Psykers flamer staff, gives me a headache
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Some builds are too good at everything.
I would not mind golden toughness at its current strength if it required significant investments in talent points and player have to choose between it and, for example, source of significant boss damage. The psyker’s smite alone has more impact on the game than full Ogryn tank. The krak grenades with demo stockpile and demo team provides much easier and more reliable way to kill elites and bosses than any zealots
A general balance pass for weapons /builds / classes which apparently have a PLOT armour. All this is warping usability of other weapons / builds, and leads to nonsense like Rotten Armour in Havoc, as Fatshark is struggling to create a challenging environment for twitched out “meta” riders.
Less weapons, blitzes and abilities we have in the game which trivialise / “one-shot” all threatening enemy classes, better. Less infinite cleave long range weapon and builds options we have, better. Less permanent CC, better. Less golden toughness nonsense, better.
I don’t want to see any nerfs. I think everything is as it should be. I actually want even more BUFFs. I want old weapons to be strengthened, to get more damage, and the ability to penetrate armor. I want all psyker staffs, except for the fire one, to have much more damage. I want the knife to finally become effective against armor. I want so much, but there is always that one group of experienced players who think only of themselves and not of the entire community and new players. So buy buy baby, and I will always and forever oppose the toxic minority that emphasizes only their own interests and not the entire community.
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I wonder if the knife would drop hard if every weapon would have +6% rending and not +24% (like the new shivs).
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I for one, want knives and other silly pokes to finally stop being so good against armour and have silly levels of mobility 
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I don’t think they would drop extremely hard but it would make them less powerful for sure.
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In all seriousness Idk what nerfs i would want, but i sure would like for weapons to have drawbacks. Lighter weapons = more mobility less powa, Heavier weapons = less mobility more powa.
So maybe nerfing uncanny hehe.
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Maybe you misunderstood me. I wasn’t accusing you of anything. Just wondering if that keystone is getting much use outside rumbler shenanigans. I imagine it does work with kickback as well. Just asking because I’m always gonna want to be extra careful with nerfs if its attached to a keystone that doesn’t see much use otherwise.
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neither did I feel that way.
I was referring to people’s general dismissal of the rumbler, putting it together with BLO as if there wasn’t another use for it.
so in that regard I say “nerf away” I aint affected by it anyways 
to a degree some stubber setup could benefit from BLO but the explosion and stuff of the rumbler in particular is truly over the top
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This 10,000%
Havoc is essentially a distinct separate experience from the rest of the game, with a different meta, that caters to a tiny percentage of the playerbase where the overwhelming vast majority of players won’t ever play and certainly not at the highest levels. It needs to be handled on its own, making changes to the rest of the game just for a separate meta that only the tiniest fraction of the playerbase will experience is a terrible idea.
Not if they don’t want outsized effects for the rest of the game modes when Havoc skews the meta as strongly as it does.
There’s plenty of stuff that’s perfectly fine at all other difficulties that isn’t in Havoc, stuff that dramatically over/under performs in Havoc that doesn’t for lower difficulties. Take Plasma Guns, if you’re rolling around just playing Heresy or Damnation, the PG is never going to have anywhere near the utility it has in Havoc because the ammunition constraints, enemy damage soak, and enemy concentration that enable the Plasma Gun to perform so efficiently just aren’t present in the same ways outside of Havoc. You aren’t going to get 12 Shotgunners spawning on the same spot to insta-blap with a single shot for instance.
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Whatever balance changes may be needed, they absolutely should not be based on havoc.
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NERFS:
-Uncanny Strike
-Dueling sword - uncanny nerf might take care of this.
-Combat blade - uncanny nerf might take care of this.
-Psyker ranged and melee DPS. I don’t play the class, but playing with them you can tell their DPS is absurd in melee and at range.
-Psyker Smite - too much crowd control, trivializes encounters, little risk to the psyker.
-Psyker survivability. They should be squishier to compensate for their absurd ranged DPS.
