50% Damage Reduction

Warhammer: Vermintide 2 Feedback
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I feel 50% damage reduction with no strings attached (like turning it in to overcharge) is a bit on the strong side, I guess my point mostly applies to Zealot due to its synergy with his other abilities.

You can cut your 180 hp down to 30 hp or under for your 6 stacks of power boost and safely fill up on temp health, if you ever slip up you have Heart of Iron to help you out.

My suggestions mostly apply to these two points.

Points

  1. Have the 50% damage reduction only apply to green health and not temp health.

This way you can choose between being extra tanky or dealing extra damage without changing zealot to much.

So if yo had 100 green hp and took 100 damage you would be left with 50 green hp (100 x 0.5 = 50) and if you had 100 temp hp and took 100 damage you would be left with 0 temp hp.

  1. Heart of Iron seems a bit strong but I don’t want to get rid of it all together so I would suggest doing what Deep Rock Galactic did with its Iron Will perk,

When taking lethal damage you stay up for 10 seconds or so before you go down, if you heal in this grace period you will stay up.

These are just some ideas I had today and thought I’d share, but what do you people think about 50% damage reduction, and what are your takes on the other classes that use it?

P.s. I think this is the longest post I have ever made.

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Sounds good to me and would add more depth to the Zealot beyond just “take a bunch of damage and enter god mode”. He would still be fairly tanky, just not to the rather strong degree that he is now.

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That’s something I suggested before the big balance patch, but it was for Slayer. Didn’t developed the “heal” part tho

I think the 50% damage reduction should be changed to something else. I shall now think about it and come back later xD

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I think a simpler way to balance it would be to have your power stacks be based on total health and not green health.

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Wouldn’t Total Health include Temporary Health though? The thing that OP is against?

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In a way, but i think OP is especially against zealots who intentionally get to 1 hp to have a full health bar. That strategy would no longer make sense if temporary health counted as health for the stacks.

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Ah, I see. I mixed up the 50% damage reduction OP was talking about, and the Power stacks that you’re talking about.

Perhaps it would balance Zealot, but I’m afraid that it might remove the viability of Temporary Health builds.

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Zealot used to work like that back in the early days of V2 but it was always annoying trying to keep your stacks due to zealots amazing temp health regeneration.

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Could just lower the damage bonus the stacks give? Change it to work like other damage stacks for enemies around, make it so it’s only 3% extra damage per 25 health missing. But to be fair, I think a simple nerf to the A&F would work better. It’s the weapon of choice for all Salty jobs now.

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I thought the temp health don’t count. That’s why zealots can get to low hp, get the stacks, then fill up on temp health and keep the stacks. Kinda makes the ‘resists lethal damage’ thing redundant.

Been a while since I played zealt though, so I could be wrong.

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Yeah I agree. Strong as the zealot is, it’s not like every saltzpyre you meet is running that career, far from it. There actually seem to be a good balance there, but as for weapons, virtually anyone is running A&F regardless of the career.

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I really like the idea you have for heart of iron.
Though i think it would be more fun, if instead of healing with supplies in the grace period, it would be possible to simply generate a certain amount of temp health to stay up. This would make it into a minigame of sorts. Of course you would still take damage as normal during it, otherwise it would be beyond overpowered.

I also completely agree with your view on 50% damage reduction, it feels great on unchained since it turns overchage into a sort of second health bar. But on other classes there usually isnt really a downside when there should be.

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Well i would say just change that to work on cooldown like gromlir armor

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OP and I talked and we like how zealot does more damage at low hp and in theory he has a cheat death passive to help with the risk of being at low hp. However since the change to temp hp not counting against stacks there is no risk to keeping high stacks. We agreed that introducing risk to being at low green hp would be ideal as you the player gets to decide how much risk vs reward you take on.

However, one problem I can foresee with OP suggestion is:

It doesn’t seem like V2 can split damage instances. Meaning If you had 50 green hp and 50 temp hp (100 total) and ate a 100 damage over head you would take 100 damage and die with the current system.
Whereas ideally 50 would be eaten by temp hp and the remaining 50 (hitting only green hp) would be cut in half leaving you with 25.

You can see the game doesn’t split damge b/c when using Merc Kruber’s lvl 10 talent that gives you 35% dmg reduction when under 50% if you eat a 100 damage overhead you always take 100 damage. The little bit of damage after you hit 50% doesn’t get reduced by the talent. It only works when you take the instance of damage at 50% or below.

IDK but I’m guessing Fatshark would have to rewrite huge chunks of code to make this work, and its probably not worth doing for a talent here or there.

The other option is to implement this with the current system in which case even 1 temp hp means no damage reduction for the entire next hit. Or in other words you only get the damage reduction when you take a hit with 0 temp hp. And IMO that’d be too big of a nerf.

Other Ideas:

Simplest balance ideas:

Increase minimum damage taken part to 15-20. Keep it separate from slayer’s numbers. TBH might not be enough as you still wont get bursted

Or reduce the 50% reduction to 25%, 30%, or 35% and keep the 10 dmg minimum.

Maybe replace all zealot lvl 10 talents with different values balanced around the higher the dmg reduction the higher the min damage.

More complex ideas:

Keep talent as is but add a caveat of no temp hp gain at all to force you to take on the risk of low hp. Possibly give him passive regen of some kind for balance. Would have to change lvl 20 temp hp talents though so it would have to be a career rework and not just a talent change.

Or in line with what Perteks suggested above, allow him to reduce the next damage instance by 50% on a 5-10 sec cool down. Or give him 5 sec of 50% damage reduction when you take damage on a 20-30 sec cool down. A mechanic or cool down to play around could keep the power at the higher skill end and prevent him from being a catchall meta tank.

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