The Skitarii's survivability issues: a comparison of survivability talents with other classes‘ talents

Excluding keystones, blitz, and combat abilities.
First is Toughness Restoring, compared from two aspects: Toughness regeneration per second and Direct Toughness Restoring.
The Skitarii have quite a few Toughness regeneration per second talents, most of which are relatively easy to trigger, with values generally around 3-5%. It is quite easy to have multiple of these triggering simultaneously, achieving 15-20% Toughness regeneration per second.


Next, the Skitarii’s Direct Toughness Restoring talents. There are four in total: two that trigger on kill, and two that trigger under specific conditions.

S-CRE requires a weak spot kill to restore 5% Toughness, while the Veteran’s OFB restores 5% on any kill, the Arbites’ UC restores 5% on close kills, and the Psyker’s Soulstealer restores 7.5% on warp attack kills. Compared to these three talents with similar or even higher Toughness recovery values, S-CRE is harder to trigger. Meanwhile, the Hive Scum’s PV restores 4% or even 12% Toughness on melee hit, weak spot hit, or crit conditions alone, making S-CRE a completely useless talent in comparison. Additionally, PRU is also far inferior to PV when compared directly. Although S-CRE’s Toughness Damage Reduction somewhat narrows the gap.

Maximum value of the Skitarii’s SP is only half of the Zealot’s BP, and the Zealot’s BP is already a niche talent that almost no one takes.

DSP and VR have decent effects, but they are not reliably triggerable Toughness recovery. On a side note, combining the Veteran’s BL + Skitarii’s PO + the Ogryn’s Aura: SC! can stack to increase VR’s 20% team-wide Toughness recovery to about 35%.

Looking further at talents with similar trigger conditions, the Skitarii’s KED is also far inferior to the Hive Scum’s BoE.

The Skitarii’s BBP is also inferior to the Veteran’s CK, the Arbites’ TN and the Hive Scum’s VOT, all of which cover enemies including Specials.

In summary, in terms of Toughness Restoring, the Skitarii have too many Toughness regeneration-per-second talents and lack stable Direct Toughness Restoring. This makes it difficult for them to rely on consecutive kills to mitigate damage in high-pressure situations.

Next are the Toughness Damage Reduction and Damage Resistance talents.
The Skitarii have a total of four Toughness Damage Reduction talents, with values of 15%, 15%, 10-22.5%, and 20% respectively. The values provided by individual talents range from 15% to 22.5%. Comparing these with other classes, we can see that aside from the Operative Modifier talents, most offer’s Toughness Damage Reduction talent at least 20%, with the highest reaching up to 50%.The only exception is the Psyker’s OWTW, but even though its minimum is 10%, it can scale up to 33% based on high Peril. The values given to the Skitarii’s talents in terms of Toughness Damage Reduction are too low—the Skitarii often need the combined value of two talent points to match what other classes get from a single talent point.


The Skitarii have three Damage Resistance talents. Only GC’s 15% can maintain high uptime, and Stun Immune is decent. AMR is difficult to sustain during combat. ACE provides 30% but only activates after Toughness break. However, as I mentioned earlier, the Skitarii lack Direct Toughness Restoring talents. The Skitarii’s inherent lack of burst Toughness recovery means that ACE can only delay death in high-pressure combat scenarios.

Even the Psyker has two Damage Resistance talents at 10% and 25% respectively. The Arbites also has two stable Damage Resistance talents at 25% and 15%. The Hive Scum has 20% that is almost always fully stacked. Additionally, the first two DLC classes also have talents that reduce damage dealt by enemies. The Zealot has been mentioned less frequently, but when it comes to Damage Resistance, the Zealot’s talents in this category are unprecedentedly diverse and abundant.

Finally, when it comes to Stamina recovery, dodge, and block talents, the Skitarii have only two Stamina recovery-related talents. ESR’s effect is rather mediocre, while DSP has such a simple trigger condition and a long cooldown that it’s difficult to trigger when it’s actually needed. Compared to other classes, the design of the Skitarii’s talents in this category is overly monotonous.

Summary of the Skitarii’s survivability talents: monotonous Toughness recovery—too much Toughness regeneration per second and almost no burst Toughness recovery; mediocre Damage Reduction, especially the Toughness Damage Reduction talents; only two Stamina recovery talents with mediocre effects;the only effect worth mentioning is the Stun Immune effect provided by Galvanized Coating; no ability to stagger boss enemies; no sprint speed increase, no block efficiency increase, and so on. As a class with 150 base health and a 0.75s Stamina Regeneration Delay, I think the Skitarii’s current survivability is on par with the Psyker. The talent tree shows no sign of any mobility, stamina, or defense from a mechanically augmented being.

