I just saw a comment that mentioned how in DRG matchmaking allows for the option to clone character or to set roles to fill. I think Darktide could benefit from this system of allowing players to really choose who they want. If would pair really well witch DLC cosmetics for those of you who don’t want to see the same character, as their is so many possible skins to have in 40k. Obviously Fatshark been letting this cook, but this feature is a liked rarity in co-op games like this. Really cool feature to miss out on.
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Yes it’s a nice feature, but I think most of people (so, including me) would prefer to have a better atmosphere and named character interaction rather than just generic class with no story, which is not really possible with clones. Also be variety of the weapons (and apparently they’ll do it even better here) allows to have the same playstyle with different heroes.
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well my first thought on that feature was that it gave players more options wich is i good thing,
but on second thought the ability have clone classes actually made the game expirence worse, ( i know you can disable clone classes) because each and every class is equally important on an operational level
i never felt “yay we have two scouts” or nice “3 gunners”(not even in a dreadnaught hunt) because having a dublicate in the team always means missing out on other vital abilitys. that said in the Fatshark horde games (vermintide 1&2 and possibly darktide aswell) the charakters are not as set in stone as in DRG, your purpose in a mission is more defined by the career/loadout (in V2) and loadout (in V1). so theoreticly its not as important to actually have every charakter like it is in DRG,
because each character most likely has the ability to fullfill the role you want them to fullfill (picking bardin doesnt mean you have to be a tank for example) but again, its also an argument against a feature like “clones” beacause it donest matter as much wich charakter you have you can probably fulfill any “role” you like anyway, and giving up one of Fatsharks main things “voice acting and interactions” i mean would vermintide really be vermintide without viktor constantly being snarly at everyone, kerillian being arrogant and sarcastic or just bardin singing?
for me i much rather have the atmosphere than 4 grailknights or egnineers
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I agree the voice lines and interactions between characters is a key feature of vermintide 2 that really adds to the game’s charm. The voice acting and character interactions in DRG are absolute dogshit. If Darktide followed the DRG model it would be a worse game.
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Thats why you make it an option. if you play with role fill the characters can interact as per usual with all the banter. Though much like in DRG some players just want to level up their favorite class (in this case character). Also i doubt the character would stay silent as their is voice lines for other things like potions, being wounded, spotting enemies.
I KNOW that darktide will follow the same model as the previous title, so none of that enjoyable character experience will change. What I’m asking for is the feature that allows me to create a match that permits that or to join a match that permits that. Essentially turn a mod into an in game feature so that it is option.
It should always be assumed that a clone match will have an imbalance, but thats why you play a clone match. Imagine overwatch with everyone playing bastin. it dosent really work out in the long term, but it can be fun for the players all doing some cheesy build.
I don’t want this feature to deprive anyone of the good time the devs have planned. All i ask is that it be considered to give the community the choice of a more casual fun experience.
well in v2 you have the option to never get matched in a lobby where your character is occupied
so i dont see how that would be impossible.
giving players more options and choices doesnt nessesarily translate to a more enjoyable experience
many problems can arise by having more options
this could spread the already thin playerbase
not to mention that adding UI elements seem probelmatic for fatshark riddled with many bugs and specific crashes i dont see a reasonable benefit
instead of incorporating mod content in the game i much rather have them iron out problems and add new content
considering you can just get the mod and have a fun time with your buddys its not even hard to DL mods
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Well if you believe less is more I doubt I can change your mind. If me and the boys have to wait for mods then we will wait.
Just think fatshark is gonna miss out on a great feature to extend to future projects
The problem arises when the meta becomes 4 of the same career, very bland and boring gameplay, and if it’s the most optimal it wont feel good playing anything else.
DRG is more casual so it works there.
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The problem with your statement is that you saying its forced. If you going to join a match that allows cloning you shouldn’t expect meta. And the point of allowing a clone match is that 4 people would join a game with the understanding that they would be probably see the same 4 or 3 or 2 characters. It’s not taking away an experience if you add a feature unless you believe no one is going to play role fill.
If you think this post is within enough reason to shift the whole community into playing clones on every available match you’re wrong. That or you’re right and it turns out your in the minority (but come on).
I like to play who I want to play as i assume you would like to play your hero. I dont mind playing with 3 of the same characters, but you do because factor X. The solution is I play with 3 like minded individuals and you play with 3 like minded people. The only requirment is the ability to host a match with and without cloning. We both win and have fun.
If you and I wanted to play the same character one of us would have to wait a turn and I dont want this game to turn into players getting kicked because low level alternatives. Hell my group did it and it sucked
Like Cedric.d.shmidtke said, their are other features the dev’s have more focus on which is why this is nothing more than a suggestion.
I 100% believe this game is going to be fun. I just think the dev’s can make it 110%. Nothing less. The whole community deserves to have fun
Balancing the game around the possibility of 4 players of the same career will result in one of two outcomes:
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The classes all get very distinct areas of expertise and support abilities that make them very strong with 1 in the group but with diminishing returns if you add more. This is how it is in DRG, and while I think it’s an ok system for a casual game like DRG, I don’t feel that it fits with vermintides philosophy (DRG is about adventure/exploration, vermintide is about overcoming challenges). This will make multiple careers on one character not a viable option.
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Balance is done as it is in vermintide which will result in the meta being multiple of the same career, either 4, 3-1, 2-2, 2-1-1. The gameplay will become shallow and balance will have to be done so that every careers has the same strengths and weaknesses. It will be very hard to balance 3 careers in one character.
