I do agree with OP. Coherency is a mechanic which attempts to artificially warp otherwise organic gameplay. Not only do I disagree with the dev’s forcing players to play in a specific way, but coherency clashes with several game mechanics and is ultimately punishing players for making decisions to play in certain ways at certain times.
A lot of people in the replies don’t understand that coherency generally takes a portion of the player’s power budget. Even if you’re not left with a debuff, just without a buff, you are still actively missing out on a piece of the power budget granted to the player for balancing purposes. You are actively at a disadvantage as long as you’re missing out on the allotted power budget.
That power budget happens to be a different breed than when it came to some VT2 class aura buffs, as coherency is directly tied to toughness regeneration which is parallel to VT2’s temp hp. Toughness is absolutely key to the game’s gameplay to a degree that aura buffs were not, and it’s consequences are more apparent in game circumstances. Coherency isn’t the only change leading to the issue, just one of them.
It does count as 1 stack, but it can only be active if you’re near at least 1 other player, so basically you need at least 2 stacks for the effects to be active
I think coherency is great.
It forces people to actually play as a team instead of running off thinking their some lone wolf giga chad, only to fail and dodge either a trapper or dog and then go down.
Then proceed to flame the team for not being there to save them.
tbh, a lone wolf isn’t the kind of player that would care about coherency in the first place.
Thus having it really doesn’t deter the behaviour if the effect of coherency is minor
That kind of player are just the ones you quickly learn to avoid.
I used to be against the toughness-coherency mechanic and even made a few posts about it during the technical and closed beta tests, but now i support it. Fundamentally this is a team game, a cooperative PvE experience set in the 40k universe. It makes sense lore-wise, keeps the team moving at a decent pace, and gives the team a buff for staying together. Once an area is cleared of enemies then you look for loot but if you do this while the team is engaged then that isn’t intelligent gameplay.
This buff if i’m right, isn’t like a shield so much as morale and willingness to fight on, hence, toughness and not shield. if you’re too far away, then you don’t get this. i can tell when someone is over analysing this because i have in the past, and you are doing the same thing.
no one should be able to play a cooperative game and dictate the pace the other 3 players need to play at, this is what i would call toxic. i’m thankful for this mechanic so on the higher difficulties, people learn very fast to not try and solo away from the group, which helps a lot. Now, if you’re trying to speedrun and farm xp on easier diffs then yes obviously this mechanic is going to irritate you, and i believe you are this kind of person.
the real discussion should be on the toughness-coherency effectiveness, not whether it should be removed.
I like it, i want it to stay, it promotes healthy teamwork.
Keklel hits the nail on the head exactly. At higher difficulties, you are actively trolling your whole team if you dare step out of coherency range, so that means as a zealot or ogryn you’re delegated to never using your ult, since the amount of toughness you regenerate is pitiful without all 4 people in coherency.
And even as the sharpshooter, who should logically be playing a bit behind and letting the melee classes keep the horde off of them for the most part, they also have to play like dummies and go much closer to the frontline than they “realistically” would be, especially since a single hit from any damage source on higher difficulties deletes your entire toughness bar, it is most definitely a debuff and not just a lack of a buff once you take into account how ranged units can stunlock you, how they just nerfed dodging, melee damage bleeding through into your HP regardless of toughness for whatever stupid reason and a slew of other issues.
I don’t think anyone has a problem with ANY of the other passive bonuses that cohesion grants you and the team, but for me and as is evident many others, the problem stems from how toughness works.
And I think everyone saying that it forces you into playing as a team are being incredibly shortsighted and only thinking about the extreme end of things where bad players don’t play optimally. Plus I have a feeling they’re not playing in the higher difficulties where the deficiencies of the current coherency system is really showing how bad of a mechanic it can be. Thing is, these players aren’t going to stick to your coherency range anyways, they’re going to be the ones that ruin your run for you anyways, since now you’re down at least 1 person from that passive aura buff. They would be playing the exact same way regardless of some, to them, meaningless aura they get by being glued to the hip.
And me personally, having played hundreds of hours of Cata VT2, I find the claim that there’s so many people “not playing as a team” to be completely and utterly laughable. Everyone understands this is a coop PvE game, that’s probably a big reason they bought the game to begin with, and just by playing the game you’ll learn by default that working as a team gets you a much better chance at winning.
Anyone claiming lone wolfs didnt happen in Cata in VT2 is either being disingenuous or outright lying.
They 100% happened.
People charged ahead all the time so they could have the highest kills, for absolutely no gain.
They’d charge ahead to a grim spot rather then wait for the team to reach the area.
Could you please post a video of this happening to you? I’ve just played like 5 rounds with complete strangers and not a single time have any of them rushed ahead, I’ll post my own gameplay vids next time I get around to playing cause not once in my whole time playing VT2 have I ever experienced it.
to a grim spot
Know how I can tell you’ve never played Cata? Who goes for grims in Cata unless you have GK with the health regen quest? And why would you wait for the whole team to go the Grim spots, which are pretty much always in safe spots where no or little enemies can be found. I can’t think of a single grim spot in all of VT2 where you’re putting your team at risk by going at it alone, and it’s not like anyone grabs grims in the middle of hordes or bosses.
Okay the idea that at higher difficulties you’re throwing the game if you’re not at 4/4 coherency for a single second is just ridiculous. Coherency is not that important. In fact, you’ll notice that all of the classes have first row talents that give them reliable ways to gain back a fair amount of toughness without being in coherency.
Using your ult to charge ahead as a zealot or ogryn just introduces a period of slightly higher vulnerability until your team is able to push up to regroup with you, you’re not going to get instagibbed for stepping out of coherency for a few seconds unless you’re just not defending yourself at all. On top of that, oftentimes your team is going to have at least one other melee character that wants to charge in with you, allowing you to keep at least 2/4 coherency.
Moving out of coherency range is really not as punishing as some of you are making it out to be so long as you’re not doing it for really extended periods of time.
this topic is so idiotic, ridiculous, no sense.
Stigmatizing the game for co-op mechanics in a co-op game?
If you can’t survive when you don’t have allies nearby, or you run alone, it’s better not to go to higher levels of the game
I’m not competing, I just find it hard to believe that people come across this many “lone wolves” in their games when my own experiences after countless hours has been the complete, polar opposite. VT2 straight up has the best multiplayer community I’ve EVER come across in any video game I’ve ever played, I legitimately can’t think of a single instance of this happening in my games, as I said earlier in this thread (I think it was this one anyways), whenever I read those kinda statements I feel like I’m living and playing the game from a different planet or something, cause none of me or my friends that play have experienced it.
I agree. The idea of there being a bonus for staying close to the team is nice, but there shouldn’t be a penalty for leaving it (not necessarily that there is one atm) and there shouldn’t be feats that work with this idea. It should just be an extra thing that helps, independent of all other aspects of the game.
I find a lot of them hahaha.
Played so much that it’s now a competition to rush the green circles going ahead as fast as possible.
Moment things get tough, people naturally start sticking together again, that’s just a core animal instinct of ours.
I think Darktide is very punishing towards those who do not rely on team mates. Not only for coherency, but just diluting the amount of firepower aimed your way if you are going in.
The behaviour will disappear as players gaine xperience and confidence. Will probably still be bad at a lower level, but that’s the same with every team game.
Who goes for grims in Cata unless you have GK with the health regen quest? And why would you wait for the whole team to go the Grim spots, which are pretty much always in safe spots where no or little enemies can be found. I can’t think of a single grim spot in all of VT2 where you’re putting your team at risk by going at it alone, and it’s not like anyone grabs grims in the middle of hordes or bosses.