Let me vent a little: I'm grinding Dream Team and it's terribly painful, like the others penances... and like the crafting system. I'm starting to see a logical thread

[souI23]

Fatshark, why do you have so little confidence in your game? It’s good, I assure you we would play it just simply for the gameplay

I can’t understand with what logic, if not malicious, you could think of such a challenge (100 victories without none getting downed)… obviously, unless you have a team with headphones and 9999 hours each, it’s simply unthinkable to complete it in T5 difficulty

The way is to play T1, which is quite boring in itself, mainly once you reach level 30… but that’s not all, I’d be super happy if 100 runs were enough… but you will lose many, many times

You will find the Psyker who blows himself up. The unlucky player catapulted into the ravine by an exploding barrel that Castel Bravo is was firecracker… or by a monstrosity who barely touched you. You’ll find the player remaining behind and getting caught by a dog or trapper… or slipping into the ravine even without the help of a barrel. You will find the player, strictly level 25-30, who incredibly manages to die with a simple horde at T1 difficulty (how did they manage to reach level 30???)

(and all this without considering that the challenge was buggy until recently and I remember the description said “without dying” and not “without getting downed”… instead of fixing it did they directly change the description? But maybe I’m wrong on this point)

And please, don’t tell me “none forces you”. I know, I’m not even forced to play the game itself. But if develepors decided to add penances, they must be well done

Now, once the crying is over, I would like to make a slightly more serious speech

The whole Penances system is ridiculous. All the challenges require you to play incorrectly and counterproductively. If you want to complete them, you will have to ruin the game to the other players… because yes, this game, for divine reasons, does not allow you to play alone with bots in a private game
Many penance require an absurd RNG and waste of time… others you would like to face in specific maps, but obviously you can’t even choose the map!

As written at the beginning: Fatshark, why do you have so little confidence in your game?

This, the crafting system, the cosmetics shop… compared to Vermintide, it all seems so unfair to us players. An unhealthy desire to keep us glued to the game for the wrong reasons, like addicting gambling and grinding, instead of gameplay itself

[alsozara]

It’s crazy to me anyone cares enough about penances to go after them intentionally. Every now and then I see one get ticked off by just playing the game and it’s like oh cool I guess.

Not excusing the design of a bunch of them but achievement hunting seems like a great way to spoil a game like this for yourself. Break away from the brain work telling you to tick boxes and just have fun playing.

[zaygr]

Achievement hunt is one of the things you can actually work towards though, unlike crafting.
At least they eventually realised how toxic, random, unintuitive or counter to the whole game’s design a lot of the old class penances were and made them redacted.

[souI23]

@zaygr

Achievement hunt is one of the things you can actually work towards though, unlike crafting.
At least they eventually realised how toxic, random, unintuitive or counter to the whole game’s design a lot of the old class penances were and made them redacted.

That the crafting system is a way more serious problem, I totally agree… but I completated every redacted penance and I can assure they’re not that better than the old ones

@alsozara

It’s crazy to me anyone cares enough about penances to go after them intentionally. Every now and then I see one get ticked off by just playing the game and it’s like oh cool I guess.

Not excusing the design of a bunch of them but achievement hunting seems like a great way to spoil a game like this for yourself. Break away from the brain work telling you to tick boxes and just have fun playing.

Yours is a fully legit opinion but imo it’s nothing crazy: penances, achievements, challenges, trophies, records… different name sane thing, they are present since the origin of videogames

When well done, they’re fun and stimulants… when they are poorly made, as in this case, definitely not. Unfortunately Dream Team is the last one I have left, so I’d wante
to complete it

However, as written, mine is a broader discussion of how, from Vermintide to Darktide, Fatshark has changed the way of approaching the community

[zaygr]

The redacted penances are the old ones. They’re easier to get now than they were a year ago, but they still require people to do detrimental things.

[Rocker_Fox]

A somewhat tangential post but still related to the overall topic of progress, reward, and just the general feeling of getting stuff.

The new SST update is laggy, some of the enemies are a bit to tanky, and some of the new map bits are bugged but you know what? I was having fun and enjoying myself because new weapons and perks weren’t shackled to an awful crafting system or I didn’t need to play some penances that upset everyone in a party just to get a slightly different coloured shirt.

