Veteran and Champion players need more content

This is the first time Greyknight654 has posted

And the no-answer part don’t help either, to think that it’s not.

Well, he repeated himself quite often but the point he wants to made comes across. However, in terms of content I am not sure that there is so much difference for Legend and Veteran players:

  • not sure you can count a higher difficulty new content per se, so Legend and Veteran are similar in that regard. Cataclysm is a bit special as it mixes the game up a bit more and also changes the approach one should take towards the game slightly

  • Okri’s challenges are basically double anyway. Each mission based challenge is one time without difficulty and one time Legend based and for the Helmgart missions Cataclysm based also. Though, there are some challenges only for Champion+ (100 games, Helmgart armor) or Legend (Helmgart armor) although again, the same challenge can be found for Veteran

  • He has a point for the Weaves as the content you get there is direct proportional to your skill level. The farer you come the more you see

So I am not sure what kind of content he has visualized. Because maps or similar is content for everyone and not Veteran/Champion alone.

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I might rephrase the post: “Vet and Champ players need better reasons to be engaged” aka “something worth working toward”. This is what I tried to address in the Engagement post. Veterans and Champ players are more casual and make up a significant portion of the playerbase (silent majority, likely) since as with any game, the most vocal tend to be those that play the most.

Basically, Vet & Champ players need reasonable goals to grind for to keep them engaged and learning. Since the loot system is 100% RNG, having a goal to grind for doesn’t really exist outside leveling up. Putting some sort of carrot (red dust) that they can make regular, consistent progress toward (example I used was red dust deed crafting for scrap in other post) is key to keeping them playing.

Pure RNG rewards loses more players than it keeps. It works in mobile microtransaction games, because there one whale is worth 50K other customers on average, but that’s not the case here.

Maby he wants somthing like the helmgard challenges for every difficulty , like vet players to earn something for them , some chests and a trimmed down version of the frame like you got it with fow. Would be good idea for those beginners I think, at least it wouldn’t hurt anybody.
Edit: and yes deed crafting or making challenges where you maby earn one red dust would be nice as well maby 5 of them so they can craft like 1 weapon with those

Then again those are issues what people in Legend/Cata also face so i don’t really get why you think champion/vet players only need lets just say these improvements.

I frankly think a more reasonable carrot than RNG is needed at all levels, which is why I wrote a post on it (craft deeds, and some deeds include red dust as a reward - visible on the deed and mission).

Pure RNG rewards loses more players than it keeps. It works in mobile microtransaction games, because there one whale is worth 50K other customers on average, but that’s not the case here.

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“Vet and Champ players need better reasons to be engaged” is a very true point, I agree with it.

It is my plan to start a separate topic on suggestions for veteran and champion if this thread is successful enough. I will post it later.

I agree with your point about new maps not resolving the issue that I address in my initial post. As for careers and weapons, I may just make a new topic based on that if someone else has not done that already in terms of suggesting ideas for veteran and champion players. If this thread gives them enough attention of-course.

I did not mean for content = achievement. I meant content as in for example for legend and cataclysm players there is cataclysm, weaves, fow. Mainly what there is available for players “to do” in veteran and champion stage which is very little compared to legend and cataclysm. I hope this makes sense.

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That is a good point about Fatshark going in the right direction. I think if Fatshark were to consider the veteran and champion players they would scale further into the right direction. Unfortunately, the purpose of my post was to recommend, as you said, that Fatshark needs to go into the right direction. My example in my initial post was the efficiency of targeting a larger population of players. However, if I am to suggest ideas for veteran and champion, I would do that on a new topic. Before doing that, I want to see the responses of my initial post whether going for veteran and champion content is a good idea. I hope that makes sense.

@dannylew8299 No. It’s up to Fatshark or the responses of this post to suggest more ideas, not only maps.

