I want to share this https://www.reddit.com/r/Vermintide/comments/bt9gn2/community_needs_survey_analysis_report_data_come/ I don’t have time now to put more thought on the matter, but this was done by almost as many people as there were monthly players.
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This is true. AI director has some problems and sometimes it gets crazy. We can have 5-6 disablers simultaneously. Another example is Skittergate: sometimes, during final boss, AI spawns only monks.
True. There are some talents that force players to compete (in a coop game).
Time changes things. Even a game can develop and change. Now it is sometimes more difficult … so what? There are enough levels of difficulty.
Yes, you could make a new one between Legend and Cata, or a new one after Cata, however there is always something to improve.
But why do so many people want a quick and easy Loot? What value does success have if it was cheap or simply bought?
There are enough games that meet the need for easy and fast success, but play something like this and do not spoil the fun of others.
I really can’t understand why people keep crying.
Most of all I see Soul 23 howling in my head. If you would use the time to get better in the game instead of posting here all the time, you wouldn’t have to torture yourself on Legend. It’s mostly the players who screw up the game and not any mistakes in the game.
I could make a list of mistakes that players make all the time, especially on Legend because they think they’re ready for Legend, but that’s beyond the scope of this. Find nice friends and play with them, then after enough practice we’ll be able to create all the levels and don’t need to create 1000 threats here where you describe how bad the game is supposed to be. And if you see it that way, finally play something else…
Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator
True. We aren’t talking about to make Legend too easy. But we need an half way. Fatshark can’t force us, a year after the game’s release, to find a group. Not everyone can do this.
You can be an expert endgame player, but without a premade, the win ratio will be bad because you can’t carry anymore.
This could be right for Cataclysm, but if an expert player can’t play Legend there isn’t progression, and it means dead game.
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It is not.
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I think I might argue that in general the AI isn’t that bad and manageable - it’s just the MASSIVE difficulty spikes are always too many specials. Flamer + 2 gunners on Convocation in the little downstairs-button room (to get the grim) and 2 players down and out without much chance to do anything. 2 hook rats + assassin the moment we blow a hole in the wall with a cannon and jump through. ON the flip side there’s sometimes only 2 specials with nothing else happening. Fairly easy to do.
There’s making things difficult, then there’s making things difficult because game insta-deletes two players.
This is now forcing a weird meta of knowing “inside” things - where exactly are boss triggers, horde triggers, where specials are likely to appear. Having to use meta-gaming of the level design to succeed is a bit of a big ask.
@Ony players play games for entertainment and in-game rewards. I agree with you that people should play at the difficulty they are comfortable with, but all of the key rewards are in Legend. Some people will NEVER be ready for legend because they don’t have the time or skill to do so.
Those people still would like the nice skins, or glowy weapons, or frames. Poor design of rewards for players at all levels is forcing people into Legend. This is why you get level 10’s join, or HS with Exe sword, some other weak build or lower skill person. Add in the fact Champion + Twitch STILL doesn’t get players ready for legend and you have a learning curve that is almost vertical to get from Champion to Legend.
Fixing bugs first, then balancing beastmen is good. Rewarding players no-matter what their skill level is could be a very good way of stopping the weaker players forcing themselves into Legend and might prevent some of the arguments that people just need to get better, and would ALSO stop some of the arguments that the game is too hard.
Some of the more deep seated underlying problem therefore is that Legend is the only way to get access to the very rare good loot. Spreading loot acquisition out across difficulties would reduce the bottleneck of players (of all abilities) piling into Legend.
Players clamour for frames whenever there is something on offer. BIG demands for the beta-testing frame. Huge uptake on the caption contest for the Eternal Serpent Frame. Cosmetics are a BIG THING and are forcing people to play at a difficulty they’re just not ready for.
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Honestly I think it is a good mix between both. Anyway:
This is true. I alway spam the “Come here!” button… but often we need just a premade. And this is the main problem: on Legend, Fatshark can’t force us to find a group. Not eveyone can do that. Not one year after the game’s release.
With Cata they have been clear: “This difficoulty is an hell”. Good. I can choose if buy it or not, also thinking if I have a premade or not.
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You right. “Fun” part is subjective. But it was dybamic. And yep, without macro, it needed rhythm. Nothing complicated of course, but you had to think about it.
I don’t demand to have again the same dance… but I’m asking an half way. Because without a decent dodge window, I can’t dodge attacks that I can’t see. At least one problem must be solved.
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Regard “What does the community think about WoW?” I agree with @flisker and @Argonaut14.
“Money making numbers” are pretty useless because we aren’t trying to understand Fatshark’s money balance… but if this “new Vermintide” is loved by community or not.
