not sure what part exaclty, but if you are someone who want or need progression and beeing rewarded with items to be motivated to play further and have fun i want to ask you what do you do when its done?
Do you stop playing until new class comes you can repeat the process?
What would be with a new map only, would it be interesting and motivating enough to play it? How often if there is no progression or reward connected with it?
5 times, 10 times, 50 times?
And then what?
see this is what i meant with artificially prolonged.
But i’m really interested if you would stop playing when you have BiS Gear for all of your characters and builds?
I wouldn’t.
As implied with my post, for the people who kept on playing past getting BiS on all characters spent only about 20% of their total play time getting those items, and then proceeded to keep playing, most of the time to continue honing skill while having a static, foundational set of items so that they can remove as much of the randomisation on the part of the character as possible.
The gameplay was gripping enough that you can ignore the itemisation (after getting the BiS). You weren’t forced to engage with the itemisation for the entirety of the 1000 hours. Which is what Fatshark is aiming for with DT currently.
Engagement.
That attempt of engagement and retention, I theorise ties into the cash shop to a degree, but most of the people I’ve spoken to from the VT2 crew that kept on playing post-itemisation, have pretty much said they have either stopped playing DT (because there’s no end in sight for itemisation - item fatigue) or continue to play DT despite those sytems, not because of them.
Fatshark is trying new things, I understand that, but the things they are trying show me they are mostly missing the point of why VT1 and 2 was much-loved.
3 Likes
No. The gear progression is a bonus, that keeps the motivation up for longer and gives you specific goals to work towards.
New things tend to be interesting, at least for a while.
How often would i play a new map? No idea.
Same as other people i guess: depends on the quality of it and how enjoyable it is.
You could call it that, or you could call it additional content.
To me, it is additional content, that makes the game more interesting and gives me more things to do.
Imagine, someone plays diff 3 and is getting bored with the game.
Playing on higher difficulty could get them more excited again, but they have no ambition to improve their skill.
If you gave that person the option to gain a small amount of extra power by playing on diff 4 a bunch, that might be enough motivation to get them to play diff 4 and upgrade their items, which increases the overall time for which they enjoy the game.
Same as pretty much all the achievements in other games (or penances in Darktide). Specific things to do, which keep you engaged and keep you playing.
Having them, does not take away from the gameplay experience. They just add to it (with the exception of some of the penances that require you to do things that are pretty much self sabotage).
No. Once i have the perfect equipment, i can enjoy the game with the BiS gear that i earned.
Some people might quit the game once they have it, but they probably would have quit a long time ago if the game did not offer them gear progression to enjoy in the first place.
seen - therefore i said that this kind of additional content and motivation to play aka more things to do creates more fuss than everything else and it maybe would have been better to not stress about it at all.
It attracts people no question, but you want it this way, another wants it another way and i dont know a game everyone is happy with the progression systems it has.
Many talk like: It’s done now i can enoy the game. Or they strive to the endgame what they call the “real game” etc.
And based on that i made my statement.
All fine you want to improve what we have but like s.o. said FS will never get rid of RNG completely or rework it that much and fundamental that you can controll it to 100% and grind your BiS gear efficently or straight forward or whatever.
The whole point is player retention and with players i mean the players that need a progressions systems to be motivated at all, that need it or they just dont play it.
And FS came up with the easiest and possibly worst and RNG based systems ever and made everything RNG based and not even completed it.
And everyone likes the game, but hates these systems and the game gets bad reputation.
That’s why i said if they have left it out completely maybe some would have complained and said uh oh no progression system and it’s not for me and if they had communicated it before they wouldn’t have even tried the game and we had way less to zero complains and the target audience just beeing happy with the game.
1 Like
I think that having a good progression system is better than having none at all.
But i also agree that discontent and the overall complaints would likely be fewer, if FS had not put any itemization in the game at all (and if they had not promised to deliver proper crafting with high player agency and low rng).
Since FS did decide to put some type of progression in the game (which they did in a way that is universally disliked), the only way forward seems to be the implementation of a progression system that makes players happy.
2 Likes
My guess is all we get is a little less RNG like no locks on refining/ reblessing.
Hopfully beeing able to refine and rebless endlessly and some tweaks to the shops and a somwhat better chance getting a decent 350-380 weapon that we then can refine and rebless until we get that Weapons we want.
