Bounty hunter’s ult is imo one of the most satisfying ults to use in the game. I also find it amongst the weakest.
The base version struggles to down chaos warriors, its boss damage is nothing to write home about and it can be completely negated by a shieldvermin.
Since rifles can now penetrate shields when aiming I think it would be a fair adjustment to also let the BH ult ignore shields.
To not trivialize Storm patrols, maybe this replaces the spreadshot trait and then also adds more knockback/stun to those AI that are hit to provide a choice in style. a choice from being able to use the base shot more often, have two shots in one for high damage on single/few targets, or a more powerful shot.
Up close with some incestment it 1-shot CWs even on legend without using double-shotted. But anyway, yes, it totally should go through shield of 1 shieldvermin, penetrate him and them hit another Stormvermin, but now for less damage than if it penetrated normal stormvermin first. So a shot is not blocked, byt it can no longer deliverr its full potential to otther targets.
I am aware that it can 1-shot CW up close, but it is far from a garuanteed kill. Your passive crit talent has to be up. You need to be close range and I believe some of the shotgun pellets are needed in order to finish the job.
Even when its not a 1-shot it still takes down 95% of CW health, allowing you to finish it in one blow of your melee.
It just seems to me this ult is objectively worse than others (aside from the satisfying sound). WS ult has autoaim, can sometimes kill up to 3 stormvermin and can give you ammo back on activation.
Pyromancer ult is kind of a copy of WS ult, and so equally useful.
Shade ult is just several orders of magnitude above bouty hunters ‘‘situational shot of satisfaction’’.
Even the level 25 talents for his ult are not really upgrades or gamechangers. I pretty much always take 30% cooldown reduction because I want both the powerfull shot and shotgun blast, because if I choose one or the other it just diminishes its versatility. So the way I see it the double shotgun or double shot talents are actually downgrades.
I agree it deserves a slight buff. Of course one needs crit to 1-shot CW and to fire at the torso (not the head, cause pellets will miss) at relatively short range, but shootng CW up close is IMO even more fun 
I am not talking about the fun-factor. (That is a straight 10/10) The sound is satisfying and the animation is like ‘‘I will kindly propell some lead projectiles in your general direction, please be gone when the cloud of smoke dissipates my good sir!’’
The ult is just underwhelming. If you run the ‘‘repeater right-click CW killer’’ build then you can fire a more powerful shot every 10 seconds that can more consistently kill CW.
To be honest I still think it would be balanced if victor just pulls out 3 handguns in quick succesion (brace of pistols style) and fires them at the target.
Yeah no arguments here. It’s just underwhelming compared to what the other ranged class ults can do. I’d say generally buff the penetration a bit and make it pierce shields.
Also yeah fix those lvl 25 talents. They’re mostly sidegrades which is pretty silly when pretty much every other class gets outright buffs to their Ult. Make double shot still shoot the base buckshot as well, and make buckshot keep the single pen shot while making the shotgun shoot more bullets in a wider spread. Those are just boring but functional changes. They could do heaps with this
I agree with the shield penetration.
I also strongly feel they should nerf the smoke so that it isn’t 100% blinding.
I actually kind of like the smoke, but it would indeed be nice if rats can just quickly stab you before the smoke clears.
i agree the ult does feel very weak and should definitely be buffed or do something vs a shield target at least one its pretty sad this is a skill shot ult and takes more time you actually have to aim compared to the others that home in on their targets and can just be shot right off the bat still one shoting chaos warriors with ease as keriliian and wizard.
it would be really nice if they would just make his ult also do an automatic crit without it absorbing your darn blessed shots its so annoying/ otherwise BH needs a big buff on his ult to do the most damage in the game since its consuming blessed shots its really unfair for how weak it hits and it consumes BH blessed shot.
Yes, letting BH ult reset the crit cooldown after use would be a nice change.
Perhaps changing one of the lvl25 talent to a one similar to battle wizard’s that allows you to get off several shots within 5 seconds.
While WS ult does regen ammo and can with a crit kill 3 stormvermin its worth noting that when it does not crit it usually only kills 1 and barely deals any damage to chaos warriors,and this is when the arrows dont fly in a completely random direction ignoring the target.
Its unreliable to the extreme.
Bounty saltz? Can near instakill a chaos warrior very reliably , he can stagger bosses and it doesnt randomly miss the intended targets.
The thing is that BH ult is worse than a RMB volley of the repeater pistol. Using the ult interferes with the ult cooldown rythm.
And yes, I agree that WS ult is a bit unreliable at times, but its upsides far outweigh the downsides. You can just use it as a panic button to quickly clear a few enemies. You can use it to kill stormers or other special that are out of reach.
BH ult takes a split second longer to aim in which you can be hit by the (extremely annoying) running attack of slaverats.
True, now that handgun penetrates shields it makes bounty hunter ult super pistol look like a pea shooter. Should at least penetrate 2 shielded storm vermin to be worth it.
While it does indeed have the merit of being able to quickly clear a smaller amount of lesser enemies even if not critting the downside is that the amount is truly small, killing 4-7 enemies quickly might just not help at all if you are being charged by 20-30.
And the “snipestormers” is probably a bug that is going to get fixed by the next patch, thing i saw a post about it somewhere, they didnt use to do this before.
Meanwhile Bounty hunter can kill a huge group with 100% certainty if they cluster as they run up to him, as many do, he has the same “standard” range as WS and in addition his certain crit+extra reload speed are incredibly powerful.
As a ranged character he is truly heads and shoulders above her, the only thing i think she does much better is general melee thanks to the regeneration and high average speed of her weapons, WS talents are also more in general compared to BH who has nearly everything centered around his passive, reload speed or his ult.
