If, in the future, we decided we really needed to start hitting each other instead of just shooting each other, we could do better then what’s in darktide.
The W40k weapons are bad. The top zealots use the tomahawk hatchet and the knife. Powersword is powerful but… Evis is just okay.
These are suppose to be the super weapons of the future, and they lose out to weapons we could make today. Talked a lot about possible ideas, but no today. Today I just want to give no ideas, and say this is bad.
Bad. Bad. Bad.
This is bad.
W40k melee weapons Weapons should be improved!
I do not feel they need alteration and I use them.
I do not feel they need alteration but I also do not use them.
Not everyone wants to be forced to use some gimmicky power/chain-weapon
Fatshark wont just make them better than regular weapons
These weapons should excel at a specific task while having some clear draw backs
If I feel weapons are fine but power sword should be nerfed, which option should I choose ?
Provocation aside I don’t recognize myself in any of the answers, tbh.
With only 150h in, split evenly between all classes, I dont have nearly enough practice.
Most weapons seem pretty decent on Heresy and I use them; some would probably still need tweaks.
I did not manage to make the Ogryn Bully club and Zealot heavy swords work well.
Catachan Swords on Veteran feel a bit weak, but I suspect I dont use the weapon special riposte nearly enough, so that is for me to practice.
Chainsaw Axe I find very rewarding, chainsaw sword a bit redundant, heavy eviscerator I like a lot.
I like Ogryn shield & mace but the damage sucks, I would love to have a variant with an axe for single target damage version.
Zealot Thunder Hammer seems interesting but cancelling the slowdown after the special-charged attack requires a lot of micromanagement.
Psyker Force Sword is very good, and the ability to stop bullets with peril seems very, very strong. Duelist Swords are also extremely strong and mobile, if a bit low on endurance (which is good).
Vet Power Sword does not seem to have a drawback except for the low stagger, which by itself is not a weakness in Heresy. I would need to try it on Damnation which I have practiced very little. So far it both feels great and is too strong.
I think you’re misinterpreting the ideas of “powerful weapon” and “powerful build”. The knife gets a lot of press because of incredible dodge statistics (and in general, top players value dodge over other forms of defense), the Lacerate blessing, and high crit, which combos with a number of Zealot’s Feats that result taking dramatically less Toughness damage, and therefore damage overall. The knife itself still hits about as hard as a wet noodle with minimal cleave.
Meanwhile the Eviscerator doesn’t have particularly stand-out blessings, nor does Zealot have any Feats that particularly benefit the Eviscerator, so the builds aren’t as blindingly obvious. This would, however, make for a convincing argument to add or modify existing blessings to allow the Eviscerator more synergy with existing Zealot builds, rather than buff the Eviscerator itself. Don’t just go and buff everything willy-nilly; power creep is a Thing™ and is just as bad, if not worse, than the alternative.
Can anyone tell me why the eviscerator is considered reasonable? The attack patterns felt awkward, the heavy horizontal has average cleave for the investment, I found 1h chain sword far easier to use albeit underwhelming in terms of feel and weight.
The Eviscerator has a series of nasty combos that let it do just about anything. Push-push attack-light is a push followed by double horizontal sweeps excellent at crowd control, or you can do push-light-light for a push followed by double overhead strikes to deal with elites. For less stamina-intensive CC you can do heavy-light combo endlessly. The heavy attacks also have a light rip effect (similar to the light attacks on the chain axe), and heavy horizontal sweep is unique in that it doesn’t rip the first enemy it hits, rather it waits until it runs out of cleave then rips - this also carries over to if you use it with an activated attack as well, so you can hit, rip, and bisect the Elite that’s hiding in the horde fairly easily.
Zealot was the last class I leveled, and my god, I really missed out on the Eviscerator for ~200 hours. It is by far and away the most satisfying weapon I’ve used in the game, even moreso than the Power Sword just because it’s so visceral.
ABSOLUTELY nothing wrong with the current ones however i would like more weapons and more bizarre types, doesn’t have to be op, better yet if they add something hard to master but extremely versatille, for us intellectuals.
For me the Eviscerator is a top choice on Zealot because of how it deals with Ragers/Maulers/Crushers/Reapers. If you activate and do a heavy swing, it will dig into them stun-locking them for the duration of the special. This stops them from attacking and moving.
As TheSoldier mentioned unlike the other chain weapons the Evis does not catch on the first target, rather it catches on the last cleave target, which will always be one of the above in a crowd.
As for the topic of the thread, I think the 40K weapons do need a rework as they don’t really function as they do in the lore, and I am sure they could be made to be more accurate and yet still balanced.
