I don't like Ironhelm and I made an attempt to fix it

Okay, so you got the new zealot hammer and Crucis is already really good and simple to use, so surely the Ironhelm would be the equivalent of the Mk9 Heavy Sword, right? Wrong - let’s elaborate:

One of the first major problems of this hammer is its moveset. If we compare it to the Mk9, we can see that the Mk9 has:

  • Horde-oriented lights;
  • Its second and third heavies loop into each other instead of going back to the vertical first heavy (as there’s no reason for it to be otherwise);
  • And you still are allowed a single-target combo by using the special and first heavy in any particular order.

What does the Ironhelm do that I don’t like? And this is where I start using V for vanguard, S for strike and R for relentless to make reading combos easier.

  • Two lights that are vanguard and strike respectively, and three heavies that are relentless, relentless and strike;
  • You can create a horde combo with light 1V → heavy 2V, or do heavy 1R → heavy 2R;
  • However, heavy 1R and heavy 2R do not loop into each other, always reaching heavy 3S after heavy 2R;
  • You can do light 1V → light 2S to access heavy 3S, so surely after heavy 3S the weapon would switch to a single-target combo and loop back to light 2S because Fatshark has shown they can make weapons that follow such combos and it gives the weapon a bigger complexity that rewards players who master the moveset, right? Specially when the player goes through the effort of starting a non-single-target combo to reach the single-target attacks, right?
  • No, the weapon has no consistent single-target combo and all of its initial attacks are vanguard or relentless, contrary to the Mk9 allowing the player to start whatever they felt like starting. Even the Crucis has a full line of lights exclusively strikedown.
  • The biggest crime, however, is that heavy 3S offers no damage bonuses whatsoever to the special attack, despite having a much longer setup that could be rightfully rewarded instead of being a part of the weapon everyone ignores.

My proposed solution:

  • Ironhelm’s moveset becomes light V/V/S, heavy S/R; a strikedown first heavy aids in hitting single targets from above and the weapon retains a comfortable mixed light combo similar to the veteran’s Mk6 Power Sword;
  • The strikes loop into each other (heavy 1S skips to light 3S), as do the vanguards and relentless with the exception of light spam, leading to the following combos and unmentioned variations: PA>L2V, PA>H1S, L1V>L2V>BC (I hate block cancel btw), H1S>L3S>loop and L1V>H2R>loop. The weapon now has a light/heavy and a light/light for hordes, a light/heavy for singles, a vertical special heavy for elites and specials and doesn’t make itself obviously better by creating a button-mashing horde weapon;
  • The modified different heavies don’t get a proposed damage change for the special because now the player has a first heavy and that’s the only time players use the special, since it doesn’t cleave enemies on vanguard/relentless attacks, nullifying the need to “reward the setup” that current Ironhelm’s moveset would have.


  • No full single-target combo; add one.
  • One light/heavy horde combo is eh; give it a light combo too, it’s a weapon for a frontline class.
  • The Crucis already starts with a relentless heavy; make the Ironhelm’s first heavy a strikedown.
  • Make the push attack follow with a vanguard light or strike heavy.
  • Give it van/van/strike lights to contrast with Crucis’ full strike lights and give it some versatility (along with limiting the power of button-mashing by making one attack “useless” for hordes).

Or I could just equip slaughterer and spam lights lmao thanks for the massively increased power and cleave.


Why are you giving the hammer with cleave on powered attacks the strikedown heavy1? Give the crucius the strikedown heavy.

I, personally, don’t like how hard it is to dig the ironhelm’s overhead out of the pattern so it should definitely be made easier to get to via lights.

Powered cleave doesn’t really appeal to me because I want speed against a crowd and thunder hammers can already get slaughterer, so I’m not starving for damage enough to start doing powered cleaves.

That is not the purpose of powered cleave. Powered cleave lets you avoid dealing your charged damage to poxwalkers. Thus allowing you to swing through 2 poxwalkers or 4 groaners and still hit the elite. Unlike the Crucius the ironhelm can deliver fully charged, 3 stacks of thrust, swings to mutie in the middle or a horde. This utility is the greatest advantage it has over the crucius. Which otherwise has higher damage stats.

Well, the overhead on the ironhelm is quite good. But i digress.

Fair point, it does give the weapon some pretty interesting usage compared to the counterpart.

What a point of overhead attacks in DT on hammers tho? Every VT player want them but struggle to elaborate what is good about it. It doesn’t give you any benefits over horizontal attack, you still would hit first target if you not manipulating with your position and as well you loose ability to manipulate with horizontal hitboxes via jumps and camera angle. So why people want gimp themself so hard?