Hi,
I’ve read many posts here saying that the Ogryn is only viable at higher diffculty levels with a shield. This is simply NOT true.
I have more than 70 hours playing Ogryn only on the beta, I have done many heresy runs, with AND without friends, I have tried all the weapons and equipments possible, including the shield of course, and let me tell you this : If you don’t enjoy the gameplay with a shield, you DON’T have to play with it.
Actually, I have WAY more success playing the Ogryn without a shield, because despite what a lot people think, Ogryn is NOT a tank who is supposed to be in front.
He is NOT Bardin from Vermintide 2 and people need to stop thinking that Darktide classes are a copy of Vermintide classes, here is why :
- His height : Compared to Bardin, you will block a LOT the line of sight (LOS) of your teammates by standing in front, especially in small corridors. And no, with all the mess going on when you have hordes + multiples elites/special, and as you don’t have eyes behind your back, it is impossible not to block the LOS of some very important shots from a Veteran who is trying to kill a sniper for example.
- His hitbox : you will take WAY more hits than Bardin because of your hitbox if you play him in front, and in heresy, even the shield is not enough sometimes.
- In Darktide, there is WAY more ranged ennemies than in Vermintide, and you need to get rid of them as soon as possible. So while you’re standing there doing nothing hiding behind your shield, there is less shot thrown at ennemies, so less ennemies dying, and the more time you lose, the worst it gets in Heresy. You need to kill as much things as fast as possible, especially in Endless hordes mode.
- In Darktide, you don’t have temporary health when you hit ennemies like in Vermintide 2, making the Ogryn, again, less tanky than Bardin.
- Ogryn feats (talents) are FAR from being as good as Bardin’s if you insist playing him as a tank. So, again, he is NOT a tank with his actual feats tree + all the things I mentionned above.
So if he is not a tank, what is the Ogryn? Answer : He is a bruiser/support staggering machine :
- Bruiser : He can be as good in close combat as in ranged if you give him the good loadout, making him very versatile compared to some other classes who rely mostly on ranged or close combat because of their ultimate/passives/feat tree. You can play him agressively if you want or need to, but also defensively if things start to go wrong. You will always be good and useful in any kind of fight, melee or ranged.
- Support : Your ulti is VERY VERY good, and a lot of people don’t understand this. You can use it agressively to charge in, you can use it to regen your thoughness( I will talk more about this below), you can use it to counter charge a plague Ogryn or a mutant, you can use it to rush and help a teammate blocked in a corner, you can use it to make room around a fallen teammate and revive him, you can use it to put a lot of elites/specials on the ground, so you and your teammates can kill them easily, etc etc…
There is so many ways to use it, it is absolutely amazing if you know when you should use it, and NOT use it.
Also, the fact that you can revive teammate without being interrupted is VERY important in Heresy, because there is pretty often someone that is on the ground. A small thing too, but being able to carry heavy objectives without being slowed down, saved some games for me. - Stagger machine : Well, his passive of course, but also most if not all of Ogryn weapons, melee or range ones, can stagger or put mobs on the ground very easily, making life easier for everyone.
So, how to play him? Answer : Play him near your teammates, or actually BEHIND is even better, but never in front. Yes, I said BEHIND.
Why behind? So you wont block any LOS, plus that makes you very aware of what is happening to your teammates, so you can use your ulti to save/help them. Because yeah, standing in front make you unaware of what is happening to them, and the few seconds you will have to turn back, see what is happening and press your ulti, it may be too late AND you’re turning your back on every ennemies that are in front in top of that, so they can shoot/hit you in the back. Yeah, no thank you, stay behind, so you can help anyone instantly, and be in a safe position.
The ONLY time you may want to stay in front is to “tank” a boss, as you can last a bit longer than other classes, but again, you’re not Bardin, and you don’t have any taunt ability, so yeah…
You will have your range weapon in your hand most of the time to deal with any ranged ennemy (because they are the biggest problem in Heresy difficulty), then swap to your melee weapon for hordes and every ennemies that are on their own and are not ranged.
In melee, you want to do a “light attack then heavy attack” combo with your MK3 cleaver, that is the best way to deal with hordes, and the animation is really fast when you chain it, so it works well against any other ennemy too. Always aim for the ennemies weak spot if possible of course.
Feats wise, I would suggest :
- LVL 5 : “Best form of defense” : Works really well with multiplae feats in the tree, and our passive “+10% damage on heavy attacks”
- LVL 10 : “Blood and thunder” : Only because we are going to pick another talent at LVL 20 who goes with it, and also because we are going to do a lot of heavy attacks anyway. Note than for now, bleed do crappy damage, hopefully they will buff it soon, but you don’t pick that feat for the damage anyway.
