I already bought the pre-launch statue for sm2 a year ago, I didnt go as far to get 2 (to keep one sealed) but I was itching. For context, I don’t collect the mini’s, unless skaven bursts onto 40k end-times and blows up the universe, then I might have to empty my savings.
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I agree they missed the mark a little bit with voice over work in SM2, however DoW voices have been memed on a lot for being campy, Angelos especially.
Hard to project a voice of a near demigod for sh*t pay, i suppose.
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I think this is probably the least generous take you could have. I don’t deny that there are absolute dribblers out there in droves and droves but to conflate the success of straightforward user friendly systems with the expectations of stupid people I think is intellectually dishonest. Not to masturbate my own ego too much, but I consider myself a reasonable above average intelligent person and I, as I mentioned, do not find it to be as simple as “more complexity=good”.
As far as the gameplay loop is concerned, I’m not sure exactly what you mean by it being mid. Like any replayable online game, the greatest reward is in the play itself, is it not? Even with that being the case, the game clearly has a progression system the same way almost any other game of its kind has one. Does it really need several branches of configurable skills to be worthwhile? If it achieves a high level of player agency and choice whilst using a clearer and slimmed down skill tree as compared to DT, is that not a greater achievement? I don’t know that it will be yet of course, but from what I’ve seen (which is virtually every piece of coverage on it at this point) it offers enough meaningful choices for it to require engagement from the player, which is ultimately the point.
See, this is kind of exactly what is not simple about DT. This is already really intricate, for better or worse. My view is this; Weapons should have a clear niche or function and should generally revolve around that in as straightforward a manner as possible. A heavy attack, a light attack and a special attack of some kind that can all be combined into combos of varying kinds suffices as far as attack mechanics go. DT goes a step further in that it has combos within each type of attack. Each one of those combos consists of different types of attack and those all vary in what they do. These combos can then be merged and spliced in different ways. It definitely adds a lot of complexity, but is that inherently better than a system that does essentially the same with fewer layers? Again, it’s a question of taste and personally I don’t feel that it is any better.
Like almost every piece of 40k media, they forget to add a lower baseline of bass to space marine voices, considering they’re enormous. Other than that, I think they’re fine. Remember that these are Ultramarines. They’re meant to be the clean cut, no BS professionals of the Astartes so all that overt zealotry would be thoroughly out of place.
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I thought they did a good job with Sa’kan of The Salamanders in Pariah Nexus.
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That is true but it was an exception more than it was the norm, unfortunately. Another good outlier is the Guilliman voice over in the 10th edition trailer.
DT does a bad job of teaching people. The itemization system is very poor. However I would like to emphasize that I am referring to game play and not inventory management or whatever.
Again I think you are confused by what I mean. I don’t think it needs a skill tree or a deep progression loop. I just don’t think the game or the missions will be engaging enough to play more than doing the campaign and all the co op missions once.
How? Is memorizing 2 combos that intricate? In SPM 2 every weapon looks to have 3-5 combos you have to memorize. Is that too intricate?
And at least in the case of the Power Maul, it is an exceptionally strong weapon so it should be harder to use. That is why things like the Power Swords and to some extent the Pickaxes don’t make sense, they are incredibly powerful but also very easy to use.
I don’t get what you are saying here. It’s bad that you can stop a combo in the middle of it to switch to another combo?
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That’s fair enough but it’s also subjective. To me it looks different. To each their own, ultimately.
It’s intricate in that the system has a far greater spectrum of combinations as it’s far more dynamic than something like SM1/SM2. There were combos in both those games but they’re set ones that do not allow for any melding. The SM approach is basically “this set combo is good for crowd control, this set combo is good for single target damage, etc”. The DT approach is not that simple, but instead focuses on combining different attacks by type and these combinations vary between weapon types and weapon marks. I’m not saying that it’s too hard to do or anything, I’m saying that it has layers to it that (I think) no other game has. You may like it and that’s fine, I’m just saying I don’t because I think it’s too complicated for not enough reward.
I’m referring to the attack breakdowns you can see in each weapon. Spamming light attacks generates one combo of attacks, spamming heavy attacks generates another. Different combos emerge depending on where you place what kind of attack and that creates a lot more intricacy. It’s just an objective observation but we have different opinions on whether that fact is a good thing or not. My point is just that it makes the game tough to get into if you’re not already and even for someone like me (at least one with the same opinion) it is tedious more than it is rewarding.
The SM2 weapon breakdowns that are up as of today show each melee weapon as having around 5 combos, give or take. Just by reading their names it seems they’re focused at dealing with different types of things, which is functionally what DT does as well only DT does it in a way that is objectively less straightforward. That doesn’t mean that the DT system is bad, only that it demands more from the player engaging with it. If that’s a good thing or a bad thing is up to each individual. To me it’s not necessary or worthwhile when the same effect could be achieved in a simpler manner without actually eliminating any functionality.
I think we just have differing tastes, for what it’s worth. We’ll probably have to agree to disagree.
I didn’t think I would like 3rd person but I ended up liking HD2’s implementation and look forward to SM2 for varieties sake!!
Blasting nids with the Storm Bolter looks fun!!
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Speaking only for myself… depth in gameplay comes precisely from having more “layers” to factor into your decisions and choices at a given moment - and I’m talking specifically about combat gameplay here.