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It’s understood that balance is thrown off when cloning, but the point of cloning to allow players to play what they want with balance being damned. I know 4 ogryns are going to be busted that what WE want. The devs should not balance something that isn’t capable of being balanced, but thats the points.
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I respect your opinion about the style, but to me its all about killing endless hordes of the same faced enemy. For me killing the same model enemy 20x in a match gets as casual as it can be. IM ok with it as a viable option and im sure some part of community couldn’t care less about philosophy.
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I don’t expect balance in a clone match because i don’t care. If the enemies are popping to quickly we up the difficulty to max. You say shallow i say fun. The difference is that no one is forcing you to play with me. YOU play with people who say the same. I play with people who want pure, mindless “FUN” as we all play with what ever character we enjoy most.
THE only people who lose would be Fatshark, but I personally believe this will do more good than harm.
My suggestion would be to just play modded if you want to play the same character. I get your point that it doesn’t matter because of PvE game, but I don’t agree. I think balance is very crucial, even in a PvE game.
I wouldn’t mind if they added it as an option if that option removed rewards and xp (so it became more like cata is in vermintide, just for the challenge/fun). Don’t know if it’s a good idea to split the playerbase like this, but who knows, maybe darktide will have a bigger following than vermintide.
Anyways no point in discussing it further, it’s clear we both have different opinions and both are valid.
Lets just agree to disagree.
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Yeah that would be a neat Feature. From what youi can read on the Forum, lots of poeple would like to have this option.
In DRG however i thought you can have only 2x the same Class not more. But i havent played in a while so.
Let people play the same Class 4x if they wish it, why not. Since the game is said to be more Customizable, there is more option to have no Clones excpet in Voice nad “maybe” Ultimate ablities. But who knows, maybe we dont even have Ulitmates Abilites anymore?! FS said, its not Vermintide and some things will change, maybe even drastically!
I would hate for there to be a meta based on everyone picking the same class. Likewise, could you imagine playing Vermintide 2 as a front line class (Zealot or something) only to have 3 Pyromancers constantly shooting you in the back? I feel like it just creates a lot of problems.
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Well i see your reasoning, but i dont feel like it willl be META at any point.
YES people will try it out have fun, but in the Long Run they will play it mixed up. Diversity gives strength, so it is in V2 and so it will be in Darktide. But you can bet, we’ll see it until everyone is fully Leveled with that Class and some time Later again aswell.
Like i said, make it like DRG and you can only be able to have 2x the same Class, so you can pick Kasrkin and Seargent Guy(Women) 2x. there you go 4x times IMP.
Problem is if FS makes a exclusive Mode it could hurt finding peopz…
My idea would be maybe make a Mode which works only on Legend Diff and higher where you re allowed to have 4x the same Class. This way everyoine has to work to get there, which is Good, gives more Grind and have the Experience they want. As i recall, it was about being HC Gamemode where you Roleplay into it more or less and being Overwhelmed, having a Challenge only shooting Chaos with Flashlights and have the Experience of IMPS. MAybe even Kasrkin only, with Chainsword and Lasweapons only. This way everyone gets what they want and can have Fun?!
Look at DRG, you can have 2-4x the same Class, but thast doesnt mean youll see it all the time. Since player/ Class Synergy is very Important in DRG to be effective. But when you see it its mostly becasue some Players are Grinding that said Class up, or its just theyre favourite.
i think about having Synergies inbetween Class like a Buddy System. Also like in DRG.
Scout & Engie and Driller & Gunner. Same would work for DT, but this has to bee seen, sinc wwe hopefully can Focus on what Type we wanna play like Melee Heavy or Ranged Heavy.
So the Synergy is there but up to the Player. This could be very Handy due to having to split up at certain POints on some Maps and so on!
this argument doesnt translate well into fatshark’s horde games, DrG is different because its not just combat you also have to navigate/manipulate the map, without every class it gets significantly harder to do that, in vermintide its ultimately irrelivant if the sniper who took out the special is a sienna with boltstaff or markus with handgun…
i personly hope they won’t do a clone mode option, it takes away from the integrity and atmosphere if 3 out of 4 people play as jeff
the clonedwarf option also never added something to DrG, for me.
having clones in DrG is just worse than having a balanced party, missions take longer and the map gets more anoying to traverse without a significant benefit in my book, i rather not have the hassle of those goons who join my lobby and swap career to a dublicate even tho i specifically disabled that feature…
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Let’s not forget that Vermintide 2 is a lot heavier on the lore behind it, too.
And all the voice lines wouldn’t fit at all.
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Exclusive characters is the stronger choice. It’ll definitely rub one-character players the wrong way, but the benefits are just worth it (for character banter, and role distinction).
Removing class level and only having Player Level is one way to remove the abrasiveness of wanting to level your Kerillian only to be told you can’t play Kerillian in this match.
I do like class levels, so I would slightly prefer sticking to V2’s structure, but providing an XP bonus if you have to switch heroes. You’d also get that bonus if you queued “Flexible” which would get you into the best match available, trying to give you your current hero first, but flexibly filling as needed.
Also I really hope we get a Ready Button or purely UI-driven matchmaking. I really hate having to walk across the keep in V2 to ready up. It’s just so unnecessarily time-consuming.
I was talking about that since v1. I think lorewise they should have retired the Ubersreik Five and allowed for multiple careers. DRG is a much better coop experience. Vermintide forces you to play alone to get a better gaming experience.
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MM-Options I personally would find useful to include:
- Options Check-box to avoid matching with similar classes (when queuing solo)
- Display recommended level when queuing (at the moment I get lvl 5-7 players matched in rank4 missions which does not work - not saying to exclude them but highlight that they are maybe too low)
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