And how he got that skill on executioner stand
Probably by not playing on the version that is now live.
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I think they listened to the wrong people about what makes vet enjoyable to play.
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By the time you “Duck and Dive” to the target, other classes will already kill it.
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Also veteran’s base toughness was reduced to 100. It’s not worth 6 talent points (plus however many to get to those nodes) to get back to the old base 200 as they’re just too spread out in the exclusive parts of the tree. That’s objectively a nerf.
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As specified in the patch notes ‘Some balance changes made in these tests are still being worked on and will be released in future patches.’ So there are still changes on the way! But i’ll be sure to pass on your feedback as well.
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Thank you much
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Thank you.
Could you maybe do me a favor and include the camouflage expert in the discussion?
Or an alternative that allows us snipers to stand on crates and shoot threats like we used to be able to?
I really miss the style of play 
I appreciate the acknowledgement. I’m the first to admit that some of my feedback around this has been unkind, but I hope the team understands that we don’t respond strongly to things we don’t care about.
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So I put this build together and summarized it versus the older sharpshooter in a google doc. Everything in GREEN can be taken at the same time in a build.
Long story short - you can make a build in the new system that approximates many of the old abilities, and essentially get the equivalent of taking quite a few extra skills from the “old” feat list, plus a few additional abilities, and plus a number of additional passives.
The biggest things vet doesn’t have any more is Camo Expert, Unwavering Focus, and Sustained Fire.
It’s good that Camo Expert was removed (it was a trap feat) and replaced with the more useful Infiltration Ability.
Unwavering focus is gone, but Vet can now stack every other form of Toughness regen on top of suppression immunity and a pile of passives and it more than makes up for it IMHO.
Sustained Fire is gone - but honestly why would you ever run that over Counter-fire in the first place?
You have a bit less ammo overall compared to the old ways, but a lot more tools for keeping toughness maxed out (get ALL of the old toughness regen feats). You get more damage overall (can stack longshot AND Kill Zone, plus passive +10% ranged damage in this build).
Feat wise, this all seems pretty great to me. I think vet was made stronger than before, but not as much stronger as some of the other classes. Given vet was by far the strongest DPS class before, this is good. The classes feel more in alignment power-wise now.
In my mind Executioners Stance (Volley Fire) is an ability for singling out specialists and elites when they pile in on the team already thigh deep in a horde to prevent them putting on too much pressure and breaking the formation or overwhelming someone.
I dont need it to plink basic scabs so the highlighting half of counterfire is already a pass for me and while +25% weakspot damage is nice raw damage is something you can make up for in other areas… like having more shots ready in the mag to follow up with.
What I need is something that, when elites and specials start mixing into a horde, I can make 3 seconds of breathing room in a melee, pop it, pop the elites and specials then go back to melee. The last thing I need from a class utlimate ability is for it to swap me to a gun I cant use then waste half its uptime fumbling a fresh mag, typically at the moment where I have the least time for error.
Theres a space right there in the tree for it so I really dont understand why it wasnt already carried over as an ability modifier. Did someone at FS decide that it was too strong for 1 point or something? Because I genuinely cant imagine a reason to ommit it otherwise.
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Posting this for the benefit of the discussion:
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Hard disagree, it was fine before, the problem with it was that it had both a high skill ceiling and a low skill floor, so people couldn’t figure out how to make it work. Although I agree that infiltrate is better, if only because of how versatile it is as a complete package.
Utility. Also, if you frequently played Auric Maelstrom and STG sustained fire was always the superior option to keep the usual tide of specials off yourself and the team. It was godlike whe coupled with a good AG1 (mybeloved), braced autogun or autopistol.
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20% toughness damage reduction + Close Order Drill 33% (dependent upon maintaining full coherency) + Iron Will (allows you to sustain an additional hit or two on damn+) doesn’t make up for it. Unwavering focus wasn’t obnoxious just because it was a whopping 75% reduction, rather how easy it was to maintain it’s boon during volley fire when coupled with counterfire.
not yours specifically, but comments about “face tanking damnation” with the aforementioned passives are a fabrication.
imo, the vets most defensive ability is “get back in the fight”
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All of the toughness regen nodes have also been indirectly nerfed by the reduction in base toughness to 100. It’s not viable or advised to go for the 6 +toughness nodes to reach 200 base toughness because they’re all so scattered.
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So for everyone who was wondering about the video i’ve tried to replicate it with my shitty Vraks and i’ve had the same if not better results
apparently it has to do with some buffs to vrak’s blessings down there scaling with all the head shot damage talents you can get
of course is pretty situational and doesn’t fit my playstyle, its a joke that with the same build and a holy bolter you would need 3 magazines to get the same result
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It’s becoming quiet clear to me that the veteran tree did not recieve the same attention as the other 3 trees. To the point it felt like nobody bothered to have a serious look at it from the developers after they decided to remove our keystones. Like they “gave up”. I find it also hard to imagine the playtesters didnt notice the “bland” veteran tree and gave no feedback about it. Unless the playtesters were too busy having fun with the other 3 classes… leaving us an ugly duckling.
Like why do we still have talents that gives us a benefit but they are disabled when a certain condition is met? Sharpshooter tree has several of these talents. Those talents dont feel “rewarding” at all, they feel more like a punishment. Do you see the other classes with simular talents? No, they dont. Every point spend their is an upgrade, a reward. Example of these talents are the toughness regen and the base damage increase when no enemy is in 8meter radius.
I wanna say “deadshot” is also such a talent but i’m going to get roasted by some people for it. Even though the way to make deadshot work is to play a “commando” type of playstyle with duck & dive with a laspistol. “getting shot at” to regain a resource… yea no thank you. Feels like deadshot belongs more in the commando tree at that point then the sharpshooter tree.
Our toughness talents are also put all over the place. Other classes have singular or clear areas that put those talents, so you can grab them and move on.
But the bottomline is: bad & mediocre talents with a few interesting/good talents lost in a messy tree.
The veteran tree was advertised as being more “versatile” then other classes, yet it feels more like being “forced” in spreading our points to different trees. Veteran most of the time dont have a “choice” in their talents. And usually, they also cant get all the talents they want for the playstyle they want to play.
It’s not as exciting as the other classes that feel more “polished” and point you in certain directions. Now… veteran has working builds and thankfully is not completly out of the picture but just because we got options, doesn’t mean we are fine. I sincerly hope it doesn’t take a year to fix the veteran tree.
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And the toughness regain/replenishment abilities are mid-bottom / bottom - whilst every other class they’re at the top. The one exception is “catch a breath” which isn’t terrible, but completely worthless in combat.
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Funnily enough, even though I agree that the vet needs buffs/tree node reshuffling, I feel like it was the other way around. The vet tree feels like it was the only one that was QA tested and balanced accordingly. Meanwhile the others were slapped together with little to no QA testing and balancing so they’re busted out the gate. Especially their DPS carry trees. Hell, many talents for the Psyker are literally broken from what I’ve seen some Psyker mains say.
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Try it out with a rending stack build or a pure commando build, works miracles there too.
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