- LVL 15 : “Bullfighter” : Absolutely amazing in heresy difficulty because there is so many elites than you will have your ultimate back in no time. And as I said, that ultimate is amazing and you want to use it. Plus, combo with LVL 30 feat.
- LVL 20 : “Bloodthirst”, to go with the LVL 10 talent. Thanks to this, you will most of the time be under 50% damage reduction, because it also works with the blood stacks given by other class like the zealot.
- LVL 25 : “Payback time” or “Raging bull”. I have tested both, I need to test them more to be sure and do some maths, but I have the feeling that “Payback time” is a bit better, because it helps dealing with boss or other elites easier. “Raging bull” is strong againts hordes BUT you don’t really need that extra damage for hordes in the first place. In the other hand, you can struggle a bit more against some elites, like the armored ones. Now, “Payback time” means that you need to get hit first, but don’t worry, you will get hit in heresy difficulty ! I suggest you test both and pick the one you prefer until someone do the complete maths on it.
- LVL 30 : “Non-stop violence”. 100%. No “Bull gore”. Why? Because with all the heavy attacks that you are going to do, you don’t really need more blood stacks, especially if you have zealots too in your party. On the other hand, “Non-stop violence” is amazing to save you and get all of your thoughness back by doing just one charge on a horde. Works really well with the LVL 15 feat as I mentionned because you will have you ultimate ready really quickly, as long as you and your party kill elites, which happens all the time in Heresy difficulty.
Loadout wise, I would suggest :
Melee weapon : I STRONGLY suggest the MK3 cleaver. After many tests, it is the one working the best :
- MK3 cleaver. Good damage, good cleave, fast animations, and the “Light attack-Heavy attack” combos works really well against any ennemy.
- MK4-6 cleaver : Works too, but I think the animations are worse and slower than the MK3.
- Bully club : If you REALLY want to stagger a lot, it works really well, but you will not do much damage.
- Shovel : Works surprinsigly well, I put it just after the MK3 cleaver if I wanted to switch. Good cleave, good damage. I still think that the MK3 is superior, but it is a nice alternative for the memes.
Range weapons : We have more choice than the melee ones, and it mostly comes to personal preference, so pick the one you prefer :
- Heavy stubber : My personal favourite, for a couple of reasons. Good damage, very good suppression, very big ammo clip so you dont have to reload every 5 seconds, works really well on hip shooting, and accurate at medium/long range if you understand how the recoil is working (it has a very similar recoil pattern than the AK47 from CSGO for those who know what i am talking about). Again, I have seen people here saying that this weapon is not accurate, but it is because they didn’t play with it enough, you just have to get used to the recoil.
- Ripper gun (any kind) : Works really well too. More direct damage than the heavy stubber, very good at hip firing an elite or special. Nice accuracy. Easier to use than the heavy stubber if you really can’t get used to the recoil. The main and only drawback for me is the ammo capacity clip…I spend a bit too much time reloading for my taste, and you will fight more with sharing the ammo with your veteran than with the heavy stubber.
- Rumbler : I personally dislike it, but I can’t deny his good point : Really good damage and stagger capacity, you can put a lot of things on the ground with this bad boy. Good accuracy too. A bit long to reload for my taste though.
- Grenade launcher : Really good weapon, good damage, put a lot of things on the ground, really good to shoot then hide behind a wall with a dash, then dash and shoot again, etc…Careful with the very long range shots, as you will need to aim above your target to hit it.
Curios :
- I need to more tests, but two “health %” + one “+1 wound” works well for now.
And…this is it I think? Note that I am NOT saying that the shield is useless, or bad. I have seen very good Ogryn players with shield perform really well. BUT, for my taste, and I know for a lot of people, it is not fun to just be a bullet sponge (and not even a good one compared to Bardin in top of that), and not do much thing most of the game.
Al I am saying is that you DO NOT have to play with a shield, and don’t let anyone tell you otherwise. I just don’t want people following the “Ogryn without a shield is useless” trend ruining the experience of YOU, my dear Ogryn fellow player, who wants to play the game the way you want. Plus, what they are saying is not true in the first place.
I also don’t want Ogryn players being kicked from lobby just because people think they will be useless without a shield when it is far from the truth.
Because in the end, skill and communication is what matters the most in those games, I have 650+ hours on both Vermintide and Vermintide 2, and I have played or seen “weird” builds with “no meta” weapons, and still managed to complete every legendary difficulty map.
Sorry for the long post, and I hope it will help some Ogryn players who wanted to give up on their character because of a false trend.
