I wish we could have this problem on DT…
WE NEED MORE FULL-SIZE MAPS…PLEEEEEEASE!?
3 new maps in a new totally different biome
2 new maps in glorianna biome
1 new map in hourglass biome
At this point I don’t care about much else. I am bored stiff of all the current maps.
if you released all modifiers into permanent rotation then I think this would alleviate the boredom but FS seems to be allergic to variety.
Don’t need any new maps just need to make them all available. I want to play Havoc on the new trenches mission PLEASE.
I want to see an update that hard focuses on fixing the game up over adding anything. It needs it.
Most of us can navigate the entire catalogue of missions with our eyes closed.
We absolutely need more maps.
It’s the boredom and repetition of the maps that makes everyone nitpick the game at a cellular level IMO.
Adding the modifiers into rotation would obviously help this a fair bit but they won’t do that for some reason, so we need new maps and really, really need a new biome that isn’t grey/brown.
Edit: Just to be clear I would love more maps in this game and I would never suggest that more maps are not required in this game. That should 100% be in the works and I don’t mean to imply that FS shouldn’t be working on more maps.
To be fair darktide maps are WAY more complicated to make. Honestly I think that’s why no man’s land is the way it is, big flat spaces with scattered buildings and a open skybox, much more similar to VT2 maps.
VT2 maps are like a valley with some trees, or a field with some fences, and then ocasionally a few fairly simple buildings around or like one fortress. There are a few complicated levels but like all of chaos wastes is basically just gaint sections of valleys.
The setting of a hive city is just REALLY hard to work with and if I had to guess from my 3d modeling experience its easily 3x more time intensive then a VT2 map. (Probably a poor choice for a setting if you really think about it). But I would expect more maps like Rolling Steel, and No Man’s Land rather then whole new areas like the ones we have. (Or maybe they have spent this time working on a whole new area and well get like 3 more maps out of it. Can be optimistic!)
Their own promise was that it would be easier, cause of map block structure, cause how some maps are using the same routes and locations but we traversing them in reverse.
That’s why they should stop with Tertium maps and send un on Atoma’s moon into the jungle. Or even just put some aristocracy gardens on Tertium, etc.
Game is oversaturated with brown, grey, yellow corridors. Even the new trenches map while being still corridors is refreshing cause it’s under the open sky.
If you looked at the maps in whitebox then they probably wouldn’t look so complicated. The noisy detail of the city makes it feel more complex when really it’s quite a lot of corridors. I remember the maps being confusing as heck when I first started playing as guidance is near non-existent but also the clutter of 40k added to the confusion.
I really like the maps and their recent ones have been amazing (glorianna and the cathedral ones). The flow is excellent.
Creating a new biome is the biggest challenge but in this day and age there are near infinite model licence packs to buy assets in bulk and use. It’s not like they have to make every bit of art from scratch and already have a huge library they can pick from.
The real difficulty of maps will be any scripted sets/actions (like the end part of the cathedral). That will require a fair few devs to muck-in.
The whiteboxing and art passing should be relatively straight forward though tbh.
These things all take time but they could push quite a few out of the pipeline if using a conveyor method and passing the levels about between them as and when required.
Level building is actually really fun so I am very surprised they have been so tight with it.
I enjoyed the trench mission (that has loads of scripted bits the entire time!) but I actually still prefer glorianna and the cathedral. And I definitely prefer the glorianna biome because it feels so different from the rest. We only have 1 mission for it right now which sucks.
Yeah they are definitely saving time by reusing areas and making the game in large sections/biomes. But I think that is more or less countered by how much more complex a hive city is overal.
I agree and I would highly suspect that is the way they are going eventually. If I were to guess at the next biome they are going to add, it would be a out of the hive city wasteland map as that can reuse a lot of assets from the hourglass.
Maybe later on we might get more varied enviroments but making something like a forest on a different planet would be way more work.
We need a full elite roster before new maps tbh
That noisy detail takes a LOT of time to make and it has to essentially all be hand made. Want to make a valley? that’s some displacements and volumetric textures that you can generate pretty easily. WAY easier then placing a bunch of mechanical clutter. Granted much of that is assets that can be reused in multiple areas. But still for one example this picture alone is likely around 200+ manhours worth of just 3d modeling at a bare minimum and that is extremely generous (yes some of these are assets that can be reused/are reused from somewhere else so realistically this specific section of the map probably took less then 200 manhours but still).
Compare that to this and like do I even need to explain?
I highly doubt even like 5% of this game is from any sort of asset pack (probably some textures but I highly doubt any 3d assets) and I dont think anything can be reused from VT2 besides like some stone block textures and maybe a few gothic assets. Even then I doubt anything was reused.
