammate killed for taking 1 stray bullet as a tank character is fair, nor does it feel good, nor does it reward my skill (at aiming, which was on-target), nor does it feel like an appropriate balance.
Absolutely not.
You want a weapon that rewards skilled play. Playing in an unskilled manner should not be rewarded. In the confines of the game there is a mechanic and tools that you can do as a player to mitigate and prevent something from happening.
Why did your ally take a bolt?
Because you got hit.
Why did you get hit?
Because your teams position was bad
What could have been done differently
Either moving to a different location or not shooting after you got hit. This extends to every single ranged weapon and for Rattling Gunners in particular it’s already engraved in most of the player base that trying to fire on one if he’s aiming at you is generally a very bad idea.
Being hit by a rattling gunner dead on is a punishment mechanic as is the screw uppery to the aim. I didn’t “wave off your claims” I pointed out that your exhibits occured due to nobody else but yourself.
Secondly. You played a certain way twice and got an expected result. Pointing that out isn’t a wave out and it isn’t elitism. It’s fact. And as I mentioned before, I’m sympathetic towards friendly fire jacking up the aim, even if I’m aware of the realities that other games have more draconian punishments for an ally shooting you. Despite that, I still think that FF at least on dot weapons shouldn’t reapply its aim screwuppery per tick. Because that’s complete BS
That and that alone.
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In Exhibits A and B you’re doing something that I just never do, but I don’t pretend to not get the point. Exhibit C is just a hilarious “crap happens” moment - you pulled the trigger pretty much simultaneously with getting hit.
As for all the questions, I’d personally prefer the aim to bloom proportional to the damage you receive. One thing is to get a little burn on your butt (and keep forcing yourself to aim steadily), the other thing is to get slashed in half by an overhead halberd attack and then try to aim at something, This would partly alleviate the FF problem too since FF is diluted heavily in terms of damage in VT2.
But speaking frankly, I never thought about this before I read about it on the forums. I just took it for granted and still had fun (as can be observed in my vid e.g.). That is probably why I saw things I pointed out in your clips - because the bloom thing was perfectly customary for me.
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Well, it certainly frustrates me often. I use crossbow like I use longbow. I take on the responsibility of dealing with specials if no one else has, as well as picking of elites like you do in your video. I just don’t feel it is an appropriate way to balance it. I’d rather see it lose 5 max ammo than keep the aim-bloom to the extent it has.
Yeah, I can see how it can be esp. in Exhibit A. However, not punishing players’ aim for getting hit is not right too. The proportionality to damage taken would be my first guess. If that never happens, I won’t shed a tear, however, there are more important things to balance in the game at the moment IMHO.
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It’s quick-play. I don’t always have the luxury of communicating with the team that a different position would be optimal. I don’t have the luxury of thinking like a machine and knowing all possible angles and pitfalls through the course of events that transpire. I play the cards that are dealt. I did the best I could, and I felt it was enough. And in reality, the only thing that prevented it from being enough was this mechanic. My cross-hairs went across the screen. It shouldn’t have happened, not for a single bullet that did ~4 damage.
And that’s the period where you consider process improvement. FF is whatever. That’s always going to happen.
I regards to positioning, holding E and moving the mouse has both helped me when I do it and saved me when others do it. People tunnel all the time in this game. But we have an actual quick communication menu that you can use in between a swing. Not the best, but it gets the job done.
The melee equivalent of this mechanic by the by, is the stun you take after a hit which can cause you to be comboed. Which now that archers exist, are a thing that’s comparatively common to having your aim thrown off by a bullet. But far more deadly.
And look. I get it. God knows I’ve complained about a bunch of crap over this games life both warranted or not. But the recoil from a hit? I don’t consider it game breaking. It was back when the darn things could shoot you through walls. Remember what a joy that was? And were it to be true that the game is broken now. They give us the tools we need (sight, sound, weapons, walls) to deal with it. While I’m loathe to tell somebody to adapt, I think a period of inflection would lead to better abilities to handle the mechanic in general and those situations specifically
Well besides FF. no helping that
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