It was just related, thats all. Communication is becoming difficult.
Projecting what? The community has an issue with Lasguns, they are alreay effective. Why so hostile? Honestly please tell me what Im projecting as I dont understand that lingo whatsoever.
Ah, I use the Light Lasgun and find that has the most easily used ‘bounce’ so we are opposites.
EDIT
I’m glad you made your point regarding bayonets instead of torches or flashlights, which is their nickname because of how weak they are on Tabletop. Im sad you refuse to discuss further the utility and target acquisition benefits of the toch, but again, thats just who you are I guess.
I enjoy defending apples over oranges. The weapons acessibility directly relates to its power. This game needs less ‘projectors’ we can agree, so could you please elaborate as I’d really like to reply, but have no idea how to.
I assumed this was directed at me, and it seemed as though you were projecting that I wanted to make them easier or more accessible, when that has never been what I’ve been saying. Perhaps it was in reply to someone else, though.
Really, I’m genuinely surprised, sometimes when I’m shooting something like a Reaper my shots are just bouncing left and right constantly. Or at least there is that visual recoil; either way, it annoys me because, as I’ve said, lasers shouldn’t have recoil.
Yeah, though in the books they are sometimes described as “blowing off limbs” and such, hence my suggestion of a blessing that makes some shots cause a small explosion at the cost of more ammo. It was meant to be something interesting and unique for them. It’s annoying how so many weapons just have a really boring set of generic blessings, I think we could all agree on that.
Also, when I’m saying flashlight I mean the attachment under the weapon. Frankly, I think that players should just have a strong flashlight that can be toggled on and off on their person, and it should not be a weapon attachment unless it had some tactical value besides providing light, but that’s a different topic.
I don’t understand what you mean by this. Perhaps I’ve missed a comment from you or something.
I will say that I quite like Infantry Lasguns. They are general-purpose weapons with drawbacks, such as poor cleave (it does exist, as you say, but it’s still on a poor spectrum and makes reaching priority targets further back quite tricky, a major downside) and poor performance against Carapace armor. Despite that, they’re quick to switch to and it is enjoyable snapping to target after target and lasing them down.
1 Like
I know its not what you’ve said, its not what Ive said easier. Read the title of the thread and apply my comments. Please. Thats utterly insane.
Yes Im sure you are surprised that someone else can make something work you cant and enjoy something you dont. As facetious as that sounds, I mean every word of it as it reads. Youre shots bounce because its evident from your comments you dont control the rhythm of the weapon. Have you played VT? The Swift Bow shoots faster the slower you fire because you can set into the rhythm, but its ROF is slow the faster you mash.
The visual recoil is not something I’d like to address, if you literally cant control aim I dont know what to say. The greatest games like Counterstrike 1.3 have had HUGE amounts of visual recoil to control. Games like battlefield 3 have none compared. It doesnt amtter, at all, what you or I think weapons ‘should’ behave like it matters how they are ingame and what constructive discussion we can stimulate to address that. Noone, whatsoever, is interested in that people they have what is a mind virus in modern terms and an arrogance to not agree in normal terms, its human nature. That doesnt mean we cant try.
Until you ACTUALLY SAID you were working off the proviso players should have individual torches, my impression is that the bayonet you refused to discuss and should be implemented (“end of story”) wuld replace the weapons functional torch. A must have for target acquisition personally and a nice QoL for dark areas.
It doesnt need cleave, its a precision weapon. People, not necessarily you, are trying to make every weapon have no weaknesses, unintentionally homogenising every weapon, the game, and their minds inadvertently through being unable to admit what theyre doing has negative impacts but feels good to say. The Lasguns, currently, have NO problem reaching further back targets. Just because they dont pierce everything (Something I think Lasers do… that subjective irl thing again…) doesnt mean they have a hard time. Even cleave Helbores struggle. As they should. They absolutely in no way shape or form should perform against carapace. You cant have weapons unless its the PG kill EVERYTHING easily. And if you want to console-ify the game, Im here to voice my disagreement. Saying that, Onslaught will let anything killa Crusher. Its NOT a metric of balance or skill.
To the thread now (For clarification, not you) What is the problems with Lasguns, really, and what can feasibly be done in game to fix that? Personally, I think theyre fine and have said so but am OPEN TO DISCUSSION.
I had this post removed, nothing about it means it should be removed. I’m posting it again for reference.
If you removed my post because of the skill credential, or the ensueing sarcasm which is a quote from you know who, we have SERIOUS free speech issues on this board.
’ ```
The reticule bobs, the actual dot barely moves if you, y’know, want to control the recoil.
Ex semi-pro BF3 player here. You are talking to the two time back to back blockbuster 1993-1994 video game champion, with a deadly Ethiopian caterpillar, standing at 6’8” with a 37” vertical leap, BTW.
Interestingly, Dark Tide is a cqb game. A weapon that requires precise head shooting has an extremely strong recoil animation. I believe that even a bf3 expert would never challenge themselves with a high recoil dmr in the subway.