Yeah the finer details take forever. Just blocking out a map like its CP_Orange takes a few hours. Making all of the finer details takes a few months never mind the texture work.
A lot less fun when its at this sort of quality level where every random corner and distant bit of the skybox needs to be filled in with professional quality assets.
Have you made 3d assets before? It takes a long time ESPECIALLY with this sort of art style and quality standard.
I meant their asset library for DT. Not VT2.
I have only played a bit of VT2 so can’t comment on it but the bits I did play had lots of ruins, caves, mines, and sewers etc so your example above doesn’t seem like a particularly honest argument.
Also every studio I have worked in uses asset packs that can be edited heavily. You think they make everything from scratch? In this day and age? Even if they did make things “in house” then it would likely all be outsourced to an art-farm anyway.
I don’t know if you’ve ever worked in a studio but things have changed a lot in the last 10-15 years.
Forever for whom and how many people? Is your basis for comparison just yourself? A lone modeller? Then yes it would take a while. But an art team would pass it around and I imagine even Designers would add assets as its so integrated these days.
Again, your argument seems to be based on your experience as a sole modeller, rather than a studio with teams and vast assets at their disposal.
I have not made much in 3D but I have added assets to levels before when I was a Designer. This was years a go so I can only imagine how advanced it is now in terms of accessibility.
People need to stop the “its so difficult because it would take me ages to make it” argument. It’s an invalid stance and means nothing in this context.
You know what would take AGES and loads of man hours? Creating a new class and all the UI, animation, VO, balancing, art, cosmetics, promo vids, QA, etc that goes with it is insane amount of work and they just did it TWICE IN A ROW!
A level is tame compared to that. So lets drop the “its too hard” narrative please.
While this is true and i aprreciate some gorgeous art, i also don’t care as someone who have a few hundreds of hours.
Also let’s be fair, how much your average player is staring at the skybox in tide games, it’s not an open world sandbox rpg you’re vibing while gathering herbs and hunt.
If something takes too long to deliver a core gameplay stuff then change your approach, no need for every map to have an overcomplicated ceiling geometry you will never interract with and will look only once at sedition run.
As a customer i don’t care much how it’s hard for you, i’m sorry, i care how it’s fun for me.
SM2 has some great hive backgrounds and the difference is that it’s a background that are more often in you sight atleast, unlike ceiling.
V2 maps biomes diversity is much much wider and so it’s more fun and fresh to replay maps over and over. Is it easier to create? Cool then, less budget per map i suppose.
Darktide has a very unique style, I mean that’s just 40k in general. And all of the zones are also very unique and share few assets. I suggest you go take a free camera around them and just take a look.
Im sure they use some textures and maybe some very basic assets like a cup or whatever. But so much of this game is very specifically 40k that its just not really possible to be getting assets from outside.
Idk maybe they have a bunch of indian art slaves working on this stuff but I doubt it. Fatshark isnt a AAA studio, they are a small AA team, I fully expect them to be doing most everything in house rather then being some profit optimized conglomerate (at least not yet anyways).
Fatshark has 180 employees. Realistically that means like ~20 3d artists and maybe a few people who occasionally throw together skybox elements or something. And that team is split between darktide and vermintide 2. So its going to take them a dam long time.
You seem to not have much experience with 3d modeling. Making high quality assets takes a long time like way, way, way longer then placing said assets into a level. Just for a example just this, not the shading or anything like that, just the mesh. Is like half a work day for a experienced 3d artist (~4 hours) and that is generous. I suggest you try booting up blender (its free) and like actually seeing what it is like. Its much more complicated then you probably think.
No. Making a new level with existing assets, maybe not really sorta. The level also needs to be play tested and go through multiple quality assurance passes and what not.
But anyways for making a character this workload is split amongst multiple teams. VO people arent going to be involved with the character mesh, the animation people arent going to be involved with the texturing people and etc. So that is a much more split workload. Making a level and more over a new biome is almost entirely 3d artists/texture work.
Ill just direct you to the concept of “The mythical woman month” as well. 6 woman cannot make a baby in a month. Or as it applies here: 60 guys modeling a level are not going to get it done faster then 3 groups of 20 people making a character.
They probably are currently working on a new biome and levels for said biome. But its also probably not their only project and they really don’t have that many people. Its going to take a while.
I mean yeah but you cant skimp on this stuff or it ruins the entier vibe of the game and being in a hive city. Its the direction they chose and it unfortunately is one that takes a LOT of work. Simple and easy to do asthetics are great! I mean Ultrakill is an amazing game and its simple art style 100% makes making new levels much easier.
