On the last point i’d definitely say there is time and place for horde clearing weapons but i personally feel like many weapons marketed as horde clearing weapons barely have the ammunition pool or the statistics to make it ammo efficient.
Horde clearing weapons further validate the existence of single target melee weapons and provide some of the existing build diversity.
I’ll use them occasionally for a change of pace, would be absurd to completely remove them. As for reworking them? I don’t have any idea what that would look like.
I had a player upset at me for gun-lugging and clearing horde as Ogryn, I think its more that players are ignorant with what builds they are playing with.
this game would benefit more if ammo drops would be personal, every player would only see his own ammo pickups, and no interaction between players should be needed (tagging ammo pickups wise)
this would fix players worrying about people rushing ahead or lagging behind since everyone have his own pickups, and if he runs out he has all the accountability
Great idea. Sadly i cannot edit a poll after it goes live.
You could make a thread about it. Considering the poll results im sure most people would agree it’d be alot better then what we have now.
I think they should just add ammo drops from enemies, like V2 how Bardin can scavenge. I think the Vet has a way to add ammo but it’s too coherency dependent.
The biggest gripe is always the red bag and players working together to give each other a share. It incentives a first come first serve and actually hurts coherency since when players are running low they might feel the need sprint forward and get the ammo before someone else.
My solution would be have all ammo pickups be red bags and shared while in coherency. The gunners/shotgunners have a chance to drop small ammo containers instead. This will incentivize players with low ammo to prioritize killing rather than scatter searching for ammo.
TBH its fine the way it is and only suffers when there “that one guy” who grabs everything but that’s few and far between in games I play.
even if i strive for minding my own business after survivalist nerf i find myself doing the math of my team mates at every pickup to calculate whom should be awarded with it to the point i feel the gameplay changed for the worst, this just won’t do for me
it even came to the point i’ve found a player who would leave the game with his premade on a timed out malestorm so that i would get doomed with the other random who stayed with me in consignment yard (and i just couldn’t duo the final part)
all because he meant to spam his zarona for his scoreboard so hard expecting i would just surrender him my bolter clips share, i was even kind enough to tag him for ammo at some point, but he lagged behind lured by the back horde that spawns after the interrogator middle event and he was too far so he just Alt f4 with his friend (cause toxic players always have that friend that help out with the voting so they can misbehave with no accountability)
no, my comment will suffice, there are more than enough survivalist nerf related threads on this forum, because in the end that is what this is all about
Without mods to show team ammo reserve - Makes it harder to “share” in heat of moment. The intention to show this is there with UI red colour being low. So the game does want to inform you of your team mates ammo left to certain extent. Should be added natively to the game as numerical. It isn’t game balance breaking either and not everyone speaks same language to ask nor want to ask every time an ammo pickup comes along.
You match make and notice the team is ammo dependent. Then wish you could switch to Zealot within mission lobby, but can’t as class character is tied to game session.
If sharing is a problem and sometimes it is - Then just like medstations can add single pickup per player and up to individual to manage their own allocated ammo reserve without affecting other players.
You now have to melee more and save the ammo for the priority targets.
If that is intention then this game seems to favour high damage per shot weapons for ammo efficiency against elites/ranged as horde poses very little threat to waste ammo on.
One advice I give. When you see someone with ammo crate, still do leave them ammo pickup because if you scoop up all the ammo leaving him with none then he will be forced to deploy ammo crate for himself when others are already topped up. So can save for deployment at later stage when things get really tight. i.e. share ammo pickup so roughly everyone depletes ammo at same rate, so when everyone is low in a tight situation, makes the ammo crate benefit all.
This sounds worse, considering there’s loot on side paths and such. You could search an area and find nothing and another player could choose to follow and maybe find something or not follow you and miss it if it was theirs. I think the maps tend to have too much ammo, but if “stealing ammo” is a problem, then my solution would be that the ammo that would have been wasted from a pickup is instead left there so a big bag could be used to top up a couple people.
Its not being wasted often enough to be worth mentioning
However, I have met this sometimes… and I would hate that a lot start doing that
Did not vote… cause of my previous vote
Answers you propose don’t make sense
People shouldn’t use them etc. => you can’t remove weapons from the game…
I don’t like them => no, I don’t like that a weapon that is not an horde clearer is used for that. In this game, only few weapons that are horde clearers: flamer, purge straff, kickback, achlys heavy stubber(? not sure it is achlys)
I love them and want more => again… no sense. I don’t love them, however, I feel that the veteran should have also a ranged horde clearer.
Preach. The Flamer is by far the biggest victim of this issue but it also extends to other weapons like Ogryn Stubbers and Recon Lasguns, the latter have faired much better since their recent buffs but prior to that they were relegated to ‘garbage tier’ for a reason.
I feel like the biggest barrier to having ranged horde-clearing weapons being strong and ammo efficient enough to be worth using frequently is that it could potentially make horde-clearing melee obsolete, or at worst they’d even be so good that anyone that isn’t running a ranged horde-clear barely has any fun thanks to numerous players that do run ranged horde-clear killing everything before the odd one out has a chance themself. The latter scenario is precisely why the Flamer got hit so hard with nerfs in the first place.
Ogryns with that 100 bullets machine gun always waste amo.
I’ve seen so many ppl shooting Bulwark shield.
So many ppl shoot in a situation when melee is more effective.
The prob isn’t the amount of amo in the map, it’s the players. I usually ping players to pick up amo all the time but I don’t care when I have the above players if they’re going to run out of amo, so be it.
In the case of flamer its actually one of those few weapons that does clear hordes well and is even somewhat good on ammo if you don’t just hold trigger to overkill stuff. But its QOL features like reload, mobility and lack of really any sort of range make it way too specialized.
It’s a bit less frequent overall, but just had 2.5 games, all 3 sub 100 zealots flaming most everything and spamming every crate and picking up ever last bit of ammo, me who switched to gunlugger+fire shots to mix things upon seeing an ammo light team. The 4th game was also a flamer zealot stacking the same dots as the recon lasgun vet on the same targets and hoovering up all the ammo too, no sharing ammo but sharing targets is always good for a chuckle. At least one of them shared after the callout, other was clearly trolling even harder after that, hence the 0.5 game.
Oh and random unmodded curios 2x, patterns emerging.
It gets old fast when you’re the NPC.
It’s either everyone shares (or psykers/melee not using) and everything is fine, or 1 greedy karker ruins it for the whole group and it all goes to hel. Racing a knife zealot to ammo boxes isn’t my idea of fun.