-Plasma Gun - its high damage and cleave should be moved to the charged shot.
-Veteran grenades - they seem to be able to spam them too much and/or they’re too strong.
-Veteran melee DPS
-Revolver with hand cannon
-Arbites shock maul - It’s too good at everything, reminds me of dueling sword.
-Ogryn grenade launcher weapon - kills everything, including my FPS.
BUFFS:
-Zealot melee DPS - currently matched or outclassed by multiple other classes that are also stronger than zealot in other areas such as ranged DPS or crowd control.
-Thunder hammer
-Zealot keystone Inexorable Judgement
-Zealot flame and flash grenades - currently outclassed by similar blitzes of other classes such as shock mines and chem grenades.
-Zealot talent-based buffs being more conditional to activate/maintain and thus having poorer uptime than those of some other classes.
-Arbites keystone Terminus Warrant
-Shredder autopistol
-Infantry, headhunter, and braced autoguns
-Infantry lasguns
I strongly disagree that Zealot Chorus should be nerfed UNTIL the zealot class is generally brought more in line with Psyker, Veteran, Ogryn, and Arbites. Currently zealot has been power-crept pretty badly by the other classes - keep nerfing him and no one will play the class at all.
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Revert whatever they did to pox bursters. There are more of them, their explosion radius is all over the place and they “lock on” to their target while jumping more than ever. Probabby the third most unfun enemy in the game after Trapper and Mutant.
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After this recent change, pox burster has dethroned trapper as #1 most unfun enemy for me. They were probably #2 before that.
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I do not even find it strong, just extremely annoying. I usually leave as soon as I see a Smite player. Needs a major rework or replacement.
I strongly disagree. Not because it is weak or strong, but because it is one of the only viable weapons for the average player in Havoc. If you nerf it further, the class is left with nothing weapon wise in havoc. ( don’t start about the 1%players with an axe or shield )
This one is fine. For this build to work, the Ogryn has to take almost all the ammo on the map, plus you need a Veteran running Survivalist. I would say that is balanced.
I agree with the rest of your points.
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You’re certainly not the first person I’ve read or seen leave games if there’s a smite psyker there. If an ability is so annoying OR so OP that it causes people to straight up leave games, then it needs a re-work. I personally think it’s too powerful to be able to CC an entire room with long duration on command, but either way you’re right that a re-work is needed.
This may be true, I don’t play Havok for the most part. But I strongly believe that this game should NOT be balanced around Havok. I think doing that will eventually ruin the game. Havok should either be better balanced around us, or it should be accepted as intentionally absurd and unbalanced.
I don’t play Ogryn, but I can say that whenever there’s a grenade launcher Ogryn on my team, they kill everything with never-ending explosions, vet or no vet. If there’s 2 grenade launcher Ogryns, I may just leave. It sucks the fun out of the game.
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I agree that balance should not be focused around Havoc. At the same time, Arbiter has been hammered by nerfs. Some of them were justified, but overall these changes have left the kit in a state similar to Zealot in the past. You effectively have two viable builds, both of which rely on the shock maul. Everything else is suboptimal and actively hurts your team.
TL;DR: The class needs an overall balance pass.
Fair enough. That’s a legitimate concern.
The entire right side Ogryn tree is entirely cucked by the Rumbler, and to a lesser extent GG and Kickback existing. You can’t give it sustain because it would be too strong. You can’t give too much damage because then those options would be too strong. It’s hard to justify taking that keystone because you lose so much of your melee power, and the best synergy it has is giving a guaranteed proc to single shot weapons.
All of this leaves the twin linked stubbers, the Mk2 and 6 Ripper Guns, and the Gorgonum and Krourk Heavy Stubbers in a bad state where they have no where they can really shine (Havoc opinion).
I don’t want Rumbler or Kickback Spam to come back, or GG spam to become a new thing, but it would be neat to somehow make those other ranged options into a full build.
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