Zealot bad/filler Talents/Passives rework/buffs suggestions/propositions to open up more options to pick

Currently Zealot has two build: Crit/Bleed build and Cleave Build. It’s not bad to have two different builds, so I think this is good ground to start from. There are however a lot of talents to are simply garbage/fillers and have no synergy with anything or are straight up useless/too conditional/punishing to play with. And talents that rely on low HP need to be changed as they have no place in Darktide with chip damage system.

So I will go through every talent that is currently totally useless and needs rework or talents/passives that need to be tweaked a little or nerf even so we open up more options. One by one, talk what the issue is and what balance changes I would propose to make more choices viable for more build variety.

First of All:
obraz

I would like to ask Fatshark deve who changed this from 10% passive to 7% from Closed Beta? Why 7%? What were your calculations that led you to not 6%, not 8%, but exact 7% from 10%. This change was bizzare and hideous. Not only it made Tier 3 talent MANDATORY now but also it doesn’t make sense. Lets say we have 100 toughness. One lasgunner lets say deals 25 damage to our toughness. 10% reduction would reduce that to 22,5. That means we could take extra shot to not get toughness to 0. But let’s now go with that 7%, which would reduce that damage to 23,25. Still the same result. I want to know what breakpoints calculations showed that 7% is the right move. So far it’s low bonus enough that it doesn’t matter.

My Proposition: Hear me out. Change it to 15%, but at the same time nerf this talent:

obraz

to 10% instead of 15%. Then you would have better base (15% vs 7%) that would make more options at tier 3 attractive as there would be less need to bump that at least for Diff 1-4. Also by nerfing this talent to 10% now max you get is 25% (15+10) vs 22% now (7 + 15). So not that much difference but since base is higher, then it opens more options to take instead of pigeon holed Zealot into taking talent that increase Emperor’s Will since 7% is just no high enough.

Next talent is Tier 1 talent:
obraz

This talent is just straight up worse than 2 others from same Tier.

My Proposition: is to make it “Get 10% toughness on Power Attack hit”.

This would give Zealot option for more slow weapon that use power attacks more (Evis, Chainsword, Chainaxe, Thunderhammer etc.) and work also when he is in 1v1 (boss) or 1v2 (2 Crushers for example). It’s less Toughness per second than EW,EW talent but it works when that one is not while working slower in horde mode since power attacks are quite slow.

Next talent:
obraz

This just sucks becaue with your design of chip damage nobody wants to run on low HP. So this is way too conditional. Worked in V2, doesn’t work here. Instead:

My Proposition: “Gain 5% attack speed for 5 seconds when dodging. Stacks up to 3 times”. A good competetive talent to other 2 which are very good already.

Next talent:
obraz

Garbage talent. Too conditional. If it was permanent bonus for Martyrdom stack then it would be better as you try to NOT get those stacks in Darktide due to chip damage so when you get it somewhere god knows where your team has 5 seconds of buff in the middle of nowhere if enemies were just killed? No.

My Proposition: “+20% Power to allies in Coherency for 5 seconds on Elite Enemy kill”. Works simillar to “Wild Fervour” of which hunter captain from V2. It’s nice bonus, usually in the middle of fight with a lots of elites, very competetive now.

Next talent:
obraz

Yeah… just no. This tier is for getting your Health back. Nobody would take that over chance to make his Until Death useful as without heal with chip damage the Invul on 1 HP is useless as next melee from pox wolker will kill you anyway (not to mention fire).

My Proposition to keep it in line with other talent: “When Until Death ends you regenerate up to 20% of your HP in speed of 2 HP/second”.

That would make it less good in clutch when you need to get HP fast but it would be more sustainable in situations where you don’t expect solo clutch and you have time to wait between next combat to get HP back. Competetive but different. Less potential for heal than Holy Revenant, but more sustainable. So something for something.

