I want to love the Thunder Hammer.
According to the lore, it is an extremely powerful weapon that decimates everything but the toughest foes.
But in Darktide, it takes much more than one swing to kill most foes. And the mass of one man is enough to stop it’s entire momentum.
I actually fear hordes when I’m wielding it. And I must avoid groups of enemies if I don’t want to die like a wimp.
It should be so much fun like in other games… but in Darktide it’s just the worst.
Imo both thunder hammers should get slightly increased base dmg, and be changed to work more like some of the other weapons that we already have.
Both thunderhammers should be buffed in their ability to deal with trashmobs. They should be able to 1 shot the first trash mob they hit, without being empowered (or having blessings stacked up).
The crucis (single target dmg) hammer should work like the chain weapons.
Activation should make it deal extra damage against everything it hits and the weapon should cleave through trash until the cleave limit is reached, or an elite/special is hit. At that point , the attack deals big instant damage to that target and the activated state is turned off.
It should be worse against hordes than the eviscerator, but deal similar (mabye a bit higher) single target damage with the weapon special, while also dealing the damage in an instant and not coming with the downside of the “sticky attack” of chain weapons.
The ironhelm (multi target dmg) hammer should work similar to the power sword.
Great cleave and increased damage when activated.
When using the weapon special, it should be a bit better than the eviscerator when it comes to hordes, but it should deal less damage to specials/elites than the eviscerator special.
Also, if anyone from FS reads this, pls give the Eviscerator unlimited dmg cleave for cleave attacks with weapon special activated.
The weapon special should not get stuck in trash mobs and the “empowered” attack should deal at least 1 damage to all targets hit, so that it can apply bleed stacks to the enemies.
Similar to the treatment that the ogryn shield got for heavy attacks (unlimited cleave and deals some damage to all targets hit, which allows for great bleed application).
That’s because weapons in Darktide aren’t a 1-to-1 Lore translation, but meant to each have a unique gameplay purpose.
The Thunder Hammer’s schtick is it being a great Crowd Control weapon for stagger and Horde clear, yet you can also take on singular targets like boss encounters.
It’s the most damage effective weapon when it comes to smashing monsters. With Thrust as Blessing and +25% Unyielding Damage, you can be a designated boss killer even post-nerf.
If you fear hordes when using the Thunder Hammer, you haven’t found the rhythm to it’s dance yet. The idea is to use charged swings to smash everything, use the light attack as a single target to kill off specials and use the electric charge to kill Ogryn-sized enemies and bosses.
There is no need to kill enemies in a single swing, when your attack interrupts them no matter what.
Maybe if the damage was doubled or tripled it would make a difference. Because right now all the Thunder Hammer does is toss hordes on the ground without killing them. Then they get back up and attack you in the back.
I understand the argument about gameplay considerations. Yet it gives me no comfort. I have this picture in my mind of a glorious Thunder Hammer, scourge of the heretics and demons alike. But all we got is a glorified sledgehammer.
With great care and patience, I can deal with a horde without them ganging up on me. But the rest of my team leaves me behind because it takes too long.
And yes, fighting Ogryns, mutants and monstrosities is very fun. But a single pesky little guy in the way will protect them entirely. This dampens the fun considerably.
That’s actually a pretty accurate translation of the lore. Assuming you use headtaker or slaughterer and thrust you’ll always be bonking one target to death per swing in a horde. But it being mostly for stagger in the horde is fine. Its big problem is that, outside of solid unyielding damage, its flak and carapace are actually quite abysmal and maniacs doesn’t impress too well either. Without a very particular build the weapon misses 1shot breakpoints on lots of human sized targets. Like i can understand working for it on a mutie but on a dreg or scab rager? Or a mauler? Having to build so hard for it really feels bad.
In VT2 there was a pretty good balance between cleave and damage. 2H hammer had unparalleled stagger cleave on the heavies but very low damage cleave.
The greatsword was the other was around. Great damage cleave but low stagger cleave. It killed faster but opened you up to reprisals.
