Perils for psyker often feel like a strict buff rather then a risk/reward mechanic, its all reward with a extremely tiny risk. Especially since the risk is entirely removed by both Venting Shriek and Scrier’s Gaze as they both allow you to negate a perils overload.
PERILS of the warp being almost strictly a reward mechanic is a little ridiculous. Like imagine if in tabletop (9th and prior) you roll double 1s on a psychic test, you don’t take d3 mortal wounds, instead you deal an additional d3 mortal wounds and heal d3 wounds and gain +1 to your save for the rest of the round. That is practically how it functions in this game.
My suggestion: Warp Bleed
Warp Bleed would essentially reflect your psyker fighting against the influence of the warp, reflecting the on screen effects. From 50% Perils and up you begin taking toughness damage every second. This wound scale from 1 damage at 50% to 10 damage at 100%. (for reference full coherency toughness regen is 8/s so this basically entirely negates it until 90% perils it would essentially just be a nerf to your toughness regen. But the exact damage number could be tweaked depending on how it feels, I think this is a decent baseline)
Psyker as is could pretty easily heal this off with full use of their perks especially in combat. But I think it would at least give some form of risk to the reward, if your not carful and stay at high perils there is a chance you could loose your toughness and be vulnerable to damage. It just actually gives a reason to quell under 50% because as it is quelling under 50% is basically actively nerfing yourself in most psyker builds for practically no benefit.
Psyker is my #2 most played class. This would be a minor nerf considering how much toughness generation psyker has right now. It would just give some sort of risk to perils.
Good post, like the overall idea of more damage output = squishier Psyker.
This part in Scrier’s is overkill with Psyker’s other Toughness regen Talents, should be the opposite, at the very least something else besides 20% TDR
How? Like even at havoc 40 just generating/quelling 10% perils heals 5 toughness, something that can easily happen multiple times a second. Just getting a single melee kill or one critical hit entirely negates this never mind all the other psyker toughness generation abilities and toughness damage reduction. Literally just taking One with the Warp would make it 6 toughness damage a second at max perils. This would do very little to competent psykers but at least give a tiny bit of risk to staying at high perils.
Emperor forbid there be a tiny amount of risk to the most powerful class in the entire game.
Taking non-stop toughness dmg over 50% perils is quite self-evidently suicidal. This isn’t a subject that can be reasonably debated. In fact this will be my very last post in this thread as I am completely convinced this will never find traction with developers no matter what will be said in this thread.
1-10 damage… That is 10 full seconds to loose all your toughness while sitting at max perils at havoc 40. It takes less then half a second to quell your perils and doing so would heal more toughness then you would loose building up to max perils. I mean hell coherency toughness completely negates this up to 95% perils. This isnt going to kill you or do that much besides being a tiny risk to sitting at high perils the entire game.
Like one shooter sitting at long range occasionally landing a single bullet on you is going to do more damage then this effect.
As a main Psyker, I could accept some in-lore consequences of riding the warp too closely, but I wouldn’t like just some DoT, but rather more tangible atmospheric effects like hallucinations or smaller demons spawning around us. (edit: Or a combination of both: hallucinated demons that can only be seen and attack the Psyker, leading to the bizarre scene for the other teammates – maybe except for other Psykers – of them fighting nothing but empty air.)
A somewhat more drastic idea that I have for some time is that blowing ourselves up by Peril – optionally only on death – could have a small chance of spawning a (maybe weakened) Monstrosity, because our eruption ripped a hole in the fabric of the universe. It probably would make Peril more of a threat than it is now.
But as it seems, Fatshark isn’t likely to make Peril more dangerous since they even added a talent that avoids going down from it.
It is a great idea, likely something like the tzeentch illusion effect in SM2. But also very difficult to implement I imagine. I feel like a damage over time effect would be the simplest and most impactful way to make warp perils feel actually dangerous. Though maybe just some kind of negative effect would be good. Like a incoming damage boost for being at high perils could be something. Just something to make perils seem actually dangerous lol.
Yeah, I’m aware that my ideas would take much more effort to be implemented than simply triggering effects that are already part of the game, but one can dream. (But not too vividly, ‘cause the Warp is shaped by our dreams.)
An incoming damage boost isn’t very viable IMO, because Psykers are already very squishy without the DR bonus from high Peril (and even with it against single high-damage attacks). An incoming DB would IMO contradict that existing mechanic and obviously isn’t part of Fatshark’s concept for the class, and AFAIK it also wouldn’t have an equivalent in WH40k lore for Psykers.
Then I would rather take your initial DoT idea with the existing DR bonus from high Peril, so we could negate some of it but at the cost of keeping our Peril even higher and thus also the risk of blowing ourselves up. Other possible already existing mechanics would be visual effects like blurred or otherwise obscured vision, or occasional glitches or split-second blackouts. (Although they may raise the number of erroneous bug reports from people who’d see them as graphical errors.)
edit: The Psyker always was a high-risk/high-reward class with a high skill bottom and ceiling. I’d try to keep any adjustments within that concept.
