The Dreaded War Pick

Warhammer: Vermintide 2 Gameplay Feedback
1

I know this has been said, but I feel it bears repeating for 1.1.0.2…

I love the idea of this weapon, but it seems to have no strengths. Did a dozen or so legend runs with it and it is simply too weak for its slow speed.

2 hit for a clanrat, 3 hits for a marauder. The falchion, for example, seems to kill in fewer hits and is twice the speed. With most weapons I use regularly you can hold off a horde wihout taking damage if you don’t screw up, but that just isn’t possible with the pick. Nor should it be.

The real problem is the damage versus armour of the charged attack. To reach the second level of charge, you have to wind up for so long that you either get hit by something, or your teammates kill the thing you’re aiming for, even if it’s a CW.

In fact it is so long that I have often had to abort a swing because of an overhead smash that didn’t even start animating until after I began my attack. The occasions where your swing rushes you forward, you hit the target, and nothing swings in the vicinity in the meantime, are few and far between.

IMO the damage could be doubled across the board and it would then be in the right ballpark. Adjust 2nd, 3rd etc target damage for balance.

When I hit a low tier enemy in the head with my giant spike I want it to stay down, not need 2 more hits!

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2

try it as slayer, problem solved. Thank me later

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Saying that a weapon being bad is not a problem because its somewhat ok on 1/3 careers, and only that career, is not how it works.

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For real though, war pick on slayer is amazeballs.

For others spec attack speed and maybe even swift slaying. It does great against hordes if you position well and mix it up with some pushes and dodges.

The first stage charge attack is fast and does acceptable armor damage. Light attacks also do armor damage and great stagger, you can stunlock multiple elites pretty easy.

5

Dude, there are literally weapons available to 1/3 of careers only. So are they bad too? Because by that logic of yours they are. Or does the fact that others can equip them changes anything?

Not to mention, that ALL the weapons work better on some careers and worse on others.

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That’s where the option to pick another weapon comes in question.

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Somewhat ok on one career but bad on other careers =/= only available on one career. Pears and apples.

And work fine on 2/3 careers and great on 1/3 careers =/= absolutely horrible on 2/3 careers and somewhat bearable on 1/3 careers.

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Have a mate that swears on it even on IB, so tried it for the first time today, literally just crafted a pick and specced it and tried it on slayer and it was a blast - great reach on it! Solo’d a horde a bunch of maulers and a CW using pick and dual axes and half a stormfiend (party was dead) then sadly a leech grabbed me through the side of a wall xD.

Think I ran 3.4% atkspd 3% crit on the pick, and 5% crit and 5% atkspeed on accessories along with swift slaying on the pick and parry on the axes.

Big selling point appears to be the reach it has.

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If a bad weapon faster makes it usable. Wouldn’t a good weapon faster still just be better?

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Except it’s not a bad weapon, it’s a good weapon. On slayer it’s incredible but so is pretty much anything with that ult speed boost.

I use war pick on RV too. It’s mechanics are a lot different than other weapons and the skill ceiling is a bit higher, but it’s just as legend viable as any other.

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Depends, war pick has a pretty good angle, reach and mass cleave added with a little bit of armor pierce.

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Ok. That doesn’t answer the question though. Does the attack speed increase make the pick more better than it betters other weapons that are already good?

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It did answer it, it was just not a statement.

Yes in some aspects it will be better, cleaving hordes. So lets say you’re a slayer and you have dual axes for anything armored -> swap to pick for hordes.

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The falchion has identical single target damage (against unarmored infantry).
It will need just as many hits for a clanrat/marauder unless you land a headshot.
Regarding hordes, it’s a little different. It’s damage drops of less and it hits the same amount of enemies.
However, the pick is able to stagger more than twice as many.

I personally wouldn’t say it’s charged attack is too slow, it has some immense burst damage. My problem is more with the cumbersomeness, I’d say it deserves some increased lunge and the like, instead.

On slayer, it’s one of the most meta picks. It staggers the same amount of enemies as the 2h hammer, but damages far more and can’t be interrupted, making it less likely to get overwhelmed.
The 1h hammer offers far less damage, even with better safety, the 2h axe offers far less safety, even with higher damage.

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Can’t believe I forgot to mention this part! Yeah, not getting interrupted is awesome.

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I use war pick on my slayer as horde clearing weapon. Works wonders.

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17

Super charge hit should instakill stormvermin to the body and deal more damage overall like in V1.

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18

Ooh, i’ve made many posts here ever since closed beta on pick (less than shields tho).

I can’t believe some1 defends the pick. Simply because its able to kills hordes with slayers awesome perks such as damage resist, leap, +25% movement speed after leap, and probably swift slaying(which have great synergy with leap - faster attacks means more chances to proc SS).

Played Ironbreaker yesterday with pick+handgun, and the risk:reward ratio is way too high outside of horde fights, and in horde fights w/o great speed boosts its loses a bit to greathammer due to worse swing angles - not quite good at controlling enemies in wide arcs.

The high risk comes from:

  1. The weapon is soo clumsy when you cant block mid swing, and a long time after it hits, for all attack types. Its fine if it could be compensated good enough, but its not.

  2. Mobility is bad with its block run speed and dodge. Would be fine if compensated enough, again.

So we have low mobility weapon that gets you bogged down easily if you’re required to kite, each swing is a risk(esp. chargeds), because of slow wind-ups, cant block mid swing and for a time after it connects even, which is a very rare trait.

And what good it does:

  1. high mass limit for stagger on lights, whith good range and not bad attack rate.

And thats pretty much it. Damage cleave is low, the damage to 2nd+ targets is low, so its horde dps isnt impressive, ok fine, its cc+dps against hordes. But should an elite insert himself into the fray, you suddenly become nerfed way too hard.

Because here’s what greathammer/1h hammer have, but pick has not: faster single target attack with strong damage. It doesnt matter if, lets say, a pick deals double damage in heavy charged relative to 2h hammer light - if it takes double the time it becomes simply unusable in any real, ongoing fight. And i’ve used it with +10% atk speed on IB, getting punished half the time i tried to utilize Chargeds in difficult situations.

So my opinion is that if you, say as a dev, double the charge/windup time of a swing (charged pick), then you need to increase the damage not by the same factor, to match the same theoretical dps. You have to account for the practical side, like making sure the risk:reward ratio is equal. And the current charged attack damages are actually very pitiful, you need ~15% power breakpoint to make heavy charge one-bs a stormvermin(!). The charged attacks should either be much faster, or deal much more damage.

I like the damage way, bodyshot damage is doubled accross the board, with less focus in headshots(less damage finesse multi). And the heavy charged remains unique, but becomes actually viable.

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19

Well this just facilitates choice, Imo dual axes does everything else better than hordes, so i only really switch weapons on hordes. But you did back it up with just calling it ‘‘cumbersome’’.

YES, it’s a chunky weapon and the charge attack is something left to be desired EVEN with attack speed buffs, the pace of the game is just too fast for such a high risk move that doesnt reward you very well.
But in the end i feel few weapons sweep hordes faster than pick / slayer ( except certain ranged weapons )

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I think the War Pick is pretty alright but I do agree on that the charge attacks could be more effective against armor. There’s just too much risk in using either lvl 1 or 2 charge unless you initate your first strike with it. I’m not sure if I missed anyone mentioning it, but it seems (I’ve seen some post about it and felt results myself) to me that Warpick is harder to be interrupted with mid-light-swing than with some other weapons I’ve tried, which is why I absolutely love using it for Slayer over 2h hammer which relies on a jousting charge spam to be effective on hordes.