15 seconds… woaoaaaaw…
Someone here knows how you play when you’re alone? 15 seconds…
Hey, let’s nerf Loner. Let’s make Loner works only in coherency… So nice idea
Seriously…
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Personally i think that Loner is fine.
It’s such a small tick of toughness, it’s good for flanking and trying to backstab to give you that little extra refill of toughness when you are circling around outside coherency.
Solos will always be solos, it is a human issue the solution to that is Vote kick.
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Jesus people, this is not the solution for speedrunners that leave the team behind. This is not the solution for people that leave the team behind and die.
All this will do is just make those people pick other aura that always works despite not them being in coherency (e.g. toughness dmg reduction) and continue doing their thing.
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Even some specials like: Bomber, flamer and burster suggest that.
If you clump up in the corner too much, you’ll get burned,
if you split too much, you’ll get caught by disablers.
It’s about finding the middle ground, as it usualy is.
This is so true.
I Actually waiting for someone to bring up efficient spawn camping strats to comunity.
Coz i am lazy to do it myself.
I rarely see people who understands this in game.
But when i do, map events became such a breeze.
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More often than not, it’s best to stay together. The situations which you described can and do happen, but they happen because of bad team comp, unbalanced player builds and unperfect decision making (not knowing which targets to prioritize). Indeed, sometimes Zealot has to leave the coherency to kill shooters which pin your team down, because the team has no way of reaching them otherwise (multiple Zealots in the team, no ammo on Veteran, Smite on Psyker etc etc).
And no, I disagree with your statement about classes being both melee and ranged at the same time. There’s a clear distinction between how Ogryn/Zealot and Veteran/Psyker are designed and played.
They might have multiple playstyles, but one pair is best played as a frontline of sorts, the other two are best supporting the team from behind with either damage or utility.
Classes have unique strengths and weaknesses which cannot be denied, they removed infinite dodges from Psyker’s force swords for a reason. Veteran is probably the worst melee class in the game, while Psyker can still one-shot Mutants with a rapier and has “Anticipation” talent in the skill tree, which is one of the best melee talents in the game along with Zealot’s undying passive. Once Vet is forced to switch to a melee, his potential as a class drops by a lot. It’s in the frontliners’ interest to make sure this happens as rarely as possible.
For example, if I have an Ogryn on my team, I expect them to handle revives first and foremost, even if they have a ranged build. Zealot to a lesser extent is a class that should handle melee enemies, since he’s much better at it, even though he’s more of a generalist in reality. Don’t you think there’s a difference between splitting off because of the combat (zoned by certain enemies, completing objective etc), and just going off on your own because you don’t need your team?
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Loner should just count as 2 when not in coherency but you gain no team buffs beyond the toughness regen. But when you’re with the team you provide crit/weakspot damage. That makes it so you can clutch with it, but also promotes you being in coherency to provide a team buff.
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Loner just needs a rework to provide something to the team when you do stick with them. I’m thinking stamina regen or stamina regen delay decrease.
My biggest issue with loner isn’t that it encourages people to break off, like others have said, that is actually encouraged by the game, ultimately loner is only a “you have 2% toughness regen minimum” which isn’t actually strong, but it ain’t nothing. No, my biggest issue is, as a zealot, you could have been providing one of 2 means of increasing team survivability, corruption cleansing or toughness DR. By taking loner you deny your team an entire aura effect.
So all it needs is a minor coherency effect, something like 5% stamina regen or -0.5sec stamina regen delay. This would also mean the zealot who has taken this and is a team player that is doing hit and run (running ahead, pulling a group with an elite snipe and running back to the group or kiting the pull until the group catches up) is able to do that more effectively.
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I hard disagree with this mindset of “roles.” I anything I expect ogyns to just face-tank things with their ridiculous sustain from their 25% toughness restore talents while someone else does the revive. But rally I just expect people that think they can get the revive to get the revive.
Running ahead? Yes I think I am supposed to be at the head of the group. I’ve only considered loner when I am with the group, engage targets, and turn around only to find the group has fallen so far back that I am miles out of coherency. I was against 2 maulers, 2 crushers and a legion of chaff and they all ran off. Also the mentioned last man standing situation.
I think the 15 extra seconds of coherency would be nice because I’d be able to look down at my buffs and see if the friendlies have decided to get my back, my WAY back. Coherency is overrated unless you build for it anyway. There are single nodes that are more powerful than coherency.
Braindead take.
Coherency isn’t going to save you if you make a bad decision.
My guy coherency is more than just regen. All auras are based on coherency so other than loner, coherency is far from overrated.
That said, you can do without most of the auras. They’re a nice to have bonus and all in all taken together, they make you about 10%-20% more effective. But a good player can slap without them. And a bad player will fail in spite of them.
Is this another case of ‘I surely lost because that zealot was running ahead, yes there is no other explanation. That must be it!’?
It’s a decent enough clutch talent that minimally impacts other players. Most of the time you take it because of pathing reasons.
The guy running off and dieing will do so with or without the talent. Just like people will always try to make the game easier.
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Coherency is a meme, nobody cares about it. You build and play self sufficient. If youre relying on coherency to keep your toughness up then youre doing something wrong. Ppl that want to play away from team did it before loner, and will keep on doing it however they might change it in the future.
Your opinion is literally “I don’t want the game to be better.”
You think coherency is bad? Ok so you are saying loner may as well do nothing.
You clearly have nothing of value to offer this discussion with logic like that.
Found the toxic player that refuses to stck with the squad.
I rest my case.
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I play these games since Oct 2015. If you think sitting ducks with your team for some irrelevant buffs and thoughness regen is the way to play this game you have a lot to learn. The only reason for coherency is Survivalist, and if that should be a thing is debatable.
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All that time and you have yet to figure out how to be a team player.
Toxic mindset, assuming I have not been playing a long time. Elitism at its finest.
All that time playing and you don’t even understand that there are other coherency-based interactions. SHM. You clearly have a lot to learn.
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The most efficient teams in both Vermintide and Darktide are the ones where each player can survive on his own. You spread out sweep the map, regrouping when sht hits the fan.
Being a team player doesn’t mean you stick to each other’s ass like glue. There’s a graduation to it. Loner is fine for time when the zealot overextends and isn’t mobile enough to get back to the team. It helps you deal with stuff.
Also the fact that zealot, even more like ogryn (depending on the build) is the last survivor class clutching rezes.
I’m not saying other classes aren’t suited for it. He just has the most efficient kit (along with Ogryn) for it.
Hence this entire issue being a nothingburger. Taking out or changing loner won’t magically change idiots that die on their own. It will only further narrow down the zealot.
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This argument would be true if the other classes had a similar ability. As it stands it is bad for the game. Either the other classes should have a similar aura option or loner needs to be reworked.
I fail to see how making loner an objectively better aura than it currently is is in any way narrowing down the zealot. “idiots will always be idiots” is NOT a valid reason to leave things as is.
Never said it does, this is a strawman. Coherency is a relatively large radius, some talents even increase it. You can spread out and still be in coherency. Stick to the squad. Squad splits should always be in pairs. You should never be alone for long enough for loner to ever be useful, therefore it is basically worthless. Even the people advocating that you shouldn’t stick to coherency say coherency regen isn’t good so loner basically does nothing.
Loner needs to change. The aura is literally a talent tax node for people that are running a build that needs to go down the right side and doesn’t have the extra points to pick either of the other two.