Skitarii is just actually a glass cannon. Its not a issue. It can have solid burst toughness generation with claw if you really need it, but the other builds are more squishy and it balances their high damage output.

Unlike psyker and also hive scum who are “glass” cannons due to their incredible mobility. Skitarii does actually need to play more cautiously to compensate for its higher damage potential, this is a good thing.

Skitarii only have two reasonably viable builds: a melee build based on the Claw and a ranged build based on the Arc Rifle. The former’s performance ceiling can only match that of a skilled Thunder Hammer and Martyrdom Zealot without any Combat Ability. The latter requires ammunition and still may not even match a Venting Shriek Psyker.
The damage potential of other builds is not particularly high.

VE spam is also a very good high utility and damage build with arc maul. Claw does very high damage you definitly need relic blade to match it and it will do damage pretty close to marty + fof if you play it well enough. Arc rifle has very good ammo efficency, it really does not need much ammo at all, and the fact that it is even comparable to venting psyker definitely shows that it has enough damage lol.

The issue is the scum and psyker are OP not that Skitarii is underpowered. Both those classes either need their damage cut or suvivability cut, or both really.

I think this is a useful analysis and I think it’s worth questioning whether they should be quite so glass-cannony in every single configuration. Its stated design goal was versatility in playstyle, and this isn’t really it. It makes me wonder if I should try some toughness regen speed on my curios though.

The Claw’s maximum damage against Unyielding weak spots is around 14k. A Thunder Hammer and Martyrdom Zealot without any Ability also deals around 14k damage to Unyielding weak spots. With additional techniques such as backstabber and stamina consumption, that damage can be increased to 38k. My earlier statement that the Claw ‘can only match that of a skilled Thunder Hammer and Martyrdom Zealot without any Combat Ability’ was somewhat inaccurate—I actually meant those CoSF Zealots who do not use such techniques. If you factor in the stacking of damage-boosting Combat Ability and techniques, the Martyrdom Shroudfield Thunder Hammer can reach an extreme of 90k damage against Unyielding weak spots. The Claw currently performs perfectly in difficulties below Auric—three hits can take off most of a boss’s health—but it underperforms in Havoc, requiring 5 stacks from the keystone RC to handle bosses. Additionally, one must consider the Capacitance restoring. Checking ability usage frequency through mods, the Claw’s fastest usage rate is only about 4-5 times per minute, whereas the Thunder Hammer requires no such considerations. Also, my mention of “without any Ability” should actually be “without any damage-boosting Combat Ability,” which only applies to the CoSF. However, the CoSF can completely pin a boss in a corner, allowing teammates to do whatever they want, and it also has Golden Toughness. And the Skitarii have no ability to stagger a boss.

Yeah, I dunno. I have zero survivability issues on skitarii. Honestly the only people who complain about this seem to be the H40 crowd. For the format that the game is balanced for (i.e. auric), the class works perfectly fine.

IMHO the problem is more that other classes are too forgiving (scum anyone?). Or that some are just meant to be more tanky, like the zealot, because they’re pure melee rather than hybrid.

I mean sure… But no one runs thunderhammer? Thunderhammer is useless people just run fatmangus to do basically the same thing but also be better in every other way. Thunderhammer is just bad into every other target and who cares if you kill bosses a bit faster.

It seems like you think claw is exclusively for anti boss? Its not. Its for spamming into elite groups or hell even hoards if you feel like it. Its also good at killing bosses but comparing it to thunderhammer is absurd. I mean sure thunderhammer kills bosses a bit faster but uh… Claw also works on literally everything unlike thunderhammer.

However, it is quite obvious that the Claw is a skill, while the Thunder Hammer is merely a melee weapon. To be fair, when comparing the Zealot’s Thunder Hammer plus Chorus against the Skitarii’s melee weapon plus Resonant Claw Strike, I personally believe the former is much stronger. Of course, different players may have different opinions, but the point I want to convey is that since the Skitarii’s melee weapon pool is largely weak against Carapace armor and bosses, this makes the Claw skill, despite its decent raw power, only capable of compensating for the Skitarii’s inherent weapon deficiencies — and as a skill, that makes it relatively underwhelming.

Transonic blades are actually stronger into the crusher/mauler test group then the thunder hammer. And they also do very solid boss damage. Along with having way better hoard clear then the thunder hammer, and better mobility.

The curio perk only affects coherency toughness, not all toughness.

Although this might be a bit impolite, could you tell me more details about the testing? I find it quite surprising that any weapon could surpass the Thunder Hammer in single‑target efficiency. Moreover, if the Transonic Blades are really as good as you say, then I don’t see any reason to bring the Claw, since their functions overlap considerably – you could essentially think of the Claw as a second melee weapon; if the first one already meets all the needs, then there’s basically no reason to bring a second one

All things need not be equal differences will elevate class strengths and weaknesses.

