What they should do is make monster drop resources. Especially daemonhosts. Killing a daemonhost should be a jackpot. Right now it is simply objectively the best decision to ignore daemonhosts, and I hate how the poor game design choices are causing friction between serious players and the “SUFFER NOT THE HERETIC TO LIVE” casual players that attack the daemons simply because they’re an opponent. A sufficiently potent reward behind daemon kills would likely be enough to shift the serious tryhards to adopt tactics to actually make efforts to kill the daemons instead of the presently correct decision of writing off two players for dead and proceeding with the map with care.
The meta for resource harvesting should align with a game where the players step up to the challenge of fighting the daemon instead of just ignoring it. Right now it’s pure risk and no reward.
in Vermintide 2 you can craft a perfect weapon with incredible ease, and yet it has more players than Darktide despite being like 5 years older, people don’t need a loot treadmill to play games.
Darktide doesn’t need to be a looter shooter. I don’t think you could get anyone to say that they’re staying because of the gear grind loop. I don’t have fun being unable to experiment with my weapons in Darktide. I don’t want to roll a slot machine after hours of window shopping and plasteel grinding just to have it all wasted.
I had 3 hours on Vermintide 2 prior to Darktide and now I have something around 250 hours in the game. I buckled down on Kruber and now 8 out of the 13 or so weapons he has are red and I get to tweak them as often as I want if I need to adjust something. Everyone but Sienna (level 24) are all level 35 now and have a few reds here and there, with Bardin being my second most played.
I have >800 hours in Darktide and a lot of my weapons are still imperfect or unsatisfactory. I have a handful of very well-rolled and considerably perfect 375+ weapons across all 4 operatives, but that’s a drop in the bucket to the 45-something weapons available in the game right now (multiply some of those by 3 for 3 out of 4 operatives that share general weapons), and most of those perfectly rolled weapons are not operative-unique weapons (with the exception of ogryn).
I have to do this 4 times on all 4 operatives. I have to do this 3 times with the same weapon for 3 out of 4 of the operatives.
The lock change was placebo at best for weapons. It was an actual improvement for curios.
If they let us change 3 things on weapons instead of 2, the amount of RNG failure would drop considerably without really affecting this weird perception of player retention from crafting.
Players aren’t staying because there is no new content to play with. New maps don’t really do much. And the content we have is either not balanced (many blessings are awful or useless) or restricted by arbitrary means.
As many others have said, a ton of people aren’t here for the gear chase. Beating the game at higher and higher difficulties or experimenting with different sets of gear and builds is where the real fun is.
If you get bored from having easy access to something in a game, you kind of have to ask yourself whether you actually enjoy that game at all.
No… I get bored of the same missions…
And that’s just a feeling.
And while I can understand what you say, a game must keep a coherency. So, if they would go for it, it would make the weapon acquisition totally useless.
You know, I like also Starship trooper. This game has generic weapons, and you can select freely them.
However, when I have bought it, it was supposed to be like that.
When I bought Darktide, it was supposed to have a crafting system. I have even complained about this before they release the crafting system.
So, my feeling, if I could do anything without any effort, it would sound like when you use a cheat…
I understand… that’s just how I would feel that. A system without any limitation (locks removal), is… not interesting.
Better to remove everything and just let a simple screen where you choose whatever you want…
I would simply not see what would the purpose to keep the Morningstar.
Actually, getting an excellent weapon is easy… but it needs time and work. If you don’t even need to have to make tries, I can’t see why keeping crafting system.
I stop here… I had stopped to post in this thread 3 days ago.
The player experience would improve significantly IMO if it were all just a simple menu.
They keep the Mourningstar to keep trying to sell cosmetics. It’s a mall designed to inconvenience you as much as possible and expose you to other people that have bought cosmetics.
A system where you keep something that has no importance, here crafting and currency, is the worst you can do.
In fact, you can test everything you want… The only restriction is that it is rare to get a perfect weapon. And also, what do we call perfect?
One of my best weapon is a 369 SMG with pinning fire T4, blaze away T3, unyielding T4 and Maniacs T4. I can change, on it, blaze away and unyielding. Worst modifier is ammunitions at 63% and it has 77% damages, 70% stopping power and 80% collateral (and 80% mobility).
This is a perfect weapon for me.
For now, I have crafted 6 weapons since I started to monitor my craftings. I have got 5 times a blessing T4 when consecrating to orange. Problem is to find a good base weapon…
Crafting would and should replace random drops and would become more important and you need the currency to do all and any of it.
What? Would you rather not have there be any currencies? F*ck it, just give everyone every item when they buy the game? -.-
I say that mockingly but that would legitimately be better than this FOMO, gacha garbage.
This is essentially how it worked in VT2 and VT2 is the more engaging and better game, don’t @ me on that one.
