I don’t think I’ve ever seen the game do some of the stuff on Skittergate that it did that game. Even when I’d kill the gunner up by the ramp, it’d just spawn another one to replace it. Game was mad.
Mad that I wouldn’t give up my lucky tome. Elf’s gotta preach.
Lol dude the Dr. Is me 
I wasn’t gonna abandon Dr. AnalGape.
Vermintide 2 is, unfortunately, a game where LOSS = WASTE
If you lose, you are substantially penalized compared to a win. Which isn’t necessarily a huge issue, but when you’re losing most of the time, you get into the slump of “Why bother playing?”. I mentioned this in another thread…
In glorious Chad 1.6, I could log into Vermintide 2 and play with total randies on Legend, pretty much any map, and have a success rate of about 80%. It was fun! I would hop on, kill rats, get better and better one tiny bit at a time.
Now, not counting the new crappy map which is literally worse than Hitler (Fact, not opinion) the Virgin 2.0 Legend runs are about an 80% loss rate with randoms. Which is insanely frustrating since you can very, very clearly see the changes made to the difficulty.
We wanted Cataclysmtism, yes. We did not want the difficulties that we were used to and played and…dare I say it…enjoyed…changed in a way that basically reversed the win rates. I have multiple friends who just stopped playing. It’s not fun to lose when you used to win. Having to drop to a lower difficulty isn’t something players want to do. It’s not just a matter of pride, it makes people feel like they’ve REGRESSED in terms of their capabilities.
It’s the desire to get better and the results of practice that can help keep people invested!
It’s really bad. I’ve haven’t had this many losses since release.
I see a lot of low levels joining Legend QP too, and it’s really frustrating because people struggle with Legend enough right now without a level 24 joining…
That level 24 joining might be because whoever Queued up with Kruber hates playing Sienna and only has her at level 24. If you see a low level character with their first career option someone got screwed when they tried to join a game by the bug that reselects their class.
I’ve had that bug happen to me, but I didn’t think about other people not having level 30s ty. I have on the other hand seen career 2s and 3s join before the match though, so it’s probably a bit of both.
I meant steamroll from my perspective, I can’t make random people to steamroll too 
Main factor is massive rework of combat, which made combat harder, more complicated and threw the balance of weapons out of window. People are getting demolished in QP even without beastmen.
So people try to do what they did before and it doesn’t work.
I gotta admit that seeing myself move in 3rd person actually looks pretty bad ass lol that’s 2k hours of learning to move, block, dodge and attack all at the same time kinda work 
All this discussion resonates so much with me.
I’m not a super hardcore player (200+ hours total - picked it up on sale in May), but I had a really fun time building skills and making the jump to Legend. Built up a solid success rate, even solo QP. Games were challenging, but fair. Play well, and you won. Make mistakes, and you didn’t.
Then, the entire game changed.
Now, most of my Legend games are wipes. And they’re almost always in the same place. Some maps will be stupidly easy, others will be a nightmare. Convocation will go great, until the finale. Hunger in the Dark will be smooth sailing, until a beastman horde hits in the dark section.
And in terms of beastmen… I’ve actually unchecked the DLC in Steam just so I can play something somewhat enjoyable in Legend. I think they’re fun (or at least will be fun), but they just feel really unfair in Legend right now.
I will say that as a newer player, this has been super alienating - like some have said, it feels like a regression. And that’s not just due to the gameplay changes, but also the multitude of bugs.
Oof.
Except for the ones who refuse to buy WoM, because the game is a fiasco right now. But people who feel that way about the game probably aren’t playing very much these days. So I guess some people moved on to Cata & others abandoned the game.
So weird. . . then I play tonight, and no loses. There appears to be no random chip damage, fewer face spawns, etc.
It’s like they stealth patched stuff, and now it’s fine?
