Honestly, I think the biggest issue with Havoc is just the penalty system. It makes the high end players that actually enjoy the difficulty (me) completely ignore it due to either the threat of losing their access to it or not having access to it at all because they aren’t engaging with it, while making those ‘just trying to get by’ never getting the teams they need to actually succeed (as can be seen so heavily in this thread/in game with anything between ranks 20-25) since those that could carry them/do them easily are ONLY ever going to be playing the highest level, because if they touch anything lower and then don’t clear a 40 that week they get rocketed down to whatever low level they cleared at, and that is just absolutely something that should not have been shipped with this at all.
I know I made my own post involving my greivences and what I think would let the mode shine for those that wanted to engage with it, and I still stand by them. I know I’d actually find it rather fun popping in to 20-25’s and trying to help people that just want the legs to get them like se05239, but I don’t want to lose what I’ve gained as I do actually really enjoy the one havoc 40 I’ve been able to do a week WHEN I get a good team that’s willing to do it.
Like literally this past Sunday, I got into a 40 with a random squad with 2 vets and 2 chorus zealots (me as one of them), and had it not been for 1 trapper dropping my ass into the flames and baking me into a downed state through my undying before my team could get to me, it would have been a true survivor run. Full randoms, no mices, just god gamers running around casting their golden toughness and keeping with the team until completion. Had only one scary moment where there was a captain + a nurgle on the bridge section, and we had to keep running circles near the elevator with use getting lower and lower as it went but eventually succeeding. But outside of that? Clean run, no complaints, felt fantastic using all the best builds to truly live and thrive in the hardest content known to this game.
But sadly, many, many people aren’t going to experience that, as the barrier to entry as Elodie pointed out is ‘to dam high’, and results in all the good players just going back to auric with their build variety and only touching Havoc once a week if even at this point, or just burning themselves out due to it being very strict on what builds it allows and then going back to where the game is open and fun. I know I did that going for finishing up the armor during one of the weeks and it just tanked my desire to touch it, as the low level havocs where you can still mess around are boring af, but the high level ones require X build with pure perfection and I can only really stomach that at best a few times a week, or like maybe once a day, before I’m off to enjoy my build variety again.
It just isn’t conducive to a ‘punishment system’, as there’s already going to be few players wanting to ‘go through the hassle’ to begin with, let alone lowering that number even more by not having people want to host. I know this week I actually for the first time since havoc started have a really easy 40, but didn’t run it/likely am not going to run it because I got my 40 in from someone else and now don’t want to risk it especially for no gain. But if that punishment system wasn’t there, I’d totally just throw it up and see what happens.
But yeah, Havoc is just in a ‘systems hell’ state, that exacerbates all it’s pain points and makes it feel that much less fun to try and engage with. Top it all off with all the high end players (at least on this forum for sure) pointing out how ‘they got all they wanted from it and are done with it’, and that just makes it that much worse as all the people entering it or still trying to get it done to their satisfaction are forced to run around with literal drivel, with no hope of a good player just being like ‘yeah sure I’ll just play a game because I want to play the god builds and actually feel like it’s worth doing so, why not’ coming in to pull them over the finish line.
Just feels bad, and I do hope it gets revised.