Burblespue Halescourge thoughts

Burblespue Halescourge

Boss design - Poor design, its basically copy of regular leech/sorcerer, who are in turn the worst designed enemy and with their teleports you cant even get proper look on them. So you take the cheapest enemy and make boss from it, not good.

Make him look more glorious, some mouths on his chest, those thingies with skulls on his shoulder, make his staff and body glow more and make flies/gas around his body.

Arena - (people who make games dont play games - anon) You get caster boss who does nothing and you are only supposed to dodge its spell. First problem why there is no cover. Second problem with the arena, why there are unreachable places for players where the boss can hide and why can he leave the arena.

Make the arena bigger, big empty square, surrounded by several buildings you can enter and move to higher ground. Add cover, some pillars and carts.

Abilities - One cloud that does basically nothing, I believe most people dont even know it exists. And one super imba undodgable AoE that simply hits you if you are not lucky enough for him to teleport with his back to you.

If the arena was bigger players could position better, spells could be much stronger because now you have where to hide, so if you get hit its fully your fault. Add cover, thats basic thing against caster boss, be it pillars, overturned carts or different floors in buildings. Give him more abilities, instead of sending small groups of enemies, he could revive some adds he has in the arena, rothelms, stormvermins. When you add cover he could summon pools of something to counter that cover, so you have to react and move to different place or choose between direct hit or DoT from puddle. (All things are “How to make boss 101”)

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oh good golly.

the boss design is one of the best imo. players learn they have to avoid dmg (OMG) protect your ranged classes (OMG) and save health supplies when they really need it. boss damage is dodgeable, and the only other thing to worry about is adds. if you wanted every boss to just sit there and let you hack away… that would be bad design, it’s boring.

a lot of people complain about that cloud. what is this imba undodgable aoe that simply hits you? he has only 2 abilities that i know of - three bile ghosts, and whirlwind.

you know he teleports elsewhere, so be quick to reposition and if he is targetting u, get out of range and side dodge.

basically, you are saying that the boss is too hard. i’m saying, learn what makes him tick, and he is easy.

if the arena was any bigger, melee would have more trouble closing the distance to him, and pillars would just trivialise the fight.

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Hes pretty much regular sorcerer, just locked into room.

That was exaggeration its not that imba.

And I am not saying he is too hard, I am saying exact opposite, its no challenge, to this day I have no idea if there is any tactic on him as we usually just jump in unload ranged ammunition before he even makes first teleport and then continue to the bridge.

I proposed only stuff here that would make him more boss rather than just glorified regular enemy.

i’ve met many groups who were extremely scared of him and say they have never cleared him. there are other threads that ask what strategies to use against him - means he’s not a trivial bossfight for many people.

it’s great that he has no challenge to you but i assure you, for many other people less skilled and unlucky to have newer party members, not everyone feels the same way.

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This is also reason why I am proposing these changes, they are having trouble with him because he isnt boss. Its as if you were locked inside room and blightstormer was casting storm inside while he was on opposite side of map.

If you read why people have problem with him its because of his bad design. I said it as a joke that those ghosts are imba but they are, people are too slow to dodge them, often dont see where he will aim it, dont have any way how to protect against it, that cloud has absolutely no indication.

Turn him more into boss, with visible “phases” and encounter progress like some 30minute nonsense from WoW. And if you do this you can pump up the difficulty 50 times up and it will still be manageable because you have way how to do it.

I did second post about bosses, they should be more like badass miniboss that you fight anywhere in the map instead of locked target dummy.

“Less skilled”, this means it’s just a dps-meter. That’s not a good design choice at all. If you have not the neccessary power level this fight is unbeatable. I would change some mechanics. Maybe make the bile ghosts destroyable, or blockable by a shield bearer, holding them off for his team. These things have hitboxes like trucks and hit as such.

Some reliable cover could also work (maybe even temporary cover, so that you have to reposition yourself behind it every time it appears, before the next boss attack comes), because you are getting swarmed nonstop asnyways aswell. This should’t be too easy.

The whole bossfight is uninspirated and boring. Some warp blastwaves you have to jump over instead of the ghosts, or the mechanics i just recommended would change this boss at least to a beatable one for teams lacking the right amount of dps. In my experience, the only classes shining there are the ones with wide dodges (because they are able to evade the oncoming schoolbus A LOT easier).

This boss has to be changed in my opinion.

I’m close to quitting the mission the moment i get this map with randoms/in quick play, because the chances of failure and wasting time are exorbitantly high at the moment. It’s such a shame, because i love everything about it, except that bossfight. I’d rather play Supply and Demand on Cata all day long instead.

Edit: Correction

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Supply and Demand on cata was fine. Wheat and Chaff cata with the old SV spawn rate was insane. Fighting 80+ SV in a short map like that was crazy.

I know. That was pretty much my point. :wink: And i know. That was insane!

I wonder why Halescourge seems to be the only enemy ingame that you can’t stagger. You can Stagger Stormfiends, Trolls, Rakogris, Chaos Warriors, Champions and Rasknitt… but not that fat slob Halescourge?

