Communication please

[Jado]

I’m just going to chime in a bit because I’m currently only playing Helldivers 2 out of the two games.

Some have discussed Darktide, and what draws people in is the Warhammer 40K setting.

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I’d like to continue my personal opinion in that discussion by saying that if someone made a game with Helldivers 2’s gameplay: open map, main and side map objectives, hidden bunkers and caches, the ability to call in stratagems, and soon, Mechs.

That would have been the ideal Warhammer 40K game for me, with proper licensing allowing me to fight from the trenches as a Krieg soldier on an open battlefield in PVE and in a third person perspective (no mods).

Darktide is fantastic, and I have enjoyed it for 1500 hours, but where does it go from here? How will the gameplay in Darktide evolve? I can’t really see anything on the horizon other than more Auric Maelstrom or maybe “Chaos Wastes”, where the A.I Director is throwing hundreds of enemies at you.

I’d like to see Darktide shake up its formula and evolve from where it is now, and hopefully it will in the future, but the linear maps detract significantly from the game’s enjoyment.

Helldivers 2 excels in that it is strategic in terms of how you use the stratagems, chase map objectives (RNG generated map) either alone or with 2-4 people while the others split in different directions, whereas Darktide focuses on forcing you to stick together and blitz 1000mph gameplay, there’s really no strategy, just reaction-based gameplay by the game constantly throwing braindead enemies at you.

However, the gameplay in Helldivers 2 feels much more intense to me (the new Autonom civilian rescue mission is terrifying in diff 8-9), whereas Darktide is more exhausting to play because it requires constant hyperfocus from you, where one misstep kills you.

Whereas Helldivers 2 is more about planning ahead, packing the right loadout, and sometimes sneaking past fights, Darktide is all about main character syndrome, in which you feel like a super hero and kill enemies by the hundreds during a match.

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There are advantages and disadvantages to both approaches. All I know is that, as I previously stated, if a Warhammer 40K shooter with Helldivers 2 gameplay was created, it would be my main game for years to come.

[Enclave]

Gotta give fatshark credit where its due
They’re not even bothering to compete with helldivers 2

They have very wisely accepted their defeat by doing absolutely nothing.
Helldivers and arrowhead is everything fatshark have failed and refused to learn in the past decade.

[AlphaOmegaMan]

I was saying something very similar to some friends of mine.

You can damn near just reskin HD2 into a 40k Space Marine thing. Dropping in pods as space marines of chapter X and completing various objectives over a freshly generated map? Sounds absolutely incredible and beyond thematic.

I’ve tried playing Darktide since HD2 came out and I just find myself alt F4’ing out of every round out of boredom or dissatisfaction. HD2 highlighted the shortcomings of Darktide so starkly for me that it doesn’t feel remotely the same anymore. It’s like you said, where can it even go from here? The hyperpaced, twitchy gameplay can be fun but I don’t know that I think it’s the only way this formula can be used. I suggested a slower, more tactical game mode in an older thread of mine and some people seemed to think that was a strange idea in some way, but again, without something like that, where does this game go? New maps and weapons can only spruce things up so much before it’s all just the same stale thing over and over again.

[Heretical_Cactus]

Reading that last comment, it sort of feel like you’re playing Darktide because it’s a 40k game in spite of it being a tide game rather than for the tide gameplay ?

Is it the case ?

[CGILantern]

Welp then why sugarcoating the Tide game as something else if we dose not supposed to play such as depicted ?

Or what is the essence to be a Tied game ? the ankle deep melee combat… ? Idk what would be worse a wh40k game sockpuppeting as Tide game or vice versa

[AlphaOmegaMan]

I mean, kind of? Am I supposed to have some innate allegiance to the Tide series? I play games because they’re fun and immersive most of the time. If they slack too much in some regard, I probably won’t keep playing them.

Obviously everyone here likes what the Tide formula involves, but do they like it because it’s “the Tide formula” or is it because it provides an immersive and visceral grimdark experience? I suppose it’s somewhat subjective but I think most people would lean, knowingly or unknowingly, towards the latter. Assuming that’s the case, there are many ways of providing that experience beyond what the game does right now. I’m only advocating for innovation and what I’m proposing is not somehow mutually exclusive to what’s already there.

[Heretical_Cactus]

I’m fully here for the tide’s melee aspect, warhammer fantasy I was a fan of, but 40k isn’t really interesting to me (Mostly due to SM but still)

And I would play a tide game (Or any game with good melee combat) even in another Ip (Or non Ip work).

If they (Arrowhead or FS or even someone else) did a HD40k I wouldn’t be interested in it

[Eisenfaust]

@Heretical_Cactus

it sort of feel like you’re playing Darktide because it’s a 40k game in spite of it being a tide game rather than for the tide gameplay ?

For me it often comes down to
solid gameplay + IP I love = great game

And that’s DT in essence for me - it’s a solid action game that works well (in mission). But if it weren’t for the 40k setting I would have moved on looong ago.

As I never was so into WH fantasy as I’m into 40k I barely ever played Vermintide - and only at all because unlike darktide it would run on my steam deck with crappy internet due to SP.

My personal perfect game would be the lovechild of ready or not and darktide. Realistic slow tactical shooter gameplay combining immersive single player with great coop experience but set in 40k with DT level of atmosphere anddesign. I know that game will never exist - and so I’ll sprodaically fire up DT for that 40k fix.

[CGILantern]

@Heretical_Cactus

I’m fully here for the tide’s melee aspect

Then why swiched from VT2 ? what i heard about it its more refined Tide experience…

[Heretical_Cactus]

It isn’t, really the surrounding system are better (Outside of mission and all) but the melee combat is much nicer. And the armour system is great, and I still play VT2, less often than before but I play both games.

The only thing that I would miss in DT would certain weapons and more complex weapon loops (à la halberd)

[Ol_Jakal]

the central element of the -tide games is the everyman heros trying to save the city with the resources they have available, in spite of not being “the big damn heroes”. and honestly it sounds like you got into the game expecting to grow into the big damn heroes.

[AlphaOmegaMan]

I don’t know what that means.

[Heretical_Cactus]

Same.

If i was to define what a -tide game is, this would be what I would end up with:

Tide games are PvE focused games who are a subsection of the Horde gauntlets genre (Defined initially by L4D) where the balance of the game is hinged on melee combat (, with ranged combats still being present).

That way you exclude normal hordes games/modes (GoW’s Horde; CoD’s Zombie; KF1-2-3); Hordes gauntlets-missions (L4D1-2; B4B; PD1-2-3; Deathwing)

[Shaamaan]

That’s definitely the case for me.

I got Vermintide 1 and 2 during some give-aways… tried and didn’t like either very much. The setting just didn’t grip me at all, while the gameplay seemed like any other co-op (one doesn’t delve too deep into mechanics at early levels) with grindy leveling. I’m not a huge “base” Warhammer fan either. Oh, and I think when I initially tried Vermintide 1 the game just flat out didn’t work for me and threw some cryptic error with nothing but a GUID…

W40k, on the other hand? Well I really like this setting. The memes online, some of the stories I see / read. I loved the Dawn Of War game (first one). So Darktide, with its proper rendition of the W40k universe just made playing the same “tide” co-op mechanics that much better. Even the enemies - I much prefer the human enemies in Darktide to the vermin enemies in 2 other “tide” games.

So yes - ultimately I got Darktide for the setting, not the mechanics. And I enjoy the mechanics only because of the setting. I suppose the emphasis on melee combat is a big part of the W40k lore too, so the fact that it “fits” into the gameplay seamlessly is just a boon.