A guy can buy the DLC because he didn’t knew its problems; because he’s rich and 20$ are nothing; because he loves that weapon; he can buy the dlc and then regrets it; he can buy the DLC in spite of everything because he’s the biggest fan.
I repeat myself: the question isn’t how much money Fatshark has cashed… but what are community’s opinions about the GAME.
And to know this Reddit, Steam reviews, old beta section, feedback section, various polls are totally enough.
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I don’t want seem arrogant, but I bet that you have read only the title.
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people don’t cry because the difficoulty, we are talking about objective problems. It isn’t the difficoulty, but the type. Currently there are some factors that make the game unfair and bugged, not hard. Like enemies that spawn on you and beastmen that overshadow Chaos and Skaven;
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we don’t want an easy reward. But currently also a great player will have a bad win ratio on Legend without a premade. We have already Cataclysm for the “maximum challenge” (premade needed, low win rate anyway, etc etc). But a STRONG player must have a decent win ratio on Legend also without a premade, because Fatshark can’t force us to find a group one year after the game’s release. Not every one can do it.
We need DUST and red items. Should players rush Recruit to gain dust? Should an endgame player (that can handle both Legend and Cataclysm) return to a BORING Champion where the chance to drop a Red is pretty inexistent? -
do you play with me? How do you know if I can deal with Legend and Cataclysm or not?
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Also this is true. There are some innaturasl spike of difficoulty. Both 5-6 disablers spawned simultaneously and some final events that are just too much compared with every part of the game.
Totally agree. And there is another factor. There are also expert players that can hadle both Legend and Cataclysm but that can’t play them because they haven’t a team. Fatshark can’t say to these players “find a premade or leave the game”. Champion is totally boring for them (and it doesn’t give nothing).
It isn’t possible force players to find a group one year after the game release. Or should they remain on Legend and don’t even earn the dust (no progression = dead game)?
Legend should still be hard for the average players… but an expert one with ton hours of play and a perfect equip should be able to carry some “not-so-good” players. I don’t demand the “true solo Legend” (that anyway in 1.6 I could do easily)… but I repeat muself, at least carry some not perfect players.
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Yeah but that is kind of my point. There is just needles spikes/swings because it seems there is seemingly no mechanic for when and how specials spawn. Sure a group of specials on an otherway empty map is easy to deal with. But at the same time it is kind of pointless.
Same situation during a hirde might as well be a death sentence. What is missing is balance or any form of thought about spawns for specials that makes them contribute to the overall experience beside shoving them in our face.
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Yes exactly, those factors are definitely present and they actually muddy the waters for those people who analyze sales. My point is that it is perfectly conceivable that some people who are far from the community and close to the bank accounts are calling all the wrong shots because they see a very different picture through the information available to them. This is why I said I was curious. Imagine that at the same time as all the crap is hitting the fan here, on Reddit etc, there are some sales people reporting great sales to some financial director. I wondered if that can be the case.
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Imagine that they had simply launched WOM with the beastmen, weapons, level 35 new talents and 3 new maps + boss as content, without Weaves or changing anything else.
It would have been perfect…
Seriously? Do you know what happens when you want to eat Pizza and the restaurant says “We don’t have, but we have salad”? You go somewhere else for Pizza.
Well, that has happened with WOM, the community has been asking for content such as new maps, real cosmetics or heroes for a long time, and now you give them something that nobody had asked for. Normally they get angry and go play something else.
The best things about WOM is the new enemy faction, the weapons and the new map.
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Fatshark’s current model is that of a dumb anime waifu who can’t cook, doesn’t taste test her own food and expects you to eat her cooking without any fuss.
The analogy here (if it wasn’t clear) is that Fatshark doesn’t play and test their own product before selling it at full price. Learn to get good on your own Fatshark!
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Not overly invested here, but I’ll absolutely say some maps have finales that are over the top.
Garden of Morr is really hard at the moment, and Convocation of Decay has become one of my least favourite maps due to it being really long and having one of the more difficult finales.
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Enemy spawning is what really surprises me, enemies do spawn right in front or back of heroes,
blackheads, chaos warriors, stormverminds do spawn with the weapon already in the air and ready to hit me
hordes+patrols+500 specials+monsters all spawn simultaneously in the worse place
no ammo or heal and 500 specials when there is only 2 or 1 hero alive!
players must stay together, realy close there is no other way
if you separate from the group the game will send specials to kill you, simpl as that
nobody knows or understands or want to accept that
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I think fixing the abysmal THP system should be fatshark’s priority. Even a temporary measure would be ok, as it is I’m playing a small fraction of the classes (those that can make THP on kill shine). It’s such a hard lock, and it affects every game mode.
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Thp is good right now only few carriers struggle with it (mostly because of dumb thp talents, unchained is is good example, why the hell she dont have thp on kill? )
Fix would be looking at thp talents for those characters
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