Snipers currently are massively overtuned

Sigh. I am getting so, so sick of people cherry picking single points to go after when they weren’t even the primary aspect of my post. (Not to mention the entire point of the latter portion of my post being that I was speaking in overall general terms and didn’t want to dig into it)

They should buff underperforming stuff to be better instead.

Yes. They should. I never said they shouldn’t. Nerfing the top performers doesn’t equal not buffing the underperformers. Just going to take a post had already made:


They need nerfed. That doesn’t mean they need to be useless, like some of them such as speedload. There’s a middle ground, right now those blessings are way over performing, even in comparison to the difficulties. Running a full on meta setup absolutely trivializes even damnation, which is where the need to nerf comes from. Slaughterer would still be viable even if it capped out at 5%/stack, let alone its current power at 15%/stack. Brutal momentum would still be usable if it was something like a bonus 100% cleave, let alone its current unlimited cleave. Pinning fire is just a mess, between how easy it is to stack and how these power blessings interact with other things like ascendant blaze on psyker, making it even more messy for balance. It also comes down to other issues like class balance and how they interact along with the shared weapons and all that.

I also want the useless blessings buffed, speedload should be way stronger than it is for being a situational buff requiring multiple inputs just to achieve. Then you have blessings that can effectively do nothing on some things like psyker staves. Ideally blessings should change how you interact with the game in some manner, right now the overtuned blessings are just raw boosts that require very little input to get a huge power boost. Slaughterer is a massive increase for literally just doing what you already should be doing for example.


Currently, there is no weapon in the game, that obviously dominates damage output in practice.

laughs in pinning fire autopistol/bolter and brutal momentum axes

You claim that certain things overperform massively, but when you play a lot of pubs (using the scoreboard and a mod that shows you the exact loadout of your teammates), you will notice that in the hands of >95% of the players that you see on damnation difficulty, this is not the case.

I exclusively play pubs and do use the scoreboard. The difference between somebody using meta weapons and somebody not is massive, even when somebody plays poorly. They also enable you to get away with a lot dumber plays in the first place due to your ability to just delete anything that gets you in trouble. To make things up to par with the aforementioned blessings they would literally need to add 75%+ power to every single blessing/weapon. You seriously don’t see the issues that would cause, when the game is already too easy on damnation on the whole?

So you would nerf something for “overperforming” in the hands of probably less than 1% of the playerbase.

They overperform at every level. They require little to no extra input to double your output. That is not well balanced. A poor player using slaughterer/pinning fire/brutal momentum will easily do way more while changing nothing about the way they play. It’s not purely about them doing maximum damage on the scoreboard, you don’t balance it around somebody playing poorly.

2 Likes

This old thread has gone waaaaay off topic…
:slight_smile:

DMs ?

What i did, is not cherry picking. I simply addressed a claim that you made and that i do not agree with.

In the section that i replied to, you were quite specific.

Still no. Just your opinion.

You know how many psykers i have seen, making use of the interaction between pinning fire and soulblaze across more than 1000 matches played?
Three.

Strangely, in practice (as i said earlier) more than 95% of the players who use them (on damnation), do not dominate anything.
Not only that, but bolter and autopistol are not very frequently picked either.

Not true.
Some weapons are good without blessings. Some others desperately need certain blessings to function well.
A weapon that is decent by default, does not need access to the same power from blessings, as a weapon that is relatively bad by default.
For example, the autopistol without pinning fire is hot garbage.

Too easy for what percentage of the playerbase?
The vast majority of those who play damnation, do not even pull their own weight.
Most people do not play damnation in the first place, because they find it too difficult.

The simple solution would be, to just add an additional difficulty for those who want it (like always available HISTG, or EXTREME high int).
This has the additional benefit of not fecking over 95%+ of the playerbase in order to appeal to a few people who complain that the game is too easy.

If you compare the same person using the same weapon with and without that blessing, yes of course they will perform better with the blessing. Percentages are not that complex.

But as i said above, some weapons perform decently well by default (or with the blessings that they have access to) and do not need those blessings. The same player with one of these weapons with one of their top blessings, will perform on a similar level as if they were using a weapon that has access to the “overpowered” blessings.

