So, the other thread on issues with Veteran’s ammo economy and how people are not satisfied with current situation (ammo shortages at higher difficulties, over-reliance on las weapons limiting your options etc) made me think: what if the solution could be with vet being allowed to carry TWO range weapons instead?
You still can choose what to put in your Primary range weapon slot freely
There is also a Secondary range weapon slot now you can put only pistol-sized weapons into; they have their max ammo capacity halved when carried like that. So it’s a side-arm effectively
When you press “2” button during a mission, it selects your Primary range weapon, same as Q button switches from Melee weapon to your Primary range one. If you press those buttons two times rapidly, you are instead switched into your Secondary range weapon. If you hold “2” button for 1.5+ secs, it will set your current range weapon as default one (so if you have run out of ammo in your Primary, you set Secondary as default for all the switching).
When picking up ammo during the game, it will replenish your Primary range weapon’s ammo exactly as it happens now - but the Secondary range only will get 1/2 of its normal amount replenished.
So, not only we give veteran some extra ammo to use on those missions, but also we make it a truly unique class with its own special mechanics.
There’s a veteran ammo shortage problem on higher difficulties?
the only problem I’ve seen is when a veteran indiscriminately shoots every heretic that moves and inevitably runs out of ammo for when they actually need it.
I was in a Mission with a TLHS Ogryn, Bolter Veteran and an Autogun Zealot yesterday. I was a Recon Lasgun Zealot, for reference. They were all out of Ammo for around 90% of the Mission. Whenever they found Ammo, they’d start p*ssing it away on Poxwalkers.
It was fine for me at first because I actually know how to conserve Ammo, but I inevitably began to run a little low because I wasn’t really getting any Ammo pickups. They were hogging them all and then wasting them on Poxwalkers. Eventually it got to a point where I was so annoyed that I just started grabbing Ammo if I saw it first purely because I was the only one who knew how to use it properly. Sh*t felt like I was playing a Survival Horror.
Honestly I think that Vet’s biggest changes needed are just a better-laid out skill tree like Arbites, and perhaps bumping up his base health, if Arbites and Ogryn are closer to the new standard. I don’t see any reason he should be so squishy compared to Arbites.
And there is nothing wrong with it, it should be allowed on one class at least, to accommodate people who prefer ranged style of play. Without forcing them to go through a bunch of compromises, like limiting their range options to just las weapons, or constantly going into melee to kill some chaff, because otherwise they run out of ammo.
Ammo economy can never be balanced to be just right.
In Quickplay:
You could be lucky and join a team of 2 Psykers. Plenty ammo is yours.
You could be in a team of 3x autogun vets. Not enough ammo
Both extreme cases true. But 1-2 non ammo dependent team members makes a huge difference.
Medstations single tap per person and ammo recharges along with it, again single tap use per person. Solves sharing issue altogether. Then it is down to individual to be accountable for their own use.
Sadly its not true, the shooting part has dropped drastically over time, the mod was available from Jan 2024, if i could somehow get you data before patch 13 and, older DT patches (2022 Nov-2023) you would see how it was a real mix between ranged and melee combat.
Yeah, these days you just want a melee weapon that can deal with everything, because using ranged a lot is not time nor ressource efficient (unless you’re a Psyker). Basically in optimal play, you only use ranged to burst-dps (flamer, bolter…) to clear up a specific threat quickly (mostly packs of elites or specials) or when trying to melee enemies would put yourself in a bad position.
Sorry to pick on you my bef is with stats as a whole not you but this is the problem with using stats.
these stats could be showing an improvement in the players melee ability , it could show a slide in power towards melee it could show a simple improvement in trigger discipline as someone no longer wastes ammo on pox walkers.
I’m not saying he’s wrong I’m just saying these stats do not show that, all they show for certain is this is what he thinks.
I feel like you’d do your argument a greater service with a lot more qualifying statements.
Like can you elaborate on not “limiting their ranged options”? Do you think it would be reasonable to spend most of your match firing a revolver, bolter, or plasma gun? Seems like surely there has to be some limitations here?
Like for something of the power level of auto pistol I’d be very happy if we could shoot it a lot more. I just don’t see how this feasibly works for every gun.
Some people want to be able to play more rangy, that’s a fully acceptable view of things, but its implementation would have to change the balance of the game quite a lot.
And as each time this sort of topic comes up, the answer is that maybe the game isn’t meant to be full ranged, and that in some ways it would be as if I’d go to CoD’s forum, and argued in favour of a better and more important melee system.
I think if Vet gets a reworked tree they’re probably going to add some talent nodes and if so I’d like to see one that gives increased ammo from pickups. Basically just a small bump to make non-lasgun shooty builds more viable, particularly in Havoc.
We should not speak about Havoc, because Havoc penalizes by a lot the use of a ranged weapon.
I must say that, even if I love to melee, the development has lead to less ranged fights. Everything pushed for melee being more important.
Does it forbid me to play with a ranged gun? no because in Auric / Standard diff, we’ve got plenty of ammunitions.
Let’s summarize what I think:
there is no problem of ammunition for Veteran outside of Havoc
Havoc is made with the spirit to punish you if you want to rely on your ranged weapon… so let’s not speak about this game mode.
Its my stats actually, using the following (Power Sword 3 “old one” + Agripinaa Autorifle)
I can add with it weakspot hit | shots fired | shots hit | if you think its an issue with trigger discipline. I can ensure you my accuracy has not changed from 2023-2025, I do play FPS occasionally, as Titantall 2, Insurgency sandstorm , (Vermintide 2 90% as Bounty Hunter), Arma 3 and so on.
As for melee, actually PS was buffed on 2nd rework of Veteran Class, back in Oct 2023, so pretty much I had the experience already with PS for almost 1 year, then got buffed making it even more lethal than it was.
If you want to review my gameplay from 2023, I do still have my videos, unedited.
The data as you said, shows both slide toward melee power and DPS burst ranged weapons.
The data is from 2023, but i excluded the data from pre-patch 13, with 925 games.
If you would like to view the data, i can send you all my games on discord (around 50mbish) and the templates for scoreboard + powerDI and you can inspect for yourself.
Whatever data or information you require I got you!
I was here at the first light, now fading away as a star final flare
but this is the problem with using stats.
