First things first, bosswalls are just a really bad idea. Speedrunners will speedrun, by starting a new map, survivors will suffer if they cant solo the masses the game throws at them.
In my case my teammates died to a spawn and a chaos horde, on Halscourge, at the last great open area, their bodies were at the garanteed ammo box before the boss. Guess where was the wall?
I had to solo the boss, the hordes, the CWs I pulled while I tried to rescue my team, specials, just to see that its impossible because of the placement of the wall. The other 3 guys had the opportunity to watch a 10 min clutch.(And one tome fell off the map ofc).
The other place I had this issue is Against the grain, just at the wall with the garanteed ammo box before the first grim area. Same scenario, except some dudes were impatient and left…
Please FS just remove the boss walls. Or at least fix the respawn locations.
how many errors should a team be able to come back from at some point in some cases is it really soo unfair to have 3 players going down force you to solo a boss or suffer defeat?
and why does your team keep dieng on you at such inoportune times , with 500 hours in legend and champ pug running i doubt ive seen this happen 3 times , and if any of thse ended in a defeat i kind of think we deserved it.
The rest of the team dieing usually caused by the lack of personal skill/lack of knowledge about the bosses, elites/ techniques/ bad positioning/ or simply bad luck. In my 500 hours on champ and legends, clutch situations happened quite often to me, especially with pugs. In most cases they just box themselves in, hindering their own survivability.
So if it´s the fault of the players… why everyone have got a problem with the boss wall? If the players fail, they deserve a wipe. I take my loss too, if i failed in some cases., but a bosswall didn´t caused that loss / fail… never…
The problem is the implementation. If their goal is to stop speedrunners with the wall, it wont work, bc they will just start a new game. But if most of the party wipes, bc they got a boss at the worst possible location, and one player can struggle him/herself to reach and revive his/her allies, it shouldnt be denied by this stupid mechanic. Thats why I said in the first comment, that they should at least fix the respawn points, if they leave the walls as it is.
I think the implemention is quite fine overall and no new respawn location is needed, but they should fix some end points at some maps. (like your example)
Lord maps should work like “Empire in flames”. If you finished the event and a boss appears, you can still run to the end. The same should work, if the boss spawns directly in front of the lord - arena. You´ve to fight the lord, whatever happens before. So these maps are already “denied” for speedrunners.
Empire in Flames could need a wall after the event. I still think it´s the easiest map and the capability to outrun the boss at the end, doesn´t make this better.
It wasn´t planned at the begin was it? (until ppl complain, remember Spinemanglr)
The lords (normal grp) are much harder, than normal bosses + horde. You are forced to fight in a close arena, with special ablities, tons of damage from the bosses and some creeps / SV / CW.
If you´ve to fight a boss, you got mostly a wide area to kite. With some map-experience you could even force horde/boss spawns. Skittergate is the best example. Just wait for the 1st horde at the 1st grim. Then go on to force the 50/50 boss. That´s just a matter of luck, but the boss is normally alone, if you forced the 1st horde before.
im not sure whats unclear. if a teams dieing and the remaining cant deal with the situation its defeat, why does there need to be the ability to infinitely run away and get more attempts
Well it was fixed and not tweaked but as far as I remember he was the only lord doing this making him especially hard to fight.
I don’t know what Fatshark is thinking but the solution they came up with and expanded upon doesn’t make the most players happy.
Yes, but if you have like 4 hp, and the ablity to either solo a boss and everything that comes at you in 10-15 minutes with it, or kite stuff until you can ress someone in 2 minutes, which one would you choose? And which one would the other 3 guys choose? 2min, or 15 min clutch movie/afking?
really? maybe you’re lucky to have such awesome pug players. in my runs there seems to always be one guy that runs ahead, pulls everything, dies, and we’re stuck 3 manning
obviously the 2 min , but then if were talking about choice 100% win rates that always drop gear we want please. were not talking about choice were talking about a gameplay balance mechanic.
and im saying , 3 people died , you lost all bar a sliver of health and you have met a boss then its the coup de grace . you already had all your chances 3 people died your almost dead, you needed to avoid that all happening to be in a state to beat the boss , you didnt so you lose , thats how it should be. just my opinion of course.
If a single player manages to hold on, they deserve the clutch, especially on public games (which the game incentivizes, mind you), where you have little control over who you play with. It is all a matter of perspective. Characters like HM, BW and even Slayer have talents specifically designed towards clutches. It makes their already questionable viability even more so.
Other than that, I don’t see why the “boss door” should be impleneted as a punishment for “bad play” and to “guarantee a wipe”. Nothing points towards, so don’t pretend that this is why they are in the game. They could be very easily and reasonably put into the game while still not denying clutches. I don’t see how these things have to coincide with each other.
If he is able to kill the whole map solo yeah. But this is about “running and ressurecting”.
I won´t see it as a punishment. It is a gamedesign, like the lords or events overall. “Kill me, if you want to go on”. That´s a pretty simple design, but it appears in nearly every game with PVE - content.
So would be an anvil dropping on you out of nowhere. The question is not if this is a design choice, but if it is one that is benefitial or detrimental. If the goal is to stop speedrunners, it could be implemented without removing the clutch ability, which, again, is deliberately put into the design of certain carreers. It is simply inconsistent.
Why? That seems unnecessarily elitist and harsh. After all, isn’t this a team game? Shouldn’t the ability to clutch and rescue your team mates be rewarded rather than made impossible? “Deserving” something by soloing in a co-op game seems… counter-intuitive, to say the least.
Nobody is disputing that. The argument made is not necessarily that the game needs to “force” boss kills, but a.) the soft coercion that it made the game harder if you didn’t kill the boss is enough and I’d rather see some kind of more fluent mechanic rather than a rather blunt wall put in your face. and b.) this has nothing to do with the inability to rescue people. If anything, it is actually detrimental towards that.
It does, however, come of that way that you kinda want to “school” people who fail and punish them for “bad” play more than it is necessary. I too hardly wipe on bosses anymore and I can’t say I have had a situation arise where the boss wall was truly a hurdle. But I got news: Players like us who pumped hundreds of hours into the game, with the majority played on Legend, are not the standard.
Of course, failure should have consequences. The boss doors making it impossible to res, however, is not only a very blunt, unimaginative way to combat the situation, but it also means that players behind the wall get to watch others have all the fun and excitment while they know they cannot do anything. We are not exclusively talking about whole party wipes. It is simply very annoying for single players if their team gets to have an exciting boss fight while they are FORCED to watch.
Simply make boss doors at places so they are always behind a spawn and if someone dies, they spawn in front. Problem solved.
