If the player increase is more signifant that the others 2 dlc, it is not the norm. The dlc itself is a success. The bugs were not. The balance patch was a bit overloaded as well.
The player counts arenāt necessarily an indicator of quality. We have no idea how much marketing was spent on WoM vs. the other DLCs. Also, more players might be just because they called it an āexpansionā instead of a DLC, even though many of us think thereās a lot less content than we would expect in a DLC, rather than more.
And itās only āthe most players everā if you ignore the actual game launch. There were way more players then.
I donāt doubt that WoM was more financially lucrative than the other DLCs, but it seems rather shortsighted as they basically lit their game on fire and then a bunch of people paid to come watch it burn.
Edit:
Yes, definitely. I canāt think of another game that was so liked with a DLC that was so hated. Iām actually a bit curious what other good games have had such bad DLC.
4 Likes
I know the the āWoM badā bandwagon has already been beaten to death several times over, but even I canāt really get myself to agree with the statement āthe DLC itself is a successā.
Iām going to be a bit critical here Froh, so apologies in advance.
Your argument for WoM being considered a success is that, despite the negative reception the DLC has gotten, the player count had (emphasis on had) increased and, more importantly, that those players are here āto stayā.
And to an extent, this is true. WoM saw the biggest spike in player count on launch and was considered a top-seller on Steam for a few days, so in that regard, you could say it was a success.
And while Iām not a member of your Discord and so I cannot vouch for whether or not the new people that joined it are still there, the overall player count tells a different story.
Pre-WoM, the player count, according to Steam charts, sat at 3200+ people.
Now, a month later, post-WoM, it sits at 2500+ people.
I wouldnāt call this a success in my book, and the 11000 people that joined us certainly arenāt around to stay, judging by this. I hardly believe bugs alone could drive that many people away.
WoM was a success in drawing people in with great marketing behind it - it failed in keeping them there with lack of replayability and far too many changes alienating the previous playerbase, and in turn, has now caused the community to be even smaller, and even more divided than it already was.
4 Likes
Yeah, itās because you (and others) mostly ignore the 40 weaves that are repeated (because they donāt like them) and the work needed for a new whole faction.
No worries I can handle that. Though I must precise that I also donāt think the expansion is a success. But it is CERTAINLY NOT a ātotal failureā to quote the first post.
2 Likes
Donāt forget that this is most likely the end of holidays for a lot of peopleā¦
1 Like
I notice you cut off the part where I said āmany of us thinkā to make it look like I was claiming a fact rather than openly stating an opinion. Yes, I know all of that. They could make a DLC with 7,000 new outfits and I would think there was no content because content to me means adventure maps. After all, that is the core gameplay experience and has been for years now.
5 Likes
It is, but the player count was even higher before the holidays, having been all the way to 6400+ in April and 5200+ in May through June.
Sure. I will admit that some of the changes that Fatshark made were fine, that they did strive to fix bugs even though a lot of future patches would simply bring those bugs back.
As was stated it was my personal opinion that with my experience throughout VT2ās development that has left me feeling a bit rankled - I did not mention anything about how much they deserve my support or not. As in my own review for the game it has flip flopped between Not Recommended and Recommended a few times. Initial release? Not Recommended. Eventually I switched that because sure they were trying to fix/balance their game. Update 2.0 and WoM got switched back to where it was.
Talent changes for the most part were pretty good however some of these talents arenāt at all good and if any contradict other changes the developers made. Innate passive stat increases disappeared like for instance Waystalker you could get increased crit chance or attack speed - while these werenāt visually interesting they did help when it came to build variety. The level 30 talent that gave you THP was useful if you were to play a more melee centered build where taking damage would be a greater possibility and since WS has zero damage mitigation unlike other classes having that back up THP to bolster the natural healing was pretty good. Now what do we have? Niche sniper ult, ammo back on certain kill ult and one that simply adds 1 more arrow. First two are interesting and the third is rather superfluous imo.
For everything they did change for whatever reason. What about what they didnāt? Base crafting system is still crappy with hordes of materials that are sitting in storage because there is really nothing to use for them. Traits/Modifiers still left untouched even though a lot of them are never used or are simply bad mechanically. Why werenāt these things changed at all?!?