Funny thing is, heavy swords have access to a brutal momentum equivalent and to headtaker, which is slaugherer but better.
I have never seen a single person complain about how overpowered that weapon is.

1 Like

In the section that i replied to, you were quite specific.

I’m not going to try to address every single bit of it while just discussing one enemy, there’s just too many moving parts to try to cover along with extenuating circumstances like server quality (or lack thereof) and general bugginess causing issues.

Still no. Just your opinion.

Because it was me saying that directly in response to the Reddit post. Which I copied. Which I said I copied. Which was directly asking if people thought if they needed nerfed. There’s a reason I linked it.

Things having a lower pick rate doesn’t equal them not being too strong, which is what a lot of what you’re saying boils down to. I personally don’t use the shredder on psyker for example, because it’s stupid as hell and absolutely silly how easy it is to play for how good it is.

Weapons being reliant on blessings is another issue, which I also have addressed before. Blessings and weapon balance are a mess all around. This includes with heavy sword, that’s not the winning point you think it is. Heavy swords shouldn’t require a blessing to not be terrible in the first place, nor should any weapon.

Can we move back to the point at hand? I am not going to sit here and repeat myself 50 times in a topic already not about this.

I literally only mentioned pick rate in a single sentence, that was not the base for any of the other arguments that i made.

Unless you want to include this point:

Me mentioning the frequency of encountering someone making use of this interaction is completely valid though, because nerfing something based on an interaction that most players will never encounter in their life, is stupid.
Out of those 3 guys that were making use of the interaction, 2 did not even perform above average and all 3 of them could be outperformed by simply using a staff.
The fact that i even remember this, should be telling. It happens so rarely that it effectively does not exist.

I do not agree that it is an issue at all. It simply means that some weapons need more of an invenstment than others.
And it would be even less of an issue, if we had a good crafting system.

Alright. Let’s end it here.

Snipers have had something change about them. They used to be fine untill patch 10. No matter the ping, the game showed you the laser, then the sound and then the shot would come your way. This was consistant and the timing was fair because it gave you two warning signs with relatively short time to react but it was possible.

Now there are a ton of instances in which no laser or sound plays before you get shot. I don’t care that “I could’ve seen them”, their warning signs used to work and now they don’t anymore.

I played on satelite internet and was able to dodge sniper shots consistantly (95%+ of the time) and now that I upgraded to glas fiber with 30× the download and upload I don’t even get the warning signs half the time? It has to be something on their end and it’s just annoying to have a special hit you with no warning.

2 Likes

Just press the key to dodge when you hear the sound it makes before firing.
It has a very recognizable sound when walking, this is enough for you not to go straight ahead without looking at anything.
Its laser is very visible even if it points at you from behind.
Its laser has its own sound when it has its sights on you.
In short, he already has enough clues to be attentive and evade them, personally I love this specialist and the role he plays, the times he took me by surprise for my reaction a laugh and admiration for some of his behavior, how are you getting closer to hit him and he decides to run away haha,

It already bothers me that people are complaining about the skills that various specialists have, little by little they take away the interest of the high difficulty, if it already annoys them or makes it not very enjoyable to be defeated every so often you can reduce the general difficulty of the game, there is 5 difficulty levels and that’s enough.

In the long run I fear that they will remove more unexpected abilities from each enemy, it was already a hard blow to see the mutant much clumsier due to the claims of people who complained about the difficulty around him.

Did you miss the part where multiple people have been pointing out that the snipers used to work correctly but now do not anymore?

This is no thread about snipers being OP in design but that they are functionally f*cked rn…

2 Likes

I mean they also felt the need to reply on my video from a true solo clip recommending wounds. In a true solo. The clip specifically about the timing being messed up. While telling me I’m complaining about difficulty when I’ve emphasized multiple times my problem is not difficulty.

Observation might not be their strongest point. “Just press the key to dodge” might be one of the silliest bits of advice I’ve seen in a while. Why didn’t I think of that? /s

1 Like

I’m still not up to speed with everything that transpired within this thread buuuuut…

Sniper, more noticeable… good one. “Just shoots at you out of the blue” is a definition of a karking sniper!