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no. definitely not my meaning at all. “less-skilled” for this fight are: not protecting your ranged units, not attempting to dodge the bileghosts, not understanding when the good and safe times to pound the boss are (heavy striking from underneath when he’s on 2 story for melee units), not getting to the sides when he may cast his whirldwind etc.

sure, dps can cut down the boss fight considerably, just like how beta kruber could 1 shot the boss. does it make for more skilled players? no friggin way.

There is no reliable way to dodge Bileghosts. They often even penetrate cover. Hacking the boss through solid ground seems a little… off.

Yes, there are some mechanics you can try to play around with (if you can dodge far enough, especially). But it’s a dps-meter nevertheless - Not enough damage = You will get overrun, chipped down or bile-ghosted to hell.

I don’t think the boss is that hard. But most people do tend to die to him. There are easy places where you can hold up (done this solo on champion) and fend off the minions, then go for the revive to the teammates who died over and over again. Unfortunately on my last run at around 10% I was downed doing this. Do I get a revive? Nope, they run around at random trying to out DPS the boss, not clearing adds, not combat reviving. Once I respawned as a body on the ground to be revived they ignored that too and everyone died at around 3%. What I am saying is, I personally do not find the boss that hard, it is just people who do not understand it nor have the ability to adapt to it. You can avoid most bile blobs, some will hit you no doubt but they won’t kill you. Adds are the real killers. You should in an ideal situation not get damaged by adds. I suggest you go play some legend difficulty and practice on that, there you’ll notice if you perform poorly unlike champion where you can just LMB your way though most things.

Try out the little “hole” under the boss where he first spawns. That’s a good place to hide. Also notice that once he teleports up again he will continue to shoot some shadow balls on people, be sure to interrupt him with damage. Last but not least, practice practice practice. I’ve noticed that a lot of people will skip certain maps. They all just suicide in the beginning. Because that’s how you learn and overcome. I like to say in FPS games when people complain about bad maps “there are no bad maps, only bad players”. No this is not a “git gud” response, but I do think people should try a bit harder and not give up so easily. Loads of people have completed this map. Why can’t you and others? Is it really the map/boss?

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand /rant.

The thing is: I can get him down with my friends (Only the ones having high enough power levels (!!!)). But randoms tend to die on him, which makes this map in quickmatch rotation a big waste of time.

And - The uninspirated boss mechanics don’t become any better all of a sudden, just because he is beatable. That’s not the point, really.

So if he is beatable, what is the point of nerfing/reworking him? Everything is subjective, what you see as fun or hard others won’t. Just because randoms fail on him more often than not is also not grounds for nerfs/reworking. Like in the beta the three missions were going so so at first, eventually everyone mastered those missions and I don’t think I ever saw a run that didn’t have all the loot towards the end of the beta. Same will happen here. I still notice that the three missions in the beta feels like recruit, while others feel harder because people are not used to the maps.

Strategies need reliable mechanics. That’s not the case here. Sometimes Bile Ghosts penetrate cover, sometimes they wont. Sometimes he’s just aiming at 1 or 2 allies, sometimes he aims at everyone at once. And again. If you don’t have enough damage you die, there is no wiggle room. Which makes this fight a dps-meter. I don’t know how often i have to explain this. Fair mechanics would allow skilled players with low power levels to overcome him anyways, if they have the right knowlede beforehand and imho that is NOT the case here.

I am sure they could, but can’t speak for them since I am not low power level. Also my experience is that it is not a “DPS meter”, the boss does no special things as time goes on. It is just that with any game, the longer you stay in the fight, the higher the risk of dying. As simple as that. That’s why raid bosses are 10 minutes long, that’s the hard part. Doing each mechanic flawlessly time and time again, minute after minute. Also I can’t say anything about bile penetrating cover since I have not seen that. I try and avoid it all together by dodging. But I have seen it hit a wooden pillar. The mechanics are there, the does blob attack, storm in the middle, small shadow orbs ontop, spawns adds etc etc. You just have to deal with each mechanic. Kill adds, attack him when he is shooting black blobs, avoid the snott blobs, don’t stand in mid when he does green could etc. Each mechanic has a counter, you just haven’t found them yet.

Good to know that you seem to know, what i know about his mechanics. Apart from that still not being the point. Maybe you have that avatar for a reason. I have nothing more to add here. My point stands. Have a nice day.

Actually when he teleports to the upper floor its the best moment for melee classes to deal quite some damage as you can hit him through the floor.

This is entirely wrong. Even if he teleports on top of you, there is just enough time to run directly away from him and side Dodge between the bile. If he doesn’t teleport on top of you, you can easily create enough distance to casually strafe into the gaps between them, no dodge required.

His multi target attacks are also ONLY cast immediately after teleporting down from the second floor, and they both have the same exact counter: move to the edges of the room.

It is more than possible to avoid burblespue’s abilities in their entirety over the course of the whole fight.

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He has a defeatists mentality, if he can’t do it, it must be broken, no counter, impossible. Better to give up rather than learn, adapt. Or in this case, ask/wait for nerfs.

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