The clicking frantically 24/7 cookie clicker or the automated cookie universe and demonic grandmas cookie clicker?
I’m not sure. With these people they want to feel like they are actually doing anything when just activating Castigator Stance and left clicking deletes everything on screen without risk.
But I wouldn’t put it past them that they would prefer a “nuke the whole map instantly” button.
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Funnily enough, from what I’ve seen, it’s the people who complains about the no-nerf stance who almost immediately slippery-slopes or logical-conclusions their way to the “nuke the whole map instantly” button point. I’m not a no-nerfer, just saying it’s not a particularly good argument against that stance because it’s so hyperbolic it undermines and destroys any nuance in the discussion.
I personally think that constant, non-stop hi-intensity is bad for the game. These types of games should have a flow, lulls at times to further intensify the peaks, otherwise the constant intensity just inures you to the sensation. The L4D director did a good job of that, the 'tide games only really had predictable timers and trigger points and their idea of difficulty is sponging stats and throwing more at you relentlessly.
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L4D is only harder in realism mode and in pvp, most people tend to forget that. I’ve finished all campaigns on expert in both L4D1 and 2 back when they first released, not only gameplay is much simpler than DT but you also have checkpoints at the beginning of each chapter.
There are only a few L4D maps that are harder than Darktide (usually finales of each campaign).
The problem with the game is not player power, but rather lack of different mission types which challenge players in different ways, which would require different build and loadouts… All modifiers in DT aside from “ranged only/melee only Maelstorm” lack depth.
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What is very different in V1,2 and L4D is pacing and how those games are killing you.
In both these cases 1 mob can deal a signifficant ammount of damage, and your common HP refill is temporary - pills, thp in V2, poor HP regen on kills in V1. So it was more slowpaced, tactical, stressed, punishment for mistakes was much higher, including fighting regular mobs and taking their basic attacks.
But the density wasn’t that high so wipes wasn’t chaotic aswell, atleast it’s not how i remember things. It was that you have less and less resources with each mistake you make. “The last push before the safe point” feeling and survival element was there.
But in DT your typical wipe is - everything is fine, everything is fine, golden toughness flows, boom all are dead. Or 3/4 atleast.
It’s almost never all 3-4 players are running on low hp, low ammo, no supplies for a long time. There is no prolonged stress.
In V2 characters became stronger and to counterbalance it FS added new enemies aswell, the whole new faction - norsca.
What they did with DT is like it’s started as V1 (not literally, but in terms of player power vs enemies’) and then they transformed it into V2. But nothing for the enemies and their mechanics were added, except for density.
Like if you have such strong and forgiving mechanic as toughness, then you need a mob, that can stop or reduce its regeneration/reffil with debuffs or area effects.
If you have strong dot weapons, you need a healer enemy that can counter dot damage and save mobs occasionally to make things harder.
Etc.
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Honestly, I actually want to play higher difficulties right now. As opposed to when I last played, when havoc just came out, and so much of the game was behind a gilded cage because of the sheer level of crap you had to do just to be able to survive above damnation. Because the hyper-focus hyper-fixation gameplay required to really do those higher difficulties was just way too much effort for what can at best be described as not very rewarding gameplay.
Arbites has allowed me to enjoy those difficulties, and I enjoy playing with a team of both arbites and not.
I just hope they eventually rework Psyker, Veteran, and Zealot to bring them up to the same general talent choices, playstyle freedom, and general survival that Ogryn and especially Arbites have, because the way arbites is structured lets me actually enjoy the harder difficulties.
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but FS shouldn’t bring other class up to current Arbites level. That’s just pure powercreep.
It’s not even that bad after they nerf a few nodes like castor stance, at some point in vermintide legend was easy for a small % of the playerbase so they added cataclysm, add auric +1 or harder content and it’s a non issue…
then we can rework the bad vet skill tree without people crying immediately about power creep, I hope devs realize it’s not a choice you can do both
The player has such powerful weapons and skills that can take care of pack of crushers without breaking a sweat.
Challenge would be interesting if you had to choose to be a horde clearer, a special sniper, a boss killer or an armor destroyer.
As it is, you can do all of the above with the exact same weapon.
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Yes V2 was (is?) a resource management game and health is your primary resource.
I went into Darktide the same way and when I started playing Havoc people were asking why I was rushing. I thought it was akin to endless hordes in V2. You had to be constantly moving forward or you’d run out of resources.
That’s not the case in DT as you describe. Toughness is very easy to come by. Gold toughness makes you able to tank hits that would normally kill you. Arbiter C-Stance is even more ridiculous.
This is indeed the kind of things that would mix things up. Take the occultist skin, make him a healer. Suddenly you have a more interesting dynamic. Do I take my chance to outDPS the heals or do I prioritize the healer and potentially take damage?
Havoc introduced this in a way, but in the worst way possible, where Bullwarks can be healers and anyone who has some sort of color blindness can’t tell if it’s glowing yellow, orange or green.
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The moment FS adds a Auric+1, everyone will take their most OP stuff into that game mode and then demand the other weapons and skills to be brought up to the same bar. How can you not see that this a vicious cycle?
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this is literally what happened with havoc.
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I thought Terminus Warrant simply sucked, because I was never seeing any benefit to mixing ranged and melee. I finally realized the problem was my melee weapon, the Arbites Shock Maul. I was seeing little benefit to switching to ranged simply because my melee weapon can do everything quickly and easily, Keystone or no Keystone.
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I don’t see it, I play auric only with randoms and average player is still really bad at this game just saying, even current auric is hard for your average player
sure if you play with 3-4 arbites it’s too easy atm.. they have way too much stagger I would try to nerf that first, then nerf mk8 shotgun and a few nodes are overtuned, start with that and we’ll see
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The funniest part is Auric+1 already exists, they added Hi-int auric this patch.
The cycle has already started, how long until we get Havoc 50?
We have insanely op stuff in the game for every class and people in droves are still asking for buffs and not wanting ANY nerfs.
When is the last time anything was meaningfully nerfed?
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That’s the problem. Why are average, casual players in Auric?
They jump into difficulties they can’t handle, then demand buffs.
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If high difficulty is uncomfortable for you then just lower difficulty.
Difficulty is not a progression, It’s there to let you choose the right challenge for yourself. in this game at least, after you unlocked it.
Idk why it’s so hard to understand.
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I mean you can rework vet skill tree and nerf arbites at the same time no ? this is binary thinking, you are against adding harder content/auric +1 but that would solve your problems if classic auric is too easy, I don’t get it
I’m not against nerfing arbites to be clear, but they should keep the dog build viable I only bought arbite for the dog, that’s the uniqueness of the class if you nerf everything it’s pointless
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There are game difficulty levels which cater to casual players. No one tells them to jump into high level Havoc?
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Pretty sure everyone agree with that, just not the ‘buff everyone to current Ogryn and Arbite level’ one
Yes, they should, but if you’re talking about the current one then it’s just broken, not viable. Infinite AoE cleave that apply full stack bleed which is buffed by 100+% dmg talents is not healthy in anyway.
The uniqueness of classes is pointless if a dog overshadow everyone, or one of the class for that matter.
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I’ll never understand the “Zealot has 1 really good build so he’s not as bad” but then say Vet doesn’t even come close
Vet HAS that build as well, people just either ignore it or don’t know about it
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