The thammer still has good stagger cleave on the heavies but there are many alternative weapons that cleave just as much or even more but kill nearly everything they hit. Any BM axe, the heavy swords, the power sword, etc. Even with full slaughterer stacks, you’re only killing about the first trash you hit on each swing. That takes waaay longer to clear a horde for only a little bit more stagger with less cleave than some of these killier options have.
This is probably more an issue of blessings than the baseline weapons. With the right blessings even the combat sword can EASILY beat the stagger of thammer which can be goofy.
What’s your setup for T Hammer? IMO it’s just one of those weapons that pretty much requires slaughterer + thrust at at least T3 to feel like it’s doing what it should. That said I think I’d move its rating up a fair bit recently with the specials spawn as monsters maelstrom modifier around these days. Don’t think there’s a better answer to that condition than a T Hammer Zealot.
Anyway personally this is what I’d do with the T Hammer. Stronger light attack damage so it’s a better option for sparse bruisers or small groups of elites that aren’t threatening enough to throw heavies or special attacks.
Increase second target damage of heavy attack so it’s reasonable to damage stack to the point that it kills two pox walkers per heavy swing. It’s fine if it does zero damage beyond those first two targets.
Maybe reduce the post special attack stun by another 0.1 seconds but mostly just for feel, not necessary.
I hate that blunt weapons (like Thunder Hammer) are pushing crowds for no damage.
It feels horrible when it kills 1 unit and gently puts others to the floor.
yeah makes also zero sense, a topheavy weapon should impart way more dmg onto targets than weapon that has its balance point near the hand,
I mean you’ve got thrust which is the main thing but slaughterer helps against hordes a lot more than skull crusher. All that bonus cleave and stagger are well as reliably killing the first trash mob cleaved without charging heavies definitely makes your life a good bit easier.
Most (Actually all) cases of Thunderhammer in the lore are in the hands of SM, who have Power Armour with backpack containing a sub-atomic microfusion generator, so they have theirs always powered. And they can support the backlash cause they are stronger and have Power Armour to compensate
In any case thunder hammers and power fists are practically the same weapon and PFs are in common use across the imperium.
I really don’t mind this. I just want the weapon to be actually good at single target work when powered on.
I think that a melee weapon that underperforms vs. horde is badly designed by default.
Wasting limited ammo on endless hordes or hoping that other teammates will handle it for you is not really helping anyone.
I entirely disagree. Keep in mind that there are weapons that are reasonably ammo efficient against hordes, especially the flamer. Plus ammo is rarely a serious scarcity. The hammer is functional in a horde in any case as a fall back option and very safe to use. If it actually efficiently preformed its job as an elite, special and armor buster with unlimited ammo then it would do what it is supposed to do in the game. But because it doesn’t preform its roll properly it just feels horrendous at everything.
I dunno why people make such a fuss about shooting at a horde like its going to ruin the game or something.
With ~150 ammo capacity 
, flamer Zealots are always running dry looking for ammo. The only thing why it’s tolerable - still capable of killing elites/specials with Ability exploit (and absolutely useless without it).
Because nobody likes seagull players grabbing all the ammo.
Your experiences are just very different than mine clearly. Ammo consumption is just not that big of a deal and the weapon is acceptable if you have nothing else. Its job isn’t horde clear its job is elite and armor busting and its bad at those.
All blunt weapons would be more satisfying if they killed elites faster. I don’t even care for more horde damage, just increase the target cap and keep the damage low since their control is insane. Some weapons like the bully club and shovel can just loop basic sweeps/pushes and hold off any number of horde and elite enemies, which promotes team building with mass damage setups. Weapons like brunt’s club should 2HK damnation muties with no build, while Crucis thunderhammer should probably just hit 1700 maniac damage with no perks or blessings.
I do think brute’s shovel should be a special case and keep a low target cleave cap, but have high cleave damage like a knife. So it feels like the real swiss army knife weapon they’re attempting with it, instead of punch the weapon.
Flamer is pretty ammo efficient, especially if there is vet, but they should revert tank capacity nerf. Flamer just isn’t so great on conditions with waves of specials, especially in pair with hammer - two low mobility weapons. Kantrael shotgun other hand is a great addition for hammer build.
