Waystalker, handmaiden, witch hunter and more are heroic like carrier but in reality they barely excels through ratmens

it doesnt match to the lore arent they?
thus how about rename some carrier.
shade to shadowblade and etc you know.

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Waystalker and WHC are both insanely good to the point it makes the game boring, and Handmaiden is fine, wut? Also the only one of those that is a hero class tabletop is WHC, I don’t understand this post.

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i said rename;;
handmaiden is the elite guards of high elf everqueen. beautiful and mighty. even the greatest knights are no match for em. shade / ironbreaker etc is just ordinary solider.

I mean, thats not true at all, Ironbreakers are considered the elite of the elite in dwarvish society and are often the retinue for kings or thanes (those or hammerers), and shades are very skilled nomadic warriors and are often depicted as having skills beyond that of an average or even above average Dark Elf when it come to marksmanship, stealth, and skill with a blade. Additionally Handmaiden’s aren’t all inherently the best of the best, as some members of the elven court are sometimes gifted the role of handmaiden as a show of favor from the Everqueen, in which they swear allegiance for 7 years and are then allowed to return to their normal life.

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shadowblades are the elites of shades.
waystalkers are the elites of waywatchers.
oii dark elf footmen = wood elf elites.

an average shade could still probably kill hundreds of rats before being overwhelmed and same deal for waywatchers so i don’t really see the conflict here.
Heck even normal human could probably best couple clan rats himself if given fair opportunity(heck in gotrek and felix, felix himself takes pack of gutter runners while pretty much naked) so what makes you think ultra agile and potentially thousands of years combat experience owning elfs could not (regardless of their role in society)

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I do appreciate your attention to wanting the lore to be accurate, but we’ve sorta leapt into weird realms of thought with VT2. There are more than just their titles to play a role here: just because Kerillian is a Shade, doesn’t mean she isn’t as tough as the elite guard of Malekith. Kruber might just be a Mercenary Captain, but he fights with the strength and fortitude of 100 soldiers.

If we are being entirely accurate to, say, WHF Tabletop, the Chaos Warriors (as pitted against a Shade, an Empire Great-Swordsman, an Empire Witch Hunter, an Empire Bright Wizard, and an Ironbreaker) would absolutely annihilate the Uber-Doober 5.

Pick any combination of careers and they wouldn’t stand a chance against a Champion of Chaos + 2-6 Chaos Warriors. The Uber-Doober 5 would win 1 out of 15 attempts.

Just because they have the title of ‘Shade’, ‘Mercenary’, or ‘Slayer’ doesn’t mean they aren’t a hero. These 5 carry stats like they are Faction Leaders + magic items.

you know while we are at it, what bothers me WAYMORE is something else:

how can one dwarf be slayer , ironbreaker and a ranger those dont go together
you dont just become slayer and decide next week, its ironbreakertime, no you have taken a slayeroath
that means service until the end

the elf part is even more confusing as the 3 carriers we have are basiclly 3 diffrent factions in the warhammerworld, aka darkelf, highelf and woodelf
from this it would make more sense to rename the actual chars to have diffrent names
as it doesnt fit the lore in any case to have an elf be a woodelf,highelf and a darkelf at the same time

If you are playing Handmaiden, the history so far is that:

Ubersreik got attacked, then the Uber-Doober 5 whooped some ass, then Kerillian…

And that is the end of her story so far, other than the contents of Vermintide 2. If you play Shade, she never had this history; her lore follows the path of her Shade lore (you can find all of the careers and their lore on the Vermintide 2 website).

So, in this sense, the only person doing any ‘switching’ is you. The characters are what their lore dictates for who you have selected.

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in my mind this would still feel better if they didnt have the same name
for example:
bardin could be the ranger, he then invites his cousin :wink: who could be an ironbreaker for example
and then they send word to kark kadrin to get some aid from a slayer

but meh its just a minor annoyance in my head and i can workaround that by not thinking to much about it :stuck_out_tongue:

not sayin’ their in depth skill is under avarage or so,
just hope if dev shark approve this and correct their name as their strength

Their backgrounds and career choices have been flashed out, the problem it’s the ramification, the fact that they are getting switched all the time. So what appears storywise is that they are changing paths all the time

Kerillian hasn’t become a Shadowblade… probably because she hasn’t had time. Bardin has obviously earned his ranks; Ranger Veteran and Ironbreaker are both quite prestigious (and he likely did the work to earn them before leaving his home) with Slayer being obviously well put… any dwarf can be a Slayer, so if you are already a champ, you are just a really dangerous slayer.

Kerillian hasn’t earned any ranks within Druchii society and Shades aren’t really soldiers anyways. They are assassins for hire… and I’m pretty sure that she hasn’t had a lot of time to build her reputation as an assassin.

If we corrected all “names as their strength”, Bödvarr would be a pretty little princess… a Champion of Chaos would rend through the steel on anyone he hit, ‘blocking’ or not.

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So, again, the character never switches backstory. They always have the same backstory. If you pick up Bardin in his Ironbreaker career, that’s the path he felt he should go down.

If you ‘switch’ careers by selecting something different, then you have entered an alternate timeline entirely where, instead of Bardin becoming an Ironbreaker, he stuck true to his Ranger roots.

The characters don’t really change their history; you select the history they have had.

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and this is something that the game reflects too by changing some of the conversations the characters have.
Dno why this is such a big deal anyways, if everything in this game was exactly to the “power scale” then the human characters should have been dead ages ago.

This is true, but that’s exactly the problem, in my opinion. There’s no reason for the different timelines in vermintide. With this I mean it’s not a part of the story itself (like it could be, if it was, say, Doctor Who).
That fact that the timeline is supposed to be only 1 (say bardin going slayer, saltzpyre going zealot), but you see them all mixed up all the time is what me and other players find jarring.
Gameplay-story dissonance. It’s a matter of taste, of course, but i’d have preferred the story to go in 1 direction. As it is (because, heck, having careers is good for the game) I prefer to think they are constantly changing approach - career - rather than alternative timelines, but that decidedly conflicts with lore.
I wish fatshark came up with some clever ideas.

I’ve never seen two different bardins in the same game. Barring bugs on the modded realm.
It’s alternate historical timeslines. If I load a different save in a single player game, things will be different, as well.
Basically, you just don’t like that. That’s ok, but I doubt it would change. And it’s decidedly easier to swallow than another 10 similar looking relatives of the Ubersreik 5 suddenly appearing and no one bats an eye.

You know what bothers me? Against the grain, you open the gates to the cells, people are saved but guess what… stupid human-things don’t get out of them and run away. Like, “We good here, no thanks, the ratties told us they’ll season us well before being served for dinner so we’ll just stick around.”
And I was so excited that I would see a friendly human face, alive and with a chance. Yet no, Stockholm syndrome on all of them. Ungrateful basterds.

Man it would have been so awesome to keep only the cells in the last barn before the portal(for convenience, like the alternate timelines idea) and have our heroes rushing along with the captives to the portal, losing men along the way.

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I kinda see it like “thanks for freeing us, i see there’s still enemies around though, now that the door’s open im just gonna hide here until you clean up and move on, and i’ll run when the coast is clear.”

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