Yeah that’s fair. I do definitely feel like there is more that could be done with the effect that wouldn’t be too hard to implement. Id probably say fake hit sound effects/specialist sounds. Such as hearing a backstab alert when there isn’t an enemy behind you or a dog pounce. Fake sound effects would be pretty easy to implement but also could be rather annoying and there 100% would be a mod to remove them on the nexus same day they are added lol.
I have considered various things like that but I keep coming back to the conclusion that a damage over time effect would be both lore accurate and not too annoying. Just another factor to consider making the high perils play style actually have a risk to it rather then just rewards.
I like the idea of fake sound effects. But alas, it would also be prone to false bug reports. sigh
While I can totally understand your plea, I wouldn’t say that Peril has no risk, especially in higher difficulties and hectic situations where I still blow myself up or at least nearly, especially if I’m running a dome build that doesn’t have a “delete Peril” button like Shreak and SG, and depending on the situation it can be very risky up to outright impossible for my team to get me up.
It also depends on the player. I see less skilled players blow themselves up all the time, and as always, I suspect that they respresent the vast majority of mediocre “casual” players. I wouldn’t want to make it even harder for them just to counteract the top 10% pro players (which I don’t consider myself part of, rather a “somewhat experienced” one after ~1000 hours). Or at least I could understand if Fatshark sees it that way.
That is fair, though where sitting at high perils is most powerful is also with builds that essentially ignore peril overcharge. This would mean that bubble psykers need to play a little more carefully but it would also reign in the absurd damage of Shriek/Scrier’s builds by making them a little more risky. Like the toughness regen on psyker right now is really dam high.
That is fair yeah. But that is also why psyker has gotten basically nothing but buffs since launch, despite always being the best class. I mean people didnt start complaining about the dueling sword until it got given to the other classes, and even then no one started complaining about the force swords despite them being better. Psyker currently is the most powerful class in the game by a wide margin, I don’t think we need to baby new psykers that much. Maybe make it more clear that psyker is the hardest class to learn or something.
And yeah, there is almost no reason to ever quell below 40 or 50% Peril since it’s so quick (especially with Solidity, which I really like taking) and you get sooo many buffs for being above 50%. The only reason I could think of is when you have ‘Just a Dream’. And even then…
Warp ghost is also really nice to have, allows you to forgo a Stam curio, and basically has no downsides.
But honestly, I’m struggling to think of a good mechanic for high peril which isn’t absolutely annoying to deal with, like Sienna’s high Overcharge slowdown in VT2, and which does not make Warp Unbound even more valuable than it already is.
That’s why I mentioned single high-damage attacks and the high skill requirements. Psyker can be very powerful in the right hands, but IMO the class needs more practice than other classes, as I see constantly in random Psyker players as in my own group of regulars where even overall better players who’re used to other classes struggle hard whenever they occasionally play Psyker.
Its high Toughness regen doesn’t help against high-damage attacks or just an unlucky situation when an actually not that powerful attack gets you just in a brief window of low TGH. In my experience (i.e. with my second-most played Ogryn) other classes like the Zealot or Ogryn have much more survivability as soon as they take health damage.
As someone recently said in another threat (here or on Steam or Reddit) about Psykers ruling the damage chart in the Scoreboard mod, Psykers are designed to be the damage dealers of the team, but they need their tougher teammates as a shield to fulfill that role. Again, spoken for all players across all difficulties and personal skill levels.
Or course, all of this is anecdotal and personal, but another indication of this is to me that I don’t see many Psykers – including myself – clutching successfully after the rest of the team was captured (if they didn’t seem to be overskilled for that difficulty in the first place).
TL;DR: I see too many bad Psyker players even if they’re good with other classes to think that the class is absolutely “the best” of all classes. Like Wolverine, it’s arguably just the best in what it does.
But all that said, because all of this is very anecdotal and depending on personal experience, I actually didn’t want to argue with you about whether your suggestions are needed, but rather which ones could be viable and/or an interesting addition to the gameplay. Cheers.
edit: I’m going offline now, so long and have a nice day.
I feel like this is because a lot of psykers are built as back line support/support DPS. I tend to gravitate towards Scrier’s Force Greatsword as that is more of a frontliner build. I haven’t played it much in havoc but even in auric maelstrom I can pretty easily solo clutch. My most played class is zealot (About 50% more playtime on zealot then psyker).
I honestly feel like playing Scrier’s force greatsword is just a better version of relic blade charge zealot. Sure you loose until death and you get gunned down by ranged enemies a lot easier, but in exchange you get about +50% more base damage and a insane screen wipe button.
I like playing both, zealot is definitely my “comfort” pick just because its easier really. But whenever I feel like actually trying I swap to greatsword psyker and deal 2x the damage playing essentially the same way.
It probably would make Peril more of a threat than it is now.
(But not too vividly, ‘cause the Warp is shaped by our dreams.)