It’s great to play a system that sure, has some grind but actually feels like you are getting somewhere tangible with each play session. On top of that im not having to pay someone 15 bucks just for a different coloured shirt, they just give that to you for playing over time.

I don’t need to worry about doing things counter to how my team is playing, i don’t need to worry about interacting with a digital casino just to craft a weapon, i just play the game and get some cool stuff. I’m finding that im far more engaged just playing, shooting bugs, and having fun instead of having to keep track of a virtual laundry list of tasks just to try a new weapon out.

It’s so nice to just play a game, get a new thing to play with and play with the thing without having to jump through 20 hoops for something i might use once, swap out different perk and utility combos, and then swap it out for the next session.

Like imagine actually having player agency in Darktide without having to preform a circus act or play a slot machine. Would be nice.

[Merdoc]

What’s an SST, precious?

[Lt.DavinFelth]

@alsozara

It’s crazy to me anyone cares enough about penances to go after them intentionally.
(…)
but achievement hunting seems like a great way to spoil a game like this for yourself. Break away from the brain work telling you to tick boxes and just have fun playing.

Home Alone 2: Lost In New York Clip - You Guys Give Up? Have You Had Enough Pain?

[Jonboy]

I thought you meant on the bounce! I mean, I managed 15 I think on a run, but 100 seemed steep.
It’s 100 in total I realise… you’ll get that just by playing enough. I wouldn’t “work towards it” in any other shape or form.

[zaygr]

Starship Troopers Extermination.

[TakoyakiGremlin]

while i agree with some penances being stupid af, i don’t take them seriously lol i think the only ones i actively went after was the vet and psyker ones that got you the legendary pants for each class. everything else just happened as i played. i don’t care enough to 100% them, so i’m not worried about meeting some bogus requirements lol

[Flawless]

@souI23

The whole Penances system is ridiculous. All the challenges require you to play incorrectly and counterproductively. If you want to complete them, you will have to ruin the game to the other players…

This applies to maybe 5 of the penances (probably fewer).
Not all of them.

@souI23

Many penance require an absurd RNG

Like what?
Which ones are you talking about?
I can think of a single one that ever really had a problem with rng, but it no longer does.

[Headhunter]

Just like Steam achievements I just ignore penances.

Same way I ignore in game transactions like cosmetics.

They have no impact on actual gameplay. i.e. you don’t get rewarded powerful weapons or anything like that. Just play the game for fun and let the penances/achievements just pop by itself as you play, no biggie.

[jesper]

@zaygr

The redacted penances are the old ones. They’re easier to get now than they were a year ago, but they still require people to do detrimental things.

Even things like kill with ranged or kill with melee forces you to do detrimental things. Just kill.

@Rocker_Fox

Like imagine actually having player agency in Darktide without having to preform a circus act or play a slot machine. Would be nice.

We can dream. Someone at FS must actually like this system for it to be there. The idea isn’t even good on paper. I have no idea how crafting made it into the final product.

@Headhunter

They have no impact on actual gameplay. i.e. you don’t get rewarded powerful weapons or anything like that. Just play the game for fun and let the penances/achievements just pop by itself as you play, no biggie.

Sure, but I do enjoy working towards something, even simple things like completing 500 deeds made number go up which made me happy. I get your point. I really do, and your approach makes sense as opposed to mine, but we’re wired a bit differently here.

[Rocker_Fox]

It’s a great system. Posting example pics you have 2 sets of progression, your class progression which currently goes to 30 and your career progression which goes to 100.

Class progression unlocks new weapons, utility, and perks as your progress. You can check what unlocks at what level and it tells you what your next unlock is.

For Career progression you get XP playing ANY of the 3 classes and you gain cosmetics as you level up but you also unlock an additional perk slot and an additional utility slot at 90.

The customization isn’t anything too crazy but they are free and they aren’t charging people 15 bucks for recolours. They also back credited the XP gained so when i logged in the first time they gave me some cosmetics and i already had my extra perk slot unlocked.

TBH I’m not saying that i want a completely flat system for Darktide but if i had a better idea that i was making forward progress instead of constantly having to scrap weapons and items that look like an upgrade it would be far more willing to play.

TBH i also like that the loadout system is just…flat. I don’t need to run around to do something basic like buying new weapons or equipping gear or just selecting stuff. It’s a nice, simple menu that i can easily select that i want and jump into a game.