Doubt it. You’ve simply been lucky. Unless they push a patch this morning, this is what we’re going to be stuck with going into the third weekend.
ok, so the game seems harder. no one expects everyone to be in that top 1% that apparently nothing is ever going to challenge.
but for everyone else…
isnt it a bit crazy that people who have 20-30 reds just arent good enough to play legend now? is that the problem of legend now or legend then? id say its legend then … if they got so many reds but are “marginal” then perhaps they shouldnt have been there and the game was too forgiving on them.
if people are on champ getting downed 18 times then perhaps htey should never have been playing legend before. isnt the entire word “legend” pretty well key in on the fact that its ummm “legend” and not “normal”. its supposed to be where the top tier goes. (well … ignoring they now have cata). that everyone was there sorta puts paid to the lie that there was anything legend about it.
the leaving in a mid run isnt due to loss of possible reward. its due to immaturity of the player. which has been an issue for awhile and is something OFTEN pointed out on these forums. vermintide pulled in some of the toxic players when it got “big” and those people are very vocal, very full of complaints, act like jerks in games, and are a huge problem in this community. how about the reward sometimes being playing a game that you enjoy and not trying to max your gains off of every transaction or experience.
i dont want to be arrogant but honestly MOST of the players should feel that if they win a run that they have cause to celebrate. thats a feature. not a bug. before we had guys who frankly couldnt play making legend runs, getting 20-30 reds, and it was routine for them. sure it felt fun for them to be blasting through hordes but where is the challenge in that? where is the long term gameplay challenge that keeps people playing? it was broken. im not saying what they have now is great but at least it fixed this.
i would suggest as a solution the devs crank champion difficulty up to challenge the people no longer able to successfully routinely run legend. id also crank up the rewards for people in champion so their gear can improve and get them closer to being capable of running champion.
but again … that legend is too hard for so many is a GOOD thing. legend should be the crusher with maybe 20% of the base able to handle it reliably. cata - maybe 5-10% tops. champion should have like 60% with the rest being vet and recruit. what is the long term life of a game that everyone can beat? its interesting that people complain about losing more than they win but then refuse to drop difficulty. whos fault is that?
and if the beastmen arent fun but you have the dlc … disable it in steam
It’s a problem of a broken game getting even more broken after a major update. Not to speak for everyone, but vast majority of the playerbase complains about the game being hard because it’s broken and unfair, as opposed of being hard by design to provide a challenge to the player.
You see, most of us “problems of the community” play games to challenge ourselves and to have fun, and not to suffer through a broken mess only to get bragging righs on some Internet forum in front of a couple dozen strangers.
Where do you draw that point from? The game was broken, yes, but how does difficulty correlate with it? And how making an update that overflooded technical support section fixed your problem?
Getting competent updates with interesting additions and improvements to the game players already like, as well as new ways for them to challenge themselves.
Instead we got the game with already existing player base turned upside down, peppered with new bugs and highlighted old ones in the process, with the addition being what maybe 1% of players was asking and only that 1% will even get to experience.
Yes, we pay almost the price of the game itself, for an update that turns the game some of us liked, some of us at least endured, into a chaotic mess, AND on top of that we should disable the very product we paid for. That is a valid argument, if I’ve ever seen one, right there.
Or you could just not buy it and not give FS money? Is that seriously what you’re advocating right now?
And 5% for cata? Assuming this goes back to 3k players a month, which it will. You want Cata to be queued into by 15 whole people?
Gimmie your keys, you’re drunk.
Ok not playing Legend at all since I moved to Cataclysm and Weaves mostly.
Here’s what usually kills us (in no particular order) :
Here’s what usually don’t kill us :
I’m going to be real. This is about as convincing as somebody saying “hey I think the changes are good”
What does not convince you ? Did you try to track why you’re killed by beastmens or not ? I did, and it’s mostly about their ambushes.
I support @Froh claims 100%. What is killing us right now is inconsistencies. Situation awareness and mechanical knowledge are utterly destroyed by bugs.
I do not believe you could carry legend without a fair bit of this two particular skills, before.
Sound is your primary source of awareness, you hear stuff way before you see it… Well it is no longer true because of bugs.
With the same logic, chip damages are real and most of the time because of bugs: push not working, ult not staggering and so on. And this too hindering severly your capacity to carry.
So I definitely stand by bugs are causing huge inconsistencies that artificially increase game difficulty.
So we should wait to see what happen when they are finally addressed, before saying it s too hard.
And one last thing, that is skill relevent this time: boss are actually a threat now, and can no longer be deleted out of existence as before. So we have to relearn that. And most qp don’t know, have the tools or experience to face boss right know with sahde and bop nerf and their overall increased hp.
This last point is a huge reason why quickplay is way harder than with a group, usually boss are still privileged over hordes, or no one take the Aggro away (most of the time).