1 Like

That was a mistype. I should have said notable.

These nitpicks over nothing are getting even older. Love how none of my major points get addressed and instead it’s side comments and typos. Point of that statement is that they’re just not a particularly interesting special right now.

And getting shot out of the blue certainly doesn’t seem like the intended thing, nor does it make for particularly good gameplay for a game like Darktide. Also ‘sniper’… from ten feet away. Older clip but kinda sums up the point. A spawn callout would change how I would have approached that back at the time.

1 Like

I know, I know - it was poor choice of words. It was just too funny to not poke at. Very poor choice of words... - YouTube
I’m trying and failing to add humor before somebody starts rage-ing.

I understand where you’re coming from, at least, I hope I do, but I just do not agree.
Darktide is 40k game and I’m here for the military-grimdark part.

You can safely ignore me when I’m not justifing my point or you know - laugh a little?

1 Like

Snipers are fine. What needs fixing is the hit reg F*ckery, other netcode related nonsense, and the AI director dropping crap on top of teams and individual players. This is where problems like some of the ones noted in this thread come from.

1 Like

To be 100% blunt, this is another thing that’s getting really tiring to hear. I get that 40k fans are happy there’s a decent first person game that lets them (kind of) play as a guardsman, but unless you guys want there to be nothing left but 40k fans (even though I suspect that a ton of the people left playing are already those and most of the of non-40k fans have left) then you’re going to have to accept that the game needs to still actually maintain the game parts too, not just the 40k “You’re supposed to die so poor L4D-like game design is excusable.”

And no, no humor allowed >:( Only internet rage.

Zostań Czarnobylką/-kiem! - Spolszczenia czarnobylskie

1 Like

Yeah ehm…

As many have pointed out, they no longer are. They used to be fine but now just shoot you whenever they goddamn want, either with delayed warning signs or none at all.

So no, snipers are not fine, kindly “f*ck off” with such BS :slight_smile:

1 Like

Imagine being incapable of reading beyond the first sentence. Not even going to bother elaborating.

I find snipers most obnoxious when they are appearing in huge numbers outside of that horrible sniper gauntlet snooze I usually drop out of if I see in QP. In general I would agree that with the otherwise great and consistent design of the game and responding to cues in your environment not having any actual tell for them spawning is a very odd choice. Why. I don’t need to know where they are, just let me know if something I don’t always have access to the visual indicator is about to hit me and not just a regular volley of gunfire. kthx

Im all for Sound Queue like:
“I´ve got the Prey in my sight”! or something like that, yo you know a Sniper is on the field

many times they just wallhack you through walls and cover and you cant even see or ping them.
But the moment you step out of cover you get shot!

Good one. I did, in fact, read the rest but it has categorically nothing to do with what I highlighted and replied to or with the subject at hand.

How fast a sniper shoots you or that they skip warning sounds has nothing to do with the hit reg. or how much the AI director drops on the team.

If you want a smarter response than what you got, maybe elaborate beforehand the next time?

1 Like

I totally agree with you about the difficulty levels… however, I said it and say it again… if FS wants to make a successful game, they need to think the game for all players and this includes casual players.
However, a casual player can take lot of fun in a malice game. So, difficulty levels are here for this.
I personally think that there is a too big gap between malice and heresy. I would have increased the difficulty, a little, for the seddition, uprising and malice.

They must do both. Lot of blessings are totally garbage. Several weapons underperform (catachan swords by example), several outperform everything in game. They must adjust both.

I agree with you that a well trained player with one weapon can show you the potential of a weapon. This is not how you can see an OP weapon.
For me, the OP weapon is the one that can deal more DPS than the other weapons without taking in consideration the skill of a player.

They seriously do not need a nerf. Snipers are fine. Nerfing them would remove the threat they mean actually.
I agree with Deisu here… snipers don’t need a nerf. At malice the sniper don’t really hurt you… at damnation, that’s normal that you get a punishment for your error.
But, for your personnal problem, it is related to the network. Surely a part of the DT code… and surely a part of your own connection (ping in game).

indeed… this

1 Like