8 Likes
I had a long reply to your points, like pointing out that you are ignoring my whole point about lasers not having recoil (which is sometimes a thing in the setting, so it’s completely reasonable) and addressing your projections (which you are still doing) and aggression (though I was going to avoid going into your weird superiority complex), but it’s not worth it. I do not want to engage with you further.
EDIT: Oh, I see he’s got a temp ban.
4 Likes
By the way, bf3 is a pvp game. At least there are no machine gunners who can lock their heads and there are far more riflemen than players in it. The biggest problem with infantry lasers is that the design concept is contrary to the game battlefield environment. You can’t precisely target the heads of enemies when there are enemies in all directions. (I’m just an ig soldier, not a space marines.) If I were to balance the Infantry Laser, I would first reduce the recoil animation of the infantry laser. Secondly, I would eliminate the strange mechanism that reduces the damage at close range instead. Finally, if possible, I hope to enhance the damage of the Infantry laser to bulletproof enemies
9 Likes
By the way, the infantry laser in the game seems to have an automatic shooting mode, but I’m not sure why we can’t use it
13 Likes
They must be restricting convict killing potential…lame
1 Like
Hellbore could be actually a decent gun if it wouldn’t take 3-5 business days to equip it (+ charge time).
5 Likes
The charge time is fine for me, but the switch time is a killer. It just feels so much worse because of how calmly the player flips the safety off. XD
@MONIKA2333 I wasn’t actually aware they did less damage up close.
I don’t think I’d mess with its damage against Carapace, though. That armor type exists to make ranged weapons less dominant and that is completely fair (though ofc things like Plasma and Bolter don’t care . . .)
3 Likes
The biggest problem with lasguns, is that so much of the game is poorly balanced, with really poor mechanics and design decisions.
Onslaught for one. Why take a lasgun, when you can take a autogun with nuts armour pen.
Lasguns are really not the issue, it’s the poor balancing in the rest of the game, power creep.
Devs really need to tale a step back, take a deep breathe and sort this sh*t out.
5 Likes
The semi-automatic laser weapons in the game all have a strange mechanism that reduces damage at close range and increases it at long range
3 Likes
yeah its like a worse version of that sniper bonus because it inverts and takes away damage in addition to not being linearly scaled iirc. if they just made it a sniper bonus it could still do its thing (gain damage at long range) without weirdly reducing it at close distances. I like the idea of an inverted damage fall off, but the weapon should be more usable and the game itself valuing that mid distance more. as is you basically only need something able to hit 35m+ away rarely (those snipers that decide to hang back instead of crouch behind hordes) and the only requirement there is accuracy because sniper is so weak in terms of HP.
as is it gets wrecked by suppression and is all or nothing on crit weakspot hits, in addition to numerous weaknesses in terms of target effectiveness (and doing nothing to carapace). there’s also a lack of usable hipfire for no other reason than the las pistol exists and it does that well. if the weapon already has a flashlight you just made 2/3s of the weapon functions bad.
7 Likes
I might have a somewhat plausible explanation for this? Infantry Lasguns and Helbore Lasguns are conventional rifles, while Recon Lasguns are bullpups.
Bullpups are better for CQB engagements. Bullpup configurations allow for a longer barrel in a shorter weapon than conventional configurations. This leads to two things:
- Improved weapon handling in CQB when compared to a conventional rifle.
- Increased accuracy when compared to a conventional carbine.
I’m not justifying it, of course. This is just my attempt at brainstorming about why Fatshark might’ve done that to these Lasguns.
3 Likes
I’ll defend recoil.
Just enough recoil makes las weapons feel punchy… even tho it isn’t without a headshot.
4 Likes
According to some youtube video I saw once a laser needs to go through a lens to focus it into a beam and that beam will have a optimal burn point (for lack of a better term) just like when you burn things with a magnifying glass
4 Likes
I can get that. I used to defend the recoil for this reason, too. Still, the bounce could be toned down, especially in the horizontal.
4 Likes
Infantry lasguns have four main issues for me ; recoil, sway while moving, lots of hitreg issues and the close range damage reduction (because in the state of the game we are in, most of your targets are running around you close to mid range).
I can do with the very low bodyshot damage and the bad breakpoints, but the lasgun absolutely need three things to not be a chore to play in auric games (haven’t tried it in havoc, it’s probably pretty bad).
- The same aim assist the revolver or bolt pistol have (the bolt pistol have a bit less aim assist). The lasgun seems to have no aim assist right now, which might be the cause of the hitreg issues I constantly have when scoring headshots on moving targets (the game play the headshot sound and shows blood on the enemy but the shot itself doesn’t register).
- Less recoil and precision loss while moving.
- The removal of the inverted damage fall-off mechanic.
And by the way, these are no the only issues with the lasgun. All the high zoom single shot (or two round burst) weapons will struggle in the current meta if they don’t have great breakpoints because they need way more commitment and some manner of tunnel vision to be effective than something like the revolver, which is also a single shot weapon but with high damage, high handling and a good FoV.
In Darktide nowadays you’re pretty much always in melee range or really close to melee threats, which means that the 0.5-1 seconds it takes for the revolver to kill an elite or a specialist is night and day compared to the 1.5-2 seconds it can take to do the same with an infantry lasgun.
9 Likes