Skitarii also has many generators and DR baked into abilites & Keystones as other classes also tend to have.

Biggest flaw is lack of flat toughness/health/TDR that all these things multiply off of… but even that is comparable to Hive Scum

Because the test isnt a single target, its a group of 4 crushers and 4 maulers. Who cares if you can kill one really fast when they spawn in groups surrounded by other enemies. Thunderhammer is just trash as soon as you need to fight more then one enemy, and there tends to be a lot more then one enemy in havoc 40.

*Note the boltgun time is a bit off on this chart, I have gotten 13.14 with boltgun + exec.

Okay you need to take Axial slash. Claw is amazing into both groups and single targets. You can basically spam it on cooldown, hell sometimes if you are running flensing you can get enough kills with it to completely recharge it. It also has very high stagger, generates toughness (well the node that is mandatory to take it does), has infinite cleave, and comes out instantly with no windup.

I think the biggest problem is just the talent investment into toughness on skitarii, you’re fed these talents so piecemeal it takes more points than the other classes for comparable return which reduces the flexibility of the tree that Fatshark touted (particularly when you consider a number of these talents are already situated nearer to or in easy reach of what are already the stronger skitarii builds, such as chordclaw).

Your first point, I think, is rather far‑fetched. Because of the nature of Carapace‑armored enemies, most weapons can only hit one such enemy per attack, and if the time to kill a single Carapace enemy is short, so there’s no reason they would perform poorly against multiple of them. Besides, I also bring the Claw and use the Peel Protocol keystone. Your description is clearly exaggerated. Moreover, according to your logic, if I bring the Claw, then it doesn’t matter much what melee weapon I take – I could have taken a strong melee weapon plus a strong ability, but the Claw only gives me a strong melee weapon. Although the Claw might be a bit stronger, I don’t think that can make up for the loss of not having a strong ability.

First off transonics with their heavy attacks can cleave carapace (in fact they have near infinite cleave). Secondly it dose matter because you need to charge the thunder hammer between attacks. Download the datatide mod and do better if you can, but I doubt you could beat that time by much.

Flensing Protocol gives you +5% capacitance on elite kill, the class generates +4% capacitance on elite kill as a passive effect, Reactor Coil Recharge gives +2% capacitance per weakspot kill. These all stack so you can get +11% capacitance per elite kill. Shotgunners are elites and spawn in groups of around 10 so yes it is very easy to get back a full charge. Hell just slashing into a big hoard you generate 4% capacitance per melee weakspot kill so if you kill 20 enemies in a hoard (pretty easy to do if you also swing your camera to hit more enemies) you can generate 80% capacitance. So no that is not a exaggeration.

The claw is literally the strongest weapon in the game. And again it generates toughness and that toughness can be spread to your team, and you can spam the ability, and it does incredibly high damage with infinite cleave and high stagger. It is a very powerful ability.

I tested it in the Psykhanium. One Chordclaw strike can pierce through about 6–12 flak or maniac enemies (depending on how many cleave talents you’ve taken), or about 2–3 carapace enemies. That means, to achieve the kind of effect you described, you’d need to kill 20 trash mobs or 10 elites in a single Chordclaw strike. In actual combat, with all sorts of factors at play, this condition is quite difficult to meet

In addition, I want to apologize to you. I shouldn’t have used the Thunder Hammer as an example in the first place, because the Thunder Hammer is probably a weapon that our server prefers. Perhaps I should compare the combination of Shroudfield plus Relic Blade against the Skitarii’s melee weapon plus Chordclaw. Against trash mobs, I think they are about the same; against elites, the Chordclaw is stronger; against bosses, the Shroudfield + Relic Blade is stronger. In terms of melee capability, they are roughly evenly matched. But the Shroudfield + Relic Blade comes with an additional stealth mechanic, and that is exactly what the Chordclaw lacks—it’s almost purely a numbers-based ability, and its function overlaps significantly with the melee weapon itself

Oh, how annoying.

Its pretty easy, especially with shotgunner hoards I pretty regularly get 60% or more back every time I use the ability in combat. Its very easy to consistently spam it into elite hoards.

Thing is when you use relic blade you are using a weapon with bad mobility all the time. Transonic blades give very good mobility and then you can also spam chord claw to get above relic blade damage consistently without needing to deal with the slow attacks and poor mobility. I pretty much main charge + marty zealot and I still find relic blade much more clunky to use, you can get away with a lot more using chord claw especially since it generates toughness and has incredibly high stagger.

Chord claw is a large aoe, very high cleave, high damage, very high stagger, ability that generates toughness. It is very strong and I regularly do about as much if not more damage on it then I do running charge + marty zealot.