Next talent:
obraz

This is ok, but it needs to be higher to be good. Again it’s not bad, but it should be 35-40% to be competetive. Its more risky when Until Death hits becasue it depends how much damage hit you to get you to 1, but gives better effective HP during match if you don’t get Until Death. Small buff should be ok here.

Next talent:
obraz

Just no. Low HP as long as your chip damage exist just won’t work. And everytime you are so low in HP (90%!) to get benefit of it you want to heal up ASAP.

My proposition: “Each Martyrdom stack also gives 10% damage reduction”. This gives us nice defensive choice over 2 other strong offensive choices in this tier. So we can actually play a risky game of running at lower HP for 15% more damage from stacks but with 30% damage reduction to offset that a little. Opens up nice more defensive build.

Next talent:
obraz

Again, bad. Ult has waaay too long cooldown now for it to be good. However we could make it less selfish and more co-op friendly. Something like:

My Proposition: “+10% Attacks speed and +10% crit chance for 10 seconds for allies in Coherency after using Chastice the Wicked”. A nice buff worth of level 30 for everyone in team. Co-Op friendly, good competetive option vs other 2 that are more self-centred.

That’s how I would do it, though not every idea might be best but I hope someone can take something from it.

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I’m not going to go over every single thing you talked about here because I don’t agree with some of them, BUT there are two I completely agree with.

Retribution is definitely not that crazy and I’d rather run the other two because they are just better in every possible scenario. Chip damage makes low health builds too impractical.
And while I understand that chip damage was their answer to saltzpyre’s low health build, but this perk encourages low health gameplay when the system actively discourages it. Fat Shark is sending mixed messages with this.

And Holy Fervour. You hit the nail on the head here for sure. This is so obscenely conditional that half the time I either never receive this buff or never notice it. Holy benediction is just 10x better because why not just take less damage in general instead of willingly taking damage to buff your allies? And even Inspiring Excoriation is a solid choice as an on demand team stim.
Whether you want a hands off or a hands on perk for level 15, the other two options just have way more value.

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Martyrdom currently doesn’t stack correctly. But the descriptions says every 15 health, not every 15%, which seems doable to work around with health curios. You would have 90 less health out of a pool of well over 300 with curios. Biggest issue to me is that nothing in the tree scales with Martyrdom. In my own Zealot rework post I suggest that Retribution is changed to +4% attack speed per stack of Martyrdom. I think that plus Martyrdom being fixed to work how the description says would make this a viable build path.

I agree with your assessments of all of the talents other then Thy Wrath Be Swift.

Even with Holy Revenant allowing health to be gained during Until Death, it never is that useful to me. If I’m being that low it’s because corruption damage is eating up my health and I’m boned anyways, so it feels like a trap perk to me. Getting 25% damage back after getting hit from Faith Restores All doesn’t actually help in the moment. Sounds good on paper but in my experience it’s not as great as it sounds.

Making me no longer get stunned by melee attacks is huge , and the additional 20% movement after taking any damage is nothing to sneeze at either since it helps getting out of a position where you got hit in the first place.

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I don’t agree with all of your proposals, but I definitely agree many of the talents you pointed out are sub-par. Zealot talents definitely need another look.

I’m sorry, they STILL haven’t fixed this?!

Funny stuff is that some other players datamined this and Its possible Fatshark REALLY made it to be 1 stack per 15% and UI is totally bugged and 1st stack you get at 100% is bug and you don’t really get it in game till you lose first 15%. So it might be “working” as intended but UI (both icons in mission and passive description) are totally bugged/wrong. From my own testing 15% per stack seems how game works right now in back-ground even if you see icon stacks differently.

Which is stupid as +5% per 15% HP lost make it totally impossible to run for Zealot as you don’t even benefit from +HP curios becasue it’s % base HP lost. And 6 stacks talent would then require losing 90% HP.

Whoever designed Zealot for Darktide had no idea how their own game will be played…

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