That there (a) different attack patterns and that these can be (b) spliced together in different combinations means that in theory there are many different patterns of attack on any given weapon to learn and master, AND learn how to apply to different combat situations and enemy combinations. It may not matter in most situations, but there are situations where it does matter - and this is an opportunity to develop your game skill. Complexity, in this case, enables a very high skill ceiling - and this ultimately is why I want to play the game: to get better at it. It’s why people can true solo auric damnation and why it’s so impressive to see.
A simpler system might be fine for 90% of the audience and on lower difficulties, but it would also limit the depth potential of the game overall.
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If anything DT need more ‘complicated’ weapons, and not simplified variants (Mk XV Heavy Eviscerator).
Give a weapon that work like Bretonnian Sword, or Kruber’s Halberd
for me its not competing in any field really.
first, i’m a happy child that still likes his toys.
not ashamed of having preserved that primal joy about it at 44 years of age.
so ironically darktide got me into warhammer in the first place and having mcfarlane producing 7 inch figures, i snatched up a couple dozen by now.
(i fancy poseable figures)
for the longest time i combine ingame immersion and gameplay enjoyment with something “physical” to collect/display
1/6 figures for all major games so far, fallout, resident evil, mortal kombat, dark souls etc etc.
until my space ran out in 2 rooms of the house.
(plus fallout power armor figures being around 500€ each after taxes/shipment, army building aint within my salary class, 7 inch space marines though…)
anyways,
darktide provides a way to prevent my skills from catching further rust, offer a quake-esque physic with a deliciously gritty artstyle and design.
totally down my alley and giving me endless replayability due to its gameplay.
darktide is about skill and frenzy for me.
now i guess i’ll enjoy space marine 2, but rather as a “canvas” sort of thing to recreate my ultra marine figures mangle tyranids(which i painted a “few” by now)
its far to console-ish to be a “main-game” over years but a nice different window into the amazing 40k universe.
all i hope is to be able to switch off all the huge ui/crosshair/hitmarker fireworks that soil the great atmosphere.
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I think you have a correct perspective/take overall, but it all just boils down to why someone plays in the first place. For myself, and I’m sure at least a noteworthy amount of other people, I wouldn’t play DT if it wasn’t a 40k game. The only reason I was interested in it, or even VT2 back in those days, was because of the setting. I was hoping for a straightforward coop PvE game that would be fun with friends in the vein of L4D or, in hindsight, Helldivers 2. To my own slight personal disappointment, the game is more focused in on the skill honing aspect than the 40k atmosphere and narrative aspect. That’s all well and good if you’re someone who likes that. I’m not dunking on anyone who does, I’m only saying I don’t like it as a primary point of focus. To me the best games are the ones that nail atmosphere, narrative and immersion that also combine it all with a combat/gameplay system that is engaging and readily masterable (new word for you’s). DT only really gets one of those first three things right all the way and the other two are lacking or basically missing. SM2 seems to me like a game that hits more of the right notes that I’m looking for.
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a game made for dudes collecting tiny figures sells outfits to customise your ingame character, shocker really.
maybe the games main appeal to some in the first place is seeing their “toys” in motion.
while not great in quality i did enjoy the odd warhammer+ animation to see some, well… animated lore.
space marine 1 didnt have the greatest gameplay (it was a fun “filler-game”) but being spess muh’een butchering orks was visually pleasing (at the time) in a visceral/gritty way that scratched the warhammer itch for people.
if sm2 does the same that’d more than enough to be a “success”
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Not sure it will interest me. I follow it, and if I find a good price, maybe.
Must say that I am not a warhammer fan. I played RPG warhammer fantasy, but not a lot and it was not my favorite universe. So let’s say it… I don’t care if the game is in warhammer universe, I don’t care about it at all.
Speaking of the preview, I feel it like it could be a good solo moment… but it doesn’t look like it will be good in multiplayer. I am not reluctant about TPS… but… don’t know, it doesn’t feel at all like darktide. You play a space marine and this change a lot. Fights looks like scenarized…
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So an ultramarine… Sounds to me like their voice direction is in tune with that stuff.
F the halberd, animation cancelling is biggest malignant growth of tide or any game.
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The cosmetics are dlc purchases
So it’s just real world money and not funny bucks
I’m actually fine with that. I’ve played tons of ARPGs and RPGs and RTS’s over the years. It’s really just 3rd person perspective in what otherwise could (should!?) be an FPS that bugs me. It’s like a 1/4 of the center of the screen where I want to be aiming is taken up by my some bro-figure jumping around.
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I know that part and that’s certainly better than how far too many other games do it. My only (potential) concern is what they’ll actually lock behind a paywall. In the video in the OP he mentions something about 20% of colours being locked behind DLC, which might be a problem unless they’re some really out there, niche colours. Hard to say at this stage but it’s just something I picked up apropos this conversation.
I’d assume they will lock chapter colour schemes behind paywall I’d assume it will be more second founding stuff and elite unit cosmetics for first founding chapters
It’s been established that black templar are a dlc cosmetic bundle
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I must admit that I prefer FP to 3P, but when it comes to co-op, the importance of player perspective is trumped by the co-op experience.
Whether SM2 actually has a good co-op experience or not is yet to be seen, but if it does, chances are pretty good that SM2 will steal a lot of my DT time away.
DT’s co-op experience is weighed down HEAVILY its social approach, which promotes randomisation of player matching over community building and team bonding.
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