No, it was not only about the challenges for legend and cataclysm. Some people do play legend and cataclysm for the challenges and then get bored of the game after that. Once they have “earned” their portrait frames which they are proud of. I agree that there should be content for all difficulties and not just veteran and champion. However, Fatshark has focused too much on legend and cataclysm such that veteran and champion has been slightly neglected, therefore, to maintain those potential legend players they need reasons to keep playing. Which is up to Fatshark.

Sorry that my initial post was so long, but I insisted to get all my points across with supporting evidence. It was not my intention to troll. The purpose of my initial post was to suggest that vet/champ players need more content, I was not making suggestions for what kind of content because it’s up to Fatshark to do that. On the other hand, the responses to my initial post may also contain the suggestions from other players. Whether or not they agree with my post.

I simply address the issue I think Fatshark should work on. Not suggestions. If you have any suggestions, please post them by replying to this topic! If this thread gets enough attention and agreement. Then I will post a new topic regarding suggestions for veteran and champion.

Sorry to say that but the whole argumentation is, as it is presented at the moment, just wrong.

Except Cataclysm, what is simply another step in difficulty, you can do everything on Veteran and Champion that you can on Legend+. Neither Weaves or FoW are Legend+ exclusive.
Maybe Cataclysm can be seen as exclusive Legend+ -player content, since it is “sold” as that… what has been criticised/discussed in other topics already. And yes, that’s not fair for Veteran and Champion players, to pay for that too, even if they just wanna get access to Weaves or Beastmen.

No it’s not. You can not say “I wAnT sOmeThInG eLsE”, but don’t say what you want. Atleast give a direction, what kind of content you like to see. I mean, you must have anything in mind if you start a post like that, don’t you?

That would be an unnessesary duplicate of this topic, since the title “Veteran and Champion players need more content” already implies that. You should come up with smth. in your next reply here simply to have a foundation on which you can start an actual discussion :wink:. Because, right now, your post is simply a pointless shoutout.

First you will have to actually know why people stop after Recruit / Veteran. And I really don’t think it’s linked to the challenges. I think they are :

  • People that will quit because they find the game too boring. In terms in they don’t see any kind of depth in it. And for them, it’s a left clic simulator.
  • People that do complete all maps, and for them, it’s the main game done, they don’t care about “extra quest”.
  • People that complete the game in a difficulty, and don’t think a new difficulty will bring new content (which is kinda true, as all weapons and all maps are available in all difficulties, all careers too).

Nowhere I’ve seen rather new people quitting because they didn’t have new frames (or easier challenges for veteran difficulties).

I’m not opposed to new frames, I just don’t think it will actually change something.

I did propose a while ago a system of “long quest” with small milestones and big milestones, to progress a player from recruit through legend (or even cataclysm).

Something like a rewarding “big line of stuff to do”. And when you complete it, something rather unique gameplay wise (a weapon with a unique effect, a new weapon unlock, a new career, or something else, access to new maps). Something that a new player would desire to actually try.

I would also remove the veteran limit, so a recruit can actually start directly veteran difficulty (to have a sense that the game can have some depth that is, again, totally invisible in recruit).

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I really like that idea. I made a post regarding “content evolution” across difficulties a while back on reddit aswell. Things like that will not change in V2 anymore I guess but maybe it could impact the gameflow for V3 :sweat_smile:

Actually, as we’ll see new content (careers are kinda confirmed, we can guess new weapons too). That would mean, okay, we ask to players to step up “a bit”, but the reward is a freakin’ new career, or new weapon, or something else.

“Legendary” weapons could also be a thing => You can’t roll any properties on them, they do change your ult for a specific career (Like, I don’t know, Ironbreaker’s taunt now sets enemy on fire). Therefore, make your already existing char plays another way.

As for V3, they said there won’t be any V3 for a decade as the “core” of the V2 game is perfect. I kinda agree with that position. V2 is like Payday 2. The core is done well. You can build stuff on this.

Thanks for explaining. You do have veteran weaves, you do have veteran FoW, i can’t think of a content that is locked for cata or legend :/.

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