About the design flaws of the new enemy, gas bomber

Warhammer 40,000: Darktide Gameplay Feedback
1

As a special enemy, it seems to be the only one that is severely lacking in hints to the player, both visually and audibly.
All of the other special enemies are either visually distinctive, such as having parts of their bodies that emit light significantly, or having obvious sound cues when they appear and act.

Visually, its body has no glowing parts at all, and in a dimly lit game environment, it’s hard to spot it, and soundly, it doesn’t run like another enemy throwing a fire grenade, which makes a unique sound at any time.
I’ve also noticed that when it appears, there is no sound, or even if it did, it was too difficult to hear, and I tried to watch it fight carefully in the solo mod, and each time it show up when I wasn’t even aware of it.

It can blend almost completely into normal enemies and environments without being noticed.

The only noticeable sound cue I can notice is the unique sound effect of the gas grenade after it is thrown but it’s often too late, and he moves his position very quickly. And poison gas will block the view at the same time.

There’s also its AI, which often throws poison gas out of your field of vision, such as resting on walls and obstacles, when it’s already hard to detect.

Finally, there’s the issue of poison gas, which is the only enemy attack that doesn’t damage its allies, and also blocks your view for a long time, quickly cutting your shield, and I’ve noticed that enemies in the gas have a brief glow in their eyes, it may even provide buffs to enemies.

As a special enemy, it has too many advantages and too few hints, which makes its existence very unbalanced.
It’s not that it’s hard to beat, it’s just that it’s very uneven and tiresome.

10 Likes
2

Personally I don’t have a super hard time spotting them. Their model is a lot thicker than pretty much every other humanoid model. Although I will agree the lack of colors can make it hard to see in crowded groups.

Maybe he could have some bright gas coming off of him.in small amounts? No gameplay effect, just a visual hint.

While I felt this was when it launched, I’ve been hearing him more and louder. He really, really likes talking about Nurgle.

I will say, this is my biggest problem with the enemy. It just feels very annoying to deal with imo, and has quickly become specialist priority number 1 because of this. Personally the biggest change I would like to see in this department is just have the gas spread slower out from his grenade he throws. This would give a more time to reposition, so there’s a a bit more counterplay, while still achieving his goal of area denial and enemy buffs.

It does, here is what FS said about. Additionally it makes Mutants run significantly faster. I don’t know if it has any other specific buffs to other enemy types.

2 Likes
3

The problem for me is his throw range is 50m vs scab bomber’s 33m, and they bounce on top of that. You can’t really hear ANY enemies attacking from that far away!

Other than that the relative lack of immediate danger vs fire and his long reload vs bomber (10s between throws instead of 5s) are great. But chucking bombs from the next hab block could use a looksie.

6 Likes
4

there is a recognition issue with the pox bomber, but this guy’s terrible at explaining it.

the pox bomber is a dreg special that has the unique issue among dreg specials that it’s a special that looks like a normal dreg shooter at a distance with another dreg next to it. it’s defining element, like most dreg specials, is their weapons, and the pox bomber’s load of bombs are just the same color as a normal dreg. if it’s not close enough (like past 30 meters or so) then when it’s moving in a crowd or through cover it’s indistinguishable from other dregs until it hucks a pox bomb in front of you.

i’d personally fix this by adding a model of plauge censor like dreg shotgunners have to their belt (probably a different shape) and replacing the tiny, weirdly streamlined detonator packet on the pox bombs with a larger, rustier detonator that also have a big green light on it like the scab bomber’s fire grenades have. that would be enough to make it obviously not a basic dreg shooter at any distance.

1 Like
5

I think most of its “design flaws” were intentional. It’s meant to be elusive. However, I do think it needs some kind of highly distinctive tell besides audio. Maybe something like, after it’s thrown the first grenade successfully, the next one’s arc has a glowing trail, alternating between these two different states until it’s killed so it isn’t completely a freebie. I have personally run Enhanced Target Priority on Veteran since it outlines Elites and Specialists for the team in coherency range to counter the Pox Bomber but its effectiveness in this sense is hard to measure.

1 Like
6

These things are all true, but also poison gas on its own isnt actually very dangerous. Unlike fire or other specials, you can tank it if there’s enemies nearby. Can also run straight through and usually not take damage if you got something for toughness restore or just a lot of toughness. To begin with it doesn’t do actual damage, just toughness removal and some corruption of your HP bar.
All those things considered I think it’s fine if he’s elusive and hard to spot. Seems to be by design

3 Likes
7

My thoughts are not how dangerous it is, but that it violates the rules of the game that other special enemies follow.
This makes the player uncomfortable with it, and special enemies should have special enemy rules, which can be dangerous, but cannot be disobeyed.
I’m not a native English speaker, so hopefully the translator will allow you to understand what I mean.

2 Likes
8

Definitely agree on some of these points. The indicators are too subtle. I think he does a creepy joker-esque laugh but I could just be imagining that :joy: :man_shrugging:

After playing quite a bit since the bomber was introduced, I can’t actually tell if it adds fun or not. I find it very disorientating (which I know is a part of the point of it) and turns the action into a messy lucky-shot gallery. I think this would be better if it happened less frequently during matches. It feels too frequently summoned by the game director for the fairly substantial effect it has on the action.

Will let Fs tweak the gas gameplay for a few patches before making a proper judgement.

9

I dislike how the dreg bomber has the exact same grenade pin release sound the scab bomber has when lobbing their grenades. Give us screaming heads or something a bit more distinctive.

3 Likes
10

i was going to ask you to explain before i read the last sentence. i’m sorry, but the translating AI has badly misread you.

11

The gas is supposed to push the players around and stop us from camping, but in practice people just tend to ignore it. Not because it’s not dangerous but because there are other factors that force the players to hang around a single location, like hacking events. It’s different sure but I wouldn’t really call it “fun”.

The lack of adequate visual and audible clues also limits counterplay. You can barely see the bomber in a crowd because he looks like any other dreg from a distance, and that task becomes impossible once the first grenade goes off because then you can’t see him at all.

1 Like
12

I was running Executioner Stance the other day and noticed the tox gas completely shuts off your magic pee pee vision targetting that is about 33% of what that ult even provides anymore utility wise. Was that really necessary?

13

Obviously, you must counter with your own smoke.

You must bring balance to the smoke.

1 Like
14

I think they just dicked up the alpha layers or something like that. Regular pings also don’t show through it, nor does stuff like disrupt destiny and I’m pretty sure ogryn taunt doesn’t show up either

15

It certainly doesn’t add fun to the game. It’s remarkably stupid and annoying enemy. Not particularly dangerous, aside from when there’s 3 of them throwing grenades from another room / over walls so you can’t target them. They’re just annoying and is actively anti-fun. Just the like gas condition.

16

This topic was automatically closed 7 days after the last reply. New replies are no longer allowed.