feels terrible now
I just want to clarify that even if they improved the damage of the push attack heavy special I STILL donât want it because the Ironhelm has cleave on special already and doesnât need an overhead. The Crucis does need the overhead heavy attack.
SHOO, SHOO FILTHY OVERHEAD. Ran another game with it tonight and it was just gross. Best I can say on the ironhelm now is using the special attack as a reset:
H1->H2-spcH1->h2
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@alsozara no it dosenât work, light-light activation heavy indeed chain you in the activated overhead but for some reason with the heavy chain when you activate it will reset you to a heavy sweep.
Probably one of the worst changes in patch 14.
It really needs to be reverted.
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Ah, I misremembered then. Thanks for clearing that up
At least I am not alone on thisâŚ
This change does not make sense for me⌠but as I use crucis I did not want to complain.
I feel like the train of thought was
âHuh, nobody uses Heavy 3 on the Ironhelm⌠well, it is a bit awkward to access at the end of the comboâ
makes push â heavy 3 change
âOh⌠nobody wants to use Heavy 3, maybe thatâs why it wasnât usedâ
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Asking the real questions.
(yes)
@FatsharkCatfish please advise! Hammerchads are desperate for salvation!
I use it! I even made a tutorial about how and when to use it! What niche value it offers! How to swing it into your combo in a horde! All of that! It was fine as it wasâŚnowâŚnow the hammer is sick 
it needs help!
Unrionically the new hordeclear chain for ironhelm is to use powered heavy to reset the combo lmao. Its like playing a bloodthirsty eviscerator with none of the advantages.
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yes, emperor save us⌠or @FatsharkCatfish ⌠whoever can do it first
There was a patch today. Slaghammer was not fixed. Please fix the ironslag.
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+1 to this. The changes are a huge step back for a weapon that was already not overperforming. Please help us out here!
@FatsharkCatfish , would you be the right person to tag to make sure this gets brought to the team?
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The real (ebola) questions
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They really need to just pull a PS and make one Hammer for horde clear and one Hammer for single target damage. The wishy-washy combo/follow-up changes just make it yucky to play either and just pushes more people to spam knife, LS, and the Axes since their combos are more defined.
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My ebola (real) is worsening. I have used the hammer 3 additional times.
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Itâs not limited to hammers, there are many weapons suffering from having way too mixed moveset seemingly without any specific goal. Heavy swords and catachan swords come to mind - some of those have very⌠eccentric moveset.
Itâs day and night compared to weapons that have a moveset made with a specific goal in mind, like combat blade or tactical axes.
I think the only eccentric thing about heavy swords is⌠VI and VII having almost identical combos.
VI is Relentless Relentless Vanguard Vanguard, and VII is Relentless Vanguard Vanguard Relentless - slightly more front loaded on damage with the VII, but by a fairly insignificant amount (full combo is equivalent).
Before patch 14, the cleave amounts for the heavy attacks were basically reversed (I think the VI was 1.7 â 3.6 and VII was 3.6 â 1.7, the exact amount may be wrong but both variants used the same numbers). With patch 14, all the heavy sword Strikedown got a large amount of cleave so⌠the only difference on the heavy attacks now (from what I can tell) is the direction of the slashes (down â up versus up â down) and a slight difference in the timing of special â heavy combos (VI feels like it repeats the combo a tiny bit faster)
The catachan swords⌠I think the VII is the only weird one. Mk I has double Relentless heavies, so it clearly doubles down on horde clear as its niche; Mk IV has Strikedown â Relentless so it has versatility with a sweep-heavy light combo and a readily available Strikedown heavy for quickly reacting to bigger targets; Mk VII has a similar light combo (possibly 1 extra Sweep attack) but its heavies are Relentless â Strikedown, so it has neither the versatility of the Mk IV nor the horde clear of the Mk I 
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Eh, for me Ironhelm was and is still just meh.
He suffers from the same sickness as (almost) all power weapons do:
- Charging the weapons breaks the flow of the combat
- Discharging makes you stop for half a second
Maybe I am biased from Vermintide 2, where you actually had to learn which attacks are best for what and incorporate it into the flow of the combat, but I personally dislike the special charging mechanic. I would be all for getting some time-frame where you can charge your weapon mid-swing, it would require skill but would be very rewarding.
Crucis has his niche as boss killer, but Ironhelm? Just take Turtolsky/Catachan with crit/bleed/fury build, throw Rampage + Savage Sweep/Extra Cleave on Crit on it and mindlessely mix light and heavies. Does basically the same job but faster, easier and more gorey.
Mk7 is definitely the most confused weapon Iâve seen, and they havenât overhauled its moveset still. Its clearly supposed to be single-target focused, since 3 of its attacks are single target; it has the standby VT2 combo of 2 sweeps and an overhead. But you canât combo those 3 hits together, so its basically worse than Mk4 at all times (Mk4 can infinite H1 â push attack for single target enemies). You need to burn moves to get back to H2 on Mk7, and the push attack combo canât give you it either. Try fighting an elite and pulling off L1, H2 push attack light and then repeating. Its disgusting and not actually worth it. Horde is just suffering because it has 45 angle sweeps instead of the closer to flat the rest of the swords get. Emperor protect you if you accidentally miss the H1 and do an overhead light in the middle of a horde.
But I have similar complaints about Mk2 brunts now - they should have moved the overhead L4 to L1, so it actually does something in between the actual proper clubs. Because now the Mk3b is not a meme and I take back everything bad I said about it.
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