Faction. More frustrating then enjoyable for me due to issues with sound and spawning. Bestigor Charge is awkward usually in itās performance and I dislike Wargorās banner because it only emphasizes a slower gameplay due to the health/healing boost that it gives. I would almost rather have it knockback more like in the Beta and perhaps have increased damage/attack speed. The banner and pathing of the Wargor can also be problematic. Where it can place said banner in an awkward spot and should the Wargor die you are stuck with that buff sitting there for an eternity.
Iām also of the opinion that the Beastmen lack variety to the point that they laughably borrow Skaven/Norscan specials in Dark Omens despite showing a beastmanās blade stuck through a rat ogre early on in the map suggesting that they are highly territorial and wouldnāt suffer the other factions presence. Yes I think this faction could use 1 or 2 more specials and perhaps another elite and monster. Why not? Currently to me they feel more like 1/2 or 3/5 of a faction when you have the other two to compare them to. Whatever they said about beastmen emphasizing hordes is more of an excuse imo - more so when these hordes are broken pertaining to zero noise and spawns that happen right behind you or right behind the corner in clown car fashion.
Weaves was a poorly implemented game mode due to itās progression system and level dispersal relying on competitive nature as opposed to the co-op roots that VT2 is known for. GDās Shattered Realm did a far better job in that despite not having randomized dungeons the devs made so many different little maps for that game mode and allowed them to be randomly selected that each play through it would be highly unlikely to have the same sequence as you did before. Plus the Shattered Realm didnāt massively split up the community and create scenarios where a player would be waiting for 30 minute to get a full team to actually play the game. Oh and Shattered Realmās rewards actually pertained to the base game.
Stagger system as I stated in the Beta would only restrict certain weapon uses and play styles and I would say that to a degree I was right in this regard. Hopefully the developers will either buff those that are lacking to be more useful in this new combat system or lessen the effects of the stagger system in some ways and emphasize them in others (like shields or defensive weapons).
So sure I commend Fatshark for continuing to support Vermintide 2. Letās hope they learn to communicate more and release content that is in a more stable state.
4 Likes
Ehmā¦ yes, that is of course what I do, I write emotional posts with sole purpose of making my victims as angry as possible.
Thank you, I guess 
ps: I wasnāt active for quite a long time in this threadā¦
2 Likes
Because there was a lot of hype and they called it expansion not just āsmallā DLC.
This was such a failure and reviews reflect it.
Weaves - complete fail on nearly all fronts (winds/map design is great tho), balance - omgā¦ ppl disabling DLC just to get rid of beastmen for example, new core mechanics & broken / changed old ones - ughrā¦ , bugs - insane amount of those because there was no proper testing done. Halberd bugged for 10 patches ā¦ most probably because the attack buffering nonsense, that nobody really needed and canāt be switched on (ffs)ā¦ and so onā¦
Exactly, I was never so irritated in over a year of playing this game as I was during WoM.
The issue is mostly decisions, I donāt know what is going in FS studio but manā¦ if they canāt fix easy stuff like leaderboard filtering, so itās not full of people basically cheating ranks, then wth are they doing thereā¦
6 Likes
Well, you also posted to a public forumā¦ did you just think everyone would unanimously agree with you? Thatād be an example of the Groupthink principal if Iāve ever seen it. Moreover, how can anyone learn anything about thought or reasoning without understanding the arguments of someone who thinks differently than you?
One of the keys, here, is that I approached you asking for clarification. I canāt properly argue or make a case unless there are some specific points to argue againstā¦ therein I tried to provide a few of my own so we could banter and try to understand one anotherās positions. Do you still care to put forth some reasons so we can go over them?
Either way, it seems that you have little else to offer to the topic than calling me a ānuthugger.ā Were I able to edit my title, Iād gladly take that one up; how else can I show appreciation for Almonds, Pecans, Cashews, and Peanuts? 
3 Likes
An apple and an orange are both fruits, so depending on the focus of the comparison, it is still possible.
what is it a nuthugger? a squirrel? SQUIRREL!
1 Like
As long as RANKED weaves are unaccessible to people who do not have pre-made groups no one will care. I want to compete and get the portrait frames but the doing the high level ones with randoms does not work and the players that are good and communicate have already cleared them with pre made groups. There is zero motivation for good players who have cleared the weaves that you need to clear to come help you. I donāt know how this weave QP wil work in terms of actually finding a team but making it unranked automatically loses my interest.