If BH is what we´d consider a marksman then WS is a …ranger? Well not a park keeper but more like the Lord of the Rings edition one.
Waystalker has a lot better ammo sustain and can tuely spam arrows at everything. Bh either is v. weak in general (without hunter) or has no ammo sustain (with hunter).
Waystalker has the best 2h weapons in game at her disposal - 2h sword is extremly effective, same goes for glaive and spear. So for ranged I’d take waystalker, for melee I’d take waystalker.
Wait wait wait wait what?
I followed you up until the 2 handed weapon selection…what about 2 handed sword being good??
That weapon feels like crap O_O
And what weak in general? saltz can just pick himself some headshot trait for his ranged weapon then he can shoot as freely as kerillian no? Or he can grab the ammo on crit then along with the talent that refreshes his passive on melee kills, infinite ammo in either case pretty much, at least that is what it was when i played him…
The only waystalker build that shoots nonstop is the shortbow, both longbow and hagbane has to be mindful of ammo which is generally not very noticeable if you are able to run into melee to avoid any downtime.
Saltz kills chaos warriors with his F, he kills anything smaller than a chaos warrior with his passive and with some light melee he can constantly bring up his passive as much as he likes and just keep killing anything even slightly bothersome instantly.
Stormvermin? Berserkers? Big axe guy(rothelm?) Specials? 1 hit 1 kill, meanwhile WS cant even kill a monk with a longbow headshot, and it takes…3 to 5 bodyshots to kill one.
Takes 3 aimed bodyshots to kill a stormvermin, 3 for a rothelm , multiple for each special.
Meanwhile saltz kills any of these in 1 hit.
And you´re telling me he isnt superior when compared as a ranged character? …The only area i think he doesnt do well in generally is horde clearing but WS only does with hagbane which quickly runs out of ammo with just two waves but as a sniper and anti elite BH is probably the best class in the game.
Man, seriously?
It has this pin-point accurate push-stab that deals tremendous AP damage and you can keep it indefinitely on hold, has great mobility, good cleave and lets you just mow through infantry. Oh and push-stab is also great and has higher crit chance to boot.
The only thing it doesn’t thrash are the bosses, but guess what - I just shoot them with longbow for good and safe damage.
So I absolutely love it.
? saltz can just pick himself some headshot trait for his ranged weapon then he can shoot as freely as kerillian no
No. Unless you land headshots all the time, and even then every miss means -1 ammo you are not likely to get back, and HS that you land is just 0 ammo lost/gained unless you get 2 during a horde, and for such crap ammo sustain you’re losing +25% power from hunter. IMO not worth it.
The only way he truely gets ammo sustain is with scrounger indeed. And that’s fun, but it limits his overal output.
Kerilian with longbow can just go hunter/barrage and still have this awesome ammo regen - and she can also get ammo on ult if one really likes to spam.
Keris ult can mow down a few berserkers at a time too, but yeah, I like BH’s better, but once again - she can just shoot as much as she wants, each longbow arrow having good damage and cleave and up her damage with traits. Saltz can never have both. Yes, he can hit harder with single shots, but that’s it. He absolutely can’t match Keri’s overal output.
Kerilian doesn’t win in 1 shot vs 1 shot competition. But she absolutely wins in a longer timeframe. Oh and she can self-heal herself back to 50%, just in case. And gets HP on cleave, which synergizes with 2h sword so damn GOOD.
EDIT: the thing is, I can’t, for the love of Sigmar, be more effective than other classes as BH, I’m simply “on par” in good case scenario. As Kerilian? I’ve never played this class (maybe when I was at below 100 hours I made a few veteran runs?), on my 2nd attempt decided to go legend and finished a run with really good results.
Elf’s 2h sword is arguably OP, especially on waystalker with her bonus headshot damage. A single charged head stab will down a stormvermin with minimal (if any) item stat investment, you can hold the charge forever, the stab is perfectly accurate AND it has a lunge when you release it. On top of that, the horde clear is up there with the glaive. Better even, if you use swift slaying and open up with a pushstab which basically has a guaranteed crit.
I don’t even use my ranged when I’m using 2h sword on WS. The sword just does everything better.
The stab is indeed very accurate but my problem is that headshot hitboxes are often not very reliable, although mainly on chaos warriors…which may or may not be a problem but i like my stuff to be as reliable as possible.
But having just tested the 2hand sword just now after a long time i found that it was pretty great on skaven hordes as well as stormvermin however i didnt like it much when dealing with berserkers, rotblood hordes or shields, felt very awkward to me with all those.
But many of the problems i had with it when i tested it thoroughly some time after the game first launched have been fixed and it is much much better, even discounting all the bugs it has notably been buffed and gotten improvements to how it works.
But i still feel that its nowhere near the spear or glaive, both those are monstrously powerful against nearly everything when one gets the idea down…although glaive is somewhat slow making it risky when mobility is needed.
And my problem with keri´s ult is probably that it relies on crit to ever be effective, without a crit it does…well one stormvermins worth of damage which might be like 2 monks although i recall times when it only kills one…might be due to shots just randomly flying off though.
But as far as one being or par with another is concerned i am often beaten by the BH´s on legend when it comes to ranged, they mow down heaps more specials and elites than i do just because they can 1hit them with a hipfired bodyshot before i can even take aim properly, but i tend to pull ahead by miles in melee.
So even if i end up behind in 100 ranged kills and 20 elites&specials i might be ahead 200 kills in melee which usually ends up putting me even or ahead, especially since i shoot less which lowers the need for ammo letting me use the CDR talent for F which in turn fuels my killcount and damage in general…while also giving me constant reminders to how unreliable it can be 