Shade Observations

Can someone help explain why a single light attack with dual daggers after activating Shade ult does more damage to armoured targets than a single light attack with sword and dagger? Daggers don’t have AP, it just seems like a random outcome.

I first noticed on Champ chaos warriors that I couldn’t one shot them with S&D light attack. Then tested on dummy. Turns out after ult, a single light attack does 18k to armour, using dual daggers. However only 4k with S&D.

I assumed her ult made the next attack hit damage cap regardless of weapon type. I was wrong.

Lastly why can’t we decide what voice lines she brings to the mission? I love it when she says ‘I walk beyond the light’ and ‘Shadewalk’ etc rather than ‘LUMBERFOOTS’. It seems that somtimes she loads in with cool lines ready, sometimes she has her generic Waystalker lines.

There’s a bug at present - the voice lines that the heroes use is based on the career that the host last used, not the career that you’re using. So if the host last used Waystalker (super common) then you won’t get your Shade lines.

For your light attack issue, it’s likely related to the fact that the first two swings with the sword and dagger are slashing attacks, and the 3rd and 4th swing are stabbing attacks. All of the dual daggers attacks are stabbing ones, and presumably receive a higher increase in damage during the shade ultimate.

That would make a lot of sense re voice lines. Thanks.

Re light attacks are you positive? They look likes slashes in 3rd and 1st person, but perhaps they are considered stabs to determine damage?

If that’s the case it’s a bit annoying as we can’t reliably know what attacks are what type.

The ult damage increase procs for the first attack that connects. Try hitting nothing for the first attack and stab with the second (or 3d, 4th etc. depends on the highest damage one). I’ve used this with glaive and spear charged attacks to maximize boss damage and against CW.

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It doesn’t do more than 25k per weapon if i’m not mistaken? The dual stab on daggers is lethal but I haven’t tried 2nd charged glaive hit

Sorry, I probably used poor terminology. The first 2 attacks on the sword and dagger are attacks with the sword that can hit more than 1 enemy, whereas the dagger attacks can’t.

My presumption is that the ultimate increases hero power, but the daggers have poor cleave and so receive the vast majority of the bump to their damage. In comparison, the sword swing has the hero power bump distributed amongst the various stats.

As hero power scales up it affects damage, but it also affects cleave and stagger; how much it affects each is determined by the weapon type. Here’s some made up numbers that might help illustrate:

Gaining 100 hero power on Sword

  • 60 of it goes to damage
  • 30 of it goes to cleave
  • 10 of it goes to stagger

Gaining 100 hero power on Dagger

  • 90 of it goes to damage
  • 0 of it goes to cleave
  • 10 of it goes to stagger

So if you were to gain 500 hero power from the ultimate, the dagger would receive a higher bonus to damage because the weapon type is more focused on damage and less on cleave and stagger.

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Great insight. Appreciate that.

Perhaps the S&D can eliminate several targets at elite or lower in one swing under Shade ult. I’ll have to do some more tests.

I love the dual daggers but I’m affraid they’d be next to useless with horde control in legend so moved to S&D for a bit. However the damage output is totally different and having to wind up two charges for a good headshot can be a challenge sometimes.

You can also intentionally miss attacks, as @Shoovul mentioned, so you could hit air with the first charged attack, and then hit your target with the second charged attack. Obviously, not always possible in horde situations to miss that first attack though.

edit: Oh! Also worth mentioning, is that both weapons deal damage now (in V1 only the weapon in your right hand mattered) when doing a charged attack that swings both weapons. So a charged daggers attack will deal damage from both daggers and scale well with boosted hero power / crits.

@Bloodseeker I’ve just tested on the armored dummy and the glaive 2nd hit does 25575 on the second charged attack headshot the same amount as on the unarmored dummy.

Also 17250 on first charged attack headshot if you manage the wonky jump (don’t try it in a real match, it’s super unreliable even against a stationary dummy and you will lose the ult damage buff on the 2nd attack).

So to get the most out of Shade ult, daggers is advisable as you can do 25k x2 with a charged attack. However glaive takes care of the rest of the mission… which to choose? :slight_smile:

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