I can test everything freely without restrictions in VT2 but DT has locks so the amount of freedom between the two games cannot be identical. This is just factually incorrect.
Nobody cares to test a mid weapon, that ideal test involves “perfect” gear. Not the first time I’m saying this either.
To the rest about what constitutes a perfect weapon in my or anyone elses eyes: We have been over this an aggrovating amount of times, I will simply not discuss it with anyone (not just you) anymore.
On the subject of what the games ‘suppose to be’ a few radical changes in that aren’t a bad idea in a dying game.
“Okay folks, we see there’s a lot messed up, so we are going to set up 15 different modes, and see which one people like best. Follows is a list of really very different possible setups. Play 10 rounds in every mode and after that, every round you play is a vote for that mode to be the main one or two. …Also we fired the guy who wanted locks. Tell your friends to give us another shot, plus free weekend.”
Seriously Fat Shark, hire me and give me creative control. It might not be the same game when I’m done, but it’ll be fun.
I didn’t play VT2 on launch (joined somewhere between engineer and grail) but as far as I know, the entire crafting and upgrading system was shipped with the game. The only thing that ever changed was that the droprates for reds was increased.
Please someone correct me on this if I am wrong.
So now I have to ask, since I cannot read minds, what’s your point exactly?
What relevance is this supposed to have?
From memory besides red drop rate increasing quite a bit from launch values, red weapon crafting did not exist for a long while, and quite late into the game perk and trait rerolling was biased towards rolling things you hadn’t recently rolled, as opposed to having no mitigation against rolling the same thing you don’t want over and over which was how it shipped. Loot dice dropping on monster kill also wasn’t present at launch, nor was the bonus dice rewarded for killing Lords. Might be other stuff I’m forgetting but yeah cumulatively pretty hugely different experience later in the game’s life than earlier.
Oh and you also couldn’t convert between dust types at launch making people who only played top difficulty have a massive green dust deficiency for quite some time.
Let’s say that the current state is not so bad. You cannot craft perfect weapons, the one at max with blessings and perk you want, at least this is rare (i have one that I consider perfect for me)’, but you can easily craft excellent ones.
It should have been better at release… true…
It can be improved (Brunt/Shops/Emperor’s gift need rework), however, the actual state is far from something unplayable or bad.
The thing is that the current state is VERY BAD. There is a HUUUUUUUGE difference between how badly that Darktide’s system just ^&#$@%^&$#'s players right in the &^(@#$^&*#$ compared to vermintide’s accessible system.
In vermintide, once someone has finally finished leveling their characters and reach the summit of the 300 item power grind, anyone can craft a 300 item power orange in seconds and it will mostly behave like a fully min-maxed red. It’s like the weapon is operating at 90% of potential vs 100%. Swift slaying is preferred for most weapons, but nothing really needs it and only the absolutely slowest weapons really feel the loss of SS. Things like +damage traits only are felt by those who have sat down and crunched the numbers for break point calculations. For a more casual player who doesn’t care about things like break points, the difference between a random orange and sweatist of min-maxed reds probably won’t even be felt. This is the very reason why the Chaos Wastes game mode can even function. We can play a roguelike mode with random gear because the gear is balanced and the degree that our weapons can be upgraded by random traits is relatively small.
Then we come over to the disgusting mess that is shoptide. Enjoy your autopistol that rolled a 20 on its damage stat. As for your blessings, you don’t have pinning fire or blaze away. You’ve got some blessings from the compost bin instead. There is an insultingly unforgivably MASSIVE disparity between the raw performance values of someone who just picks a weapon up off the shelf and just wants to play the game and a lottery winner who has the perfect stat gun with the +bajillion power blessings. Even if you are fully aware of the intricacies of the damage system, there is NOTHING WHATSOEVER that the player can do upgrade their gear to what they know is optimal besides “just be lucky, don’t be unlucky.” Chaos wastes would not function whatsoever in darktide since some games you might be hitting for 200% the damage that you were the previous game since there is just such a hugely toxic amount of variance present between one random weapon and another random weapon.
Darktide’s weapon progression system has been a failure since the earliest days of the beta tests where the player rightfully shamed fatshark about their vague and uninformative old UI and incomplete blessing tooltips (+10% for 2s on kill. Stacks 5 times). It has never been the kind of system that players expect to be in a PAY TO PLAY title, and instead it’s something that looks like it was copied wholesale from an exploitive free to play title that intends to let players open their wallets to directly skip thousands of hours of RNG grind. IIRC data miners even found references implying that fatshark at one point intended to sell premium boosters to help with the grind.
Ok there is quite a bit more than I expected that’s actually different.
Not as substantial a difference as DT locks and no locks would be but deffinitely different.
I don’t know who would be surprised by this. The game is so obviously and heavely “inspired” by other gachas that use said slotmachine experience as the main way to monetize the game.
No wonder DT feels like such a game, it at one point tried to be that game!