Yeah… Im not saying you have to like it, Im just saying how it is. Like I would love more content in this game 110% dont take this as me saying that its not worth it or something. Im just saying I get why it takes them so long for this game VS VT2, and Im sharing that.
So my opening a program I have barely used would show me what exactly? Why are you comparing that to modellers who are literally best in the field? The games industry is the cream of the crop. Stop trying to compare my inexperience with 3D to them or even your own limitations to them. I have worked around 3D modellers a hell of a lot in my 15+ years in the creative industries and you are actually not giving them enough credit at all.
You can watch blender videos where people make complex and great assets in very short time by kitbashing so orginal assets are unrecognisable.
Your example above - is 1 asset that can be used many times. Once it’s in the library its there. It could even be scaled to an enormous size for a quick distant set piece if dissected nicely.
You think every bit of every level is bespoke? Like, what? Do you not see the immense repetition in the levels? They recycle a lot.
understood, designing a completely game mode with another series of ui elements and menus that are extremely aggravating to navigate and placing them in another corner of the mourningstar with completely unique maps for another year.
Im just saying that this one asset would likely take over 4 hours for a experienced 3d modeler to make. And that is one asset out of thousands of assets that need to be made to make this one level look good. Say fatshark has 20 dedicated 3d modlers, split between two games and multiple elements of those games, you have like what 6 people at most working on this new biome (as adding new stuff to this game is going to be lower priority then making it in the first place its going to be a smaller team). Say each asset takes even 1 hour average to make. Just to make the assets for this one biome, say even 1000 assets that is still a full month of work and these are EXTREME low balls.
I have specifically said the opposite. No of course they are going to reuse assets. But there is still a extremely large amount of assets that must be made for a biome or even a level. You cant reuse everything between biomes, and there are going to need to be a lot of bespoke assets for each level as well.
They will send concept art to a 3D asset farm whom will bash out a bunch of rough options and then go to and fro with feedback rounds for fine tuning. then those pieces will become palette pieces for inhouse artists and designers. This is how much of the modern pipeline works so I would be shocked if it wasn’t true here.
They’re not swiss watch makers who painstakingly pour over every detail of every asset. It just doesn’t work that way.
You say they shouldn’t make new levels because it’s too much work. If that isn’t your argument then what is it exactly? They are Games developers. It is literally their day-to-day salaried jobs to make content.
What do you expect them to do? many companies have level designers who do nothing but constantly make whiteboxes and help with navigation and dressing.
I would also be shocked if they didn’t have a whole bunch of unused whiteboxes just sitting there ready to be worked on.
I seriously doubt fatshark is doing this. They are a small fairly tightly nit dev team, hell I checked their carriers page and it literally is all stuff like “Hands on approach, limited crunch time, focus on quality and atmosphere”. I think you are applying a big budget development approach to a small “paid more to work less” dev team. Were not talking about a company that opens a development office in Vancouver because the tax benefits are good. Its one dev office in stolkhold Sweden staffed by a small well treated team.
Unfortunatly “No crunch time”, “Small team” and “hands on approach” means stuff gets done slower.
I didn’t say that. I am just explaining that its more work then you would think and its a small dev team so expect stuff to take time. If you want to go yell at EA to pump out more maps for BF6 you are more then justified to do so, they have the structure and resources to do that. Fatshark does not.
Personally I feel a lot better supporting Fatshark knowing they are structured this way. Its why I buy the delux edition of every DLC. (I dont spend any money on the horrible cosmetics shop because I dont support that element lol. But that was likely forced in by Tencent. God I hate tencent)
Good old: “I want games made by less people, paid more to work less” or are you a fan of soulless corporate slop?
Speak for yourself m8, its so bad that in our premades people are talking about what Vermintide maps could be ported into Darktide
Couldn’t care less tbh, these people are hardly working and when they do its a half baked mess of a DLC, hotfixes that legitimately break the game and its all followed by a prompt vacation…
For all i care the year 2026 could be 12 hours a day 6 days a week at Fatshark and i wouldn’t shed a single tear for them!
Man your advocating for devs to be treated horribly because you need more content. Step back and look at darktide as a whole, you enjoy the game dont you? Your here because its a great game. Yes there are issues, yes you should make your voice heard about said issues. But a slow dev time is just a consequence of how fatshark is structured.
I much prefer it this way really. Sure would be nice if we got more content, but y’know people make a effort to not buy clothes that was made in a sweatshop because its bad. Sure the clothes are cheaper but your also contributing to making the world a worse place for selfish gain. Id rather buy slightly more expensive clothes, or in this case wait a bit for more content.
Ill just say this again: “I want games made by less people, paid more to work less” or are you a fan of soulless corporate slop?
