Title says it all but to give some more elaborate explanation - the lack of Ammo and especially in Havoc where you get like 40% less Ammo from Ammo-Pick Ups it really limits Playstyle and outright makes some Builds useless for example Ogryn Point-Blank Barrage already has Ammo Issue in normal Missions and at Havoc the Modifier gives it just the final Nail in the Coffin (or whatever its called).
And i don’t think it would be unbalanced at all; most ranged Weapons already can’t really shoot far due to the insane spread in the Game (Good Luck hitting an Sniper like 10metres away with an Twin-linked Heavy Stubber) and you don’t get as much Toughness anyway with an ranged Weapon.
Ranged as of now is really just a situational thing and on many Builds just useless and even with say Infinite Ammo Heavy Stubber you aren’t even killing Enemies faster than if you’d just bash them in Melee with an Pickaxe / Bully Club which make you more survivable too.
But like the lack of Ammo, especially if you have another Ally playing Ranged, or someone who just picks up every Ammo even when they are 90% full really does make a lot of ranged Weapons, ranged Builds kinda useless and heavily limits fun and thats the most important thing.
Like aside from Veteran and Zealot with an Flamer i barely ever at all see someone play Ranged due to it. In all my 600+ Hours in the Game so far i think i only ever saw like 2-3 other Ogryns play the Twink-linked Heavy Stubber and that was when i started and played on like Malice or in Mortis Trials with the Death Dealer Indulgence (unironically should be an Talent Tree Perk for Ogryn, maybe as long as Point Blank Barrage is active for balance else kinda busted) and i played a few Rounds with it on Auric MS and i was lucky having Allies who let me gooble up all the Ammo and i still occasionally had Ammo Issues lol but to be fair i did Dakka a bit into Hordes as well…but on the other Side i didn’t even killed them faster than if i did it via Melee
Its an issue in normal Missions too if you want to Dakka a bit more when just pull it out occasionally for Specials / Elites / Bosses; just takes one more person in the Team to play more ranged or a single person gobbling it up when not needed and Ammo becomes an issue.
Why does stuff like point blank barrage even exists if you can’t even use it in havocs and in normal matches have to use conservatively as well meanwhile with melee can just spam taunt / bull rush and facetank hordes of elites/specials with ogryn melee build and lmb spam bully club, kill hordes and groups faster than even if you had infinite ammo with a ranged weapon
yes, more ammo for ranged weapons and not trash modifiers like 40% less ammo pick ups like even if you had infinite ammo melee would still be ten times better and more busted especially with ogryn spam lmb being basically invincible at it, facetank everything and win even havoc 40 a joke with ogryn melee build but muh cant have more ammo for ranged weapons…cause why?
Agree… but it suits the minor part of players that want such difficulty.
I prefer that they get their difficulty and don’t try to beg for havoc modifiers in Auric.
If you don’t like Havoc, you’re really not forced to play it. It is not “cool” to play something you don’t like. You just loose time of your life. And life is always too short.
psykers staffs have infinite ‘ammo’ and purgatus staff is busted af and melee would still be better, with bully club and all the melee nodes for ogryn with bleed, dmg resistance for bleed, special/elite kill, all the toughness and additional dmg with melee, his melee weapons just staggering all the time and blessings like skullcrusher - like as that is now its way stronger and more busted than any infinite ammo rumbler, kickback, heavy stubber or whatever could potentially ever be
I do like it but i just don’t like the 40% less Ammo Pick Ups, and quite a few other things but not the topic here, makes a lot of weapons and fun builds like point blank barrage just not viable and so much outshined by other options, no one will join your group and you wont get accepted if you aint playing same 1-2 builds and maybe ~3 weapons for each class; hard and challenging is fun but it shouldnt restrict viable builds / weapons so much like unless you play with premades and are an really insane player just not possible to do anything else
yeah rumbler is strong but the ‘infinite ammo’ was just an hyperbole; haven’t heard anything speaking against just more ammo and removal of gibbersih modifiers like the 40% less ammo pick ups in havoc schmavoc
but going into the infinite ammo rumbler you still wouldnt be able to just facetank stuff and keep on bashing lmb while being almost invulnerable like you can do now with ogryn melee
The lowered ammo modifier is good and needs to stay in Havoc. Not being able to just shoot everything with weapons like the bolter and the rumbler is necessary. It’s unfortunate that it hurts off meta weapons, but if you’re good enough you can still play with them.
the game is very, very generous with ammo as is, even in havoc. If your team is playing well, you’re fine on ammo, but if your team plays very, very poorly, you’re constantly racing to ammo to keep up with the enemy pressure. This should never happen in auric damnation or lower, and it only happens in havoc when your team is refusing to engage the enemy in melee or utilizing their terrain and abilities to some effect. Choosing to be lazy or impatient and gunning everything down should have as much impact, if not more, than choosing to be conservative and slow, taking enemies out one at a time.
Ranged should always be situational. If it is always good in every situation, it’s never good to use melee. Melee is very risky especially in havoc, with hitstun in the wrong situation putting you in a coffin in mere seconds, while ranged is incredibly safe, even having no toughness often means you’ll still come out on top of armor clown cars that flood hallways.