By the way i made a somewhat similar suggestion with beeing able to level BR and such a while ago: My wishes for complete crafting and more rewarding progression loop
1 Like
You’re wrong on this… it is not what is dilisked. Read reviews on steam.
I like the progression system cause… well we reach easily the level 30. And, I don’t care of the progression cause it is, in my opinion, just a loss of time.
For me the core game is playing missions, experimenting templates and weapons, developping skills. The things around should just give what is needed for that.
There are lot of games that have a slow char progression. There are even where you have to play months to reach the limit… until a new dlc raises this limit.
If I wanted such games, I would not play Darktide…
2 Likes
You are telling me, that most people do not dislike the current state of itemization in darktide?
Edit:
I just looked through a few negative steam reviews and aside from crashes, the majority of them also criticizes the itemization system or the lack of endgame.
Even positive reviews often criticize the lack of endgame or item customization.
So i have no idea what you are trying to tell me.
1 Like
I am telling you that there is no topic about the progression. An that’s what you talk about since the beginning of this thread.
You’re confusing things. People complain cause the game has too much restrictions about getting a good weapon. They complain cause we have no crafting and cause we have to log every hour to check a shop and hope for something interesting. They complain cause emperor’s gifts don’t correct this (especially with the psykers). People complain about the lack of possibility to ameliorate weapons and the RNG system.
What you want is not fixing that… you want something totally different. Anyways, as I said, they won’t change the entire game.
Offering us crafting and a fix about shops / emperor’s gifts is all that is asked to Fatshark. They could improve the system in the future. For now, we just want that they finish the game.
I have so many orange weapons cause I try to get blessings I want or a combination… Several could be perfect if we get the crafting system delivered.
I don’t care to get a progression system. I just want they give me the way to get the good weapons I want. Actually, we can’t.
2 Likes
Now i can not take you serious anymore, because if you actually read the OP thoroughly, you would notice that
- i specifically named these issues
- my suggestions would fix all of them
- my suggestions explicitly build upon the systems that are already in place and do not require changes to the entire game (i purposely suggested a system that would make use of all the systems that are already in the game, without requiring many if any changes to them)
1 Like
Here, read the words… limited choices.
Bad system… I don’t want such system. I want a crafting system.
Absolute no… I prefer> a crafting system. And for that, we need to get grey / green / blue weapons.
My god! Worst idea ever.
And I must thank you?
I don’t want to get maximized weapons, I want to be able to play different template and different weapons… and to have the possibility to use different blessing combination.
I don’t play counter strike.
Here I agree, I have already suggested this. And it was implemented it VT2.
Final word. I have said what I have to say. You think your vision is the best. I think the contrary. I also think that I want FS to fix the current game. I don’t ask them to change what we have.
I just want they had crafting and fix thr RNG.
1 Like
Yes. Limited choices while leveling.
Unlimited choices after leveling.
Yes. From the hourly store. The hourly store already sells grey to blue quality and i did not suggest to change that.
The daily store where you spend your weekly tokens, already only sells purple and orange items. I also did not suggest to change that. What i suggested is, that the items from the daily store are somewhat in line with the power of the items you already have (since the daily store requires you to grind weekly quests).
What the hell are you on about?
I suggested a crafting system that uses the same resources we already have + a token you gain from mission completion.
It does everything that you want, and more, which is fine, since you can simply choose to not do anything more than what you want.
It IS a crafting system.
Unless you want to actually completely craft the item itself from the ground up. But that would be contradictory to your own statement in the previous quote, where you say that
“I prefer> a crafting system. And for that, we need to get grey / green / blue weapons.”
So apparently, you do want to get weapons from a vendor (or mission rewards) and then improve upon them, which is exactly what i am suggesting.
You want to get everything unlocked by playing on difficulty 1?
Because that is what you get if there is no power, gated by difficulty.
Great. Then do not maximize your weapons. Nobody forces you to do it, if it is an option. But you would be allowed to do it, if you wanted to.
The time i gave is for MAXIMIZING an item (as explained in the OP).
Getting a 380 with the perks and blessings you want, would be 100% guaranteed and take you maybe 3 hrs.
Currently, that would take weeks or months of simply waiting to get lucky + farming hours and hours of resources to upgrade items to then throw them in the garbage.
You would be able to swap a blessing to a different blessing any time you want, and all you need to do, would be to clear a single diff 3 mission to get all resources to do so.
Neither do i. What is your point?