For example all the chain weapons should have some type of low-rev ripping like the Chain Axe does. They are always on otherwise its just a spikey club
The Power weapons should also be on all the time, only the Thunderhammer activates (and it does so automatically on hit)
Evis is an ok weapon, the real problem is Zealot’s design is terrible. Because all it focuses on is crit build, and the slower two-hand weapons just don’t benefit much from that and make the dagger way too strong. Without those crit build, I don’t think dagger and axe are stronger than evis.
This problem especially shows on the thunder hammer, for itself is an underwhelming weapon with many flaws and is the single worst weapon for the zealot’s skill tree.
It also feels like it catches on light targets when you hit its cleave limit with the heavy horizontal? It feels the same as the other chain weapons against armour but dense hordes seem to give me more of a problem.
Its not that I cant get it to work, I guess I just expected it to be better based on how people rave about it and trash the 1h chain sword, which I prefer mechanically.
Push attack + Heavy 1 + Light 2 is decent horde control
Push + Special + light 1 will stagger about anything and deal a lot of damage including carapace armor
Special + Heavy 1 will tear through mixed hordes and stop on that elite in the middle
On top of that, decent single target damage on scabs and dregs on lights attacks.
That and I like the feeling of the weapon so much.
Not as mobile as a knife or an axe, which is fine.
The chainsword is essentially a sword with powered teeth that run along a single-edged blade like that of a chainsaw. Most versions of the weapon make use of monomolecularly-edged or otherwise razor-sharp teeth.
Chainswords are not subtle weapons, and wielding one is a statement in its own right: they are horrific tools of war, designed to bite, tear and eviscerate where more primitive blades merely cut and slice.
When used as intended against lightly armoured foes, a chainsword is lethality incarnate. No other blade in existence cuts flesh with the same vicious, ravening hunger as a chainsword.
A fighter’s strength will add to the blow’s devastating effects, but where other melee weapons may rely purely on strength, a chainsword makes for a perfect duelling weapon; just as effective when wielded with grace and speed over brawn.
Once the teeth even graze flesh, their motorised bite hooks deeper and saws through muscle, sinew and bone with the same, surgical ease.
How I feel using the cadian assault chainsword.
And that’s without even getting started on some of the others.
@Its_Havel
I agree, the classes do need improvement. Maybe not as extensive as you mentioned, but something for sure.
The Eviscerator certainly isn’t just for hordes, it does Elites just as good as I’ve explained due to how the heavy horizontal sweep’s rip works. Plus you can have a ranged weapon that deals with ranged enemies in a much better capacity than the flamer can, fewer downsides for a more rounded loadout.
@scythid
It doesn’t catch on light attacks at all, no delay, no sticking, nada. Your push attack and follow-up light, for example, can both get stopped by a dense horde but you won’t suffer any mobility penalties.
However, I will say that for both the 1h chainsword and the Eviscerator, you kind of need Savage Sweep (+100-200% cleave on multiple hit) to make them really useful against hordes, otherwise they tend to bounce off halfway through, so there’s that.
I meant that it feels like it catches on trash mobs at the end of the heavy horizontal attack when it hits its cleave limit against dense hordes. The slight extra delay makes pure horde clear a bit awkward imo.
Oh, yes it does. Yeah, technically not optimal against hordes, but I work around it just fine - the rip doesn’t last very long, plus you’ve just staggered half the horde, so it’s not as bad as it might seem. I do feel it’s advantageous against certain horde compositions - for example, oops all Scab/Dreg Bruisers - since it basically guarantees you’ll kill one of them every time.
If you’re running Momentum on your Evsicerator (come to think of it, this is actually a notable blessing - this is the only non-Ogryn weapon that can get it, plus it’s really good) you’ll get back some Toughness of whatever random hit might have made it through.
And you can just do the double horizontal lights if you really want to avoid the heavy swing. You can minimize using it with push attack-heavy-light-light, after which you’ll have regained most of your stamina and can resume the regular push combo.
Evis is pretty good. Doesn’t save the others. Heck, the ogyrn power maul can’t be turned on with a shield and slows you to a crawl when you turn it on without a shield so you can’t even fill the time walking to the enemy by turning it on.
Then it turns off before you get your hit off a fair amount of the time and takes too long to turn on when you’re in the thick of it…
And if we check the lore… pretty sure it’s just always on, even without having double checked this one.
Here’s a better question. Why are plain melee weapons in the game at all? Take all of them out except the knife and make the knife allow you to carry more grenades and ammo, or an ultra heavy support hellgun. Then make the W40K weapons all we get and making them as awesome as possible. Maybe leave the shovel in as a tutorial weapon only, the tutorial being level 1-5.
Bad? Power sword is OP, even on higher difficulties people mainly spam the special attack, because everything else on it is medicore at best. Power Maul and Crusher special attacks are easy mode. The stagger allows you to control hordes, elites, and open up Bulkwarks to attacks. Evi is literally the only one which is “fairly” balanced.
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