It is fine if you have valid reasons to disagree with me, but if you read carefully, you will notice that most of the reasons you gave for disagreeing with me make absolutely no sense. It honestly seems like you misunderstood at least half of what i said in the OP as well as in my later posts.
On top of that, you claim that i am suggesting to change around all the systems completely, while in reality, i am suggesting small (in some cases no) changes to the existing systems and working with them, and you are asking to completely change the way they are (at least that is how i understood it).
1 Like
Dt #1 problem is game state: stability, performance on client and server side and most important “open beta” state.
2 Likes
i find it funny, beside the power through higher difficulties you both want the same and anyway disagree with each other 
Like i said: you want it this way, another wants it another way and i dont know a game everyone is happy with the progression systems it has.
All it causes is fuss, even among the people who generally agree with each other.
I cannot imagine the let us craft the wepaons we want easily. Not in 3 and not even in 300 hours.
I’m 450hrs in and refuse to use a browser app and i check the shop almost everytime i’m online - but sometimes just forget about it as it to 99% has nothing worthy.
If i “progress” at this rate i will have a 380 BR T4 blessed weapon i like in about 5000 hours
2 Likes
To say it in my own words
2 Likes
Hence me wondering why the guy keeps saying that i want certain things that i never said, and that i do not want things, which i did say.
It does appear as if they did not read what i wrote (or did not understand it).
Well, let us hope that they will let us.
And that we will not have to continue this pityful way of “grinding” for our gear, by checking a website in our browser.
Eh. You are not THAT lucky.
I think the fastest and most reliable way to such an item might be to play the lottery, hoping to win, so that you can buy the company and give yourself the item.
2 Likes
I can’t either… and tbh I don’t want it.
You change the way the system works. By allowing maximizing weapons, by giving token related to difficulty etc.
We strongly disagree on the main interest. I don’t know how I can say it to you.
I don’t care that we don’t get maxed weapons, I don’t even want that. Cause it is incitative to be able to get a better weapon.
I don’t want any other limitations, we already have a progression system good enough.
If I want identical weapons between all players, I play CS.
As I said, numerous times, I think the system is good enough. The crafting system they described is good enough. RNG, due to the shops system needs to be adjusted. The way to do it is up to FS. However, the main goal should be to be able to get interesting weapons even without logging every hour. Merk shop, emperor’s gift need to be more rewarding.
Contract system need to be changed, in my opinion and remove the “get all or nothing”. Also Merk’s weapons are really bad.
So, it can shock you, but the crafting system they described is enough good for me. A simple refresh of the shop after a mission would be sufficient for me. Off course you could do level 1 difficulty mission… but hey… you can do an heresy mission in less than 20 minutes (off course you need people that know what they have to do). That’s up to you if you want chaining level 1 difficulty missions.
Like said Luv_Fat_n_Sharks, they need to work on stability. So I would really prefer that they deliver what was planned for crafting, that they put a minor change like a possiibility to refresh the shop (by using ordos, by completing a mission or anything else), that they tweak a little Merk shop and emperor’s gift and that they fix the damn game. RTX doesn’t work, it crashes the game. There are lot of crashes and disconnections. This is something that really need the attention of the devs.
1 Like
tbh i wouldnt mind that, but yeah thats just me i guess
i know i know, life is hard
I’d make a Sea of Thieves + Mortal Online 2 + Darktide Game.
That are the games i played the thousands and in case of DT already hundreds of hours the last years.
Full loot open PvEvP Sandbox Game with horizontal Progression and PvP avoidable if you play smart and have good awarness.
People who dont want to PvP can avoid it by playing smart and beat the PvPers while literally “running” away. All in a seamless singleshard openworld sandbox in the grimdark Universe of WH40k with all or lets say most of its factions for massive PvE Events, PvP Battles and what not.
This game will maybe come when i’m 80 and not beeing able to play anymore
i fully agree on that!
1 Like
Yes. My suggestions regarding changes to the crafting system, obviously do include changes to the crafting system that was originally planned.
But no changes to any other system, rly.
Except
- valuable items from the weekly token vendor, appropriate to your current power level
- crafting resources from dismantling
Those things are some of my suggestions in the OP.
Although i did not mention changes that should be made to the weekly tasks themselves, and i agree with the suggestion that you made regarding weekly tasks.
If that is all you want, fine.
I do not like such systems because they are RNG heavy and do not actually reward you for playing (also, FS promised a system with little RNG).
1 Like
Exciting news, guys.
Let us hope we get something good.