Slayer Ranged Suggestion

I really like playing as slayer, but I see a huge problem with him and I know I am not the only one. As parts of this game are simply designed to use range, I would suggest a “unique” ranged ability for the slayer. Like the pistol for Victor’s rapier, I would include a “side weapon” for the slayer double axes. This would be similary only useful in close to mid range and be executed as kind of war cry which staggers the aimed enemy. This war cry could make less damage as Victors rapier pistol, just to reach nodes and other destroyable things in the environment, but not to kill a single rat with it (Just wouldn’t make sense to kill someone by shouting at him). The main function would be the staggering for something like 2 seconds, to get yourself away from the gun rat / warpfire thrower and other or close to the enemy with the leap, to actually have a chance to go against them from the front.

The benefits would be, that throwable axes would not have to be included, and the slayer would still be melee only, because in actual ranged combat, the ability would be useless in terms of damage. The main benefit would be, to actually have a chance in floors or small rooms, to escape the ranged specials or kill them, when you have to face them directly.

Slayer is in a really good spot right now i dont think everyone should be able to do everything (looking at you beamstaff…). He is an extremely good horde/elite shredder and besides that you should never be in the situation to face specials alone you should always stick with your team and let them deal with it.

You are their wall of defense and they are your mosquito hunters.

9 Likes

Agree with @DAF, I think slayer is okay. Yes he’s at a disadvantage for ranged, but he’s at a huge advantage in melee. And his leap works to close ground with far away things in a pinch.

If Bardin is throwing anything at the enemy rats, it would be empty beer bottles.

2 Likes

Now this is a ranged weapon I fully support!

2 Likes

Think about this situation, all members of your party are wiped in Festering Grounds, only you as slayer are left. Now didn’t your party destroy all nodes, something you have to do now, because your teammates are behind the planks waiting to be revived. This is now a situation you simply can’t handle, while every other char could shoot them or go back to the ammunition crate to pick up ammo if they wouldn’t have any left. All maps are designed to be doable alone if necessary. The ammunition crate is not there to fight of enemies, it’s there to destroy the nodes. If I remember correctly, your mates spawn in the node area (could be wrong), but just think about that every char would have to be able to access everything in maps on their own, including tomes and grims.

Now imagine this, you are stuck in a tight spot, lets say a corridor with only two ways, forward or back. Your party is not far away, but busy with fighting off their own specials. In front of you spawned a warpfire thrower or a gunner and behind you a hook rat. Without a bomb there is no way to escape this situation on your own, as you can’t dodge the hook rat in this tight spot.

What I’m saying is, there are situations in this game every character can handle on their very basic level completely alone. This is the standard which is set by the developer. The slayer can’t reach up to this standard as he is. I completely agree, that he is good in melee and should not have a ranged option against enemies as all the other chars. I don’t want him to be able to clear enemies in ranged, but there are situations every character needs to be able to handle.

Which implementation is finally chosen is irrelevant, be it war cry, throwing beer cups or stones or just flip the enemy off. I would only suggest a way to destroy environment objects from range and to be able to kill gunners and warpfire throwers from the front when you need to.

1 Like

This makes me wonder if those nurgle nodes are reachable by slayer leap or not, I’m going to have to play this and test

I think when you jump you reach the height of one man sized enemy, so they are not accessible. The one located in the ceiling and the last one from the scaffold are not even close to accessible I think.
Skittergate and Halescourge 2nd grims are also not accessible.

They are all reachable with the 2h hammer. I can attest to that. Other than that I have no clue.

Use leap.

AFAIK most nodes are reachable with leap. Haven’t tried leaping to all so can’t say for sure, but the highest ones I’ve been able to reach.

He really is. Maybe the only one who is to be honest. I think FS still has a bit to go with ranged.

Even the one from Halescourge? I didn’t test it, but its pretty high up.

The leap gets interrupted by the warpfire, I think the range of the staggering, when you come down doesn’t match the warpfire thrower range. Even if it does, imagine a gunner instead with much higher range.

Throw one aye like boomerang

haha! the funny thing is, this is a slayer thread.

let’s pit 4 chaos warriors, one after the other, vs sienna and bardin. guess who’ll be doing all the killing?

first CW probably gets removed by sienna’s ult which everyone loves to hate. oh no, here comes another CW. and another, and another.

if only we had a class that could do rapid consistent high damage to a heavily armored target in a very short time!

Slayer has a ranged weapon: himself :smiley:

Honestly, Slayer is in a really good spot atm. Some of his talents might get tweaking (you can give staunty savior 200% speed bonus, it is just too situational to compete with any of the other two talents to be even REMOTELY a viable choice :wink: ), but he is an absolute beast at killing elites and mowing through hordes.

His ability to be really successful in melee was never questioned by me. As I said, I like him. What I was suggesting was a way to handle standard situations, which from my perspective he cannot handle right now, such as frontal killing warpfire throwers or ratling gunners in close hallways, etc.

Slayer’s kit is good already, what he needs is:

  • give immunity frames on leap
  • make 25% HP increase work when non-hosting
  • change stunty saviour to something else, it’s a completely useless talent currently
  • give him an innate bonus vs monsters/bosses - that’s what Slayers are for! Slayers have only 1 passive, IB have 3!

I could also agree with the immunity while he is using leap, when he is then also not staggerable and the leap uninterruptable, this would resolve the issue of being pushed away from gunners and warpfire throwers.

Let’s talk about Slayer in Legend. I have a lot of hours with Slayer in Legend. Almost 100 apparently given that I started running Legend both with friends and solo almost as soon as I hit 30 and I’ve played this game for 160 hours. I’m decked out in reds. I’ve tried every build you’ve probably thought of and more, so I have a basis for these critiques. We’ll start with the obvious one.

Ranged:
Ranged still is king and dances all over your ability to do your job. You’ve got your horde clear (something that can be handled by an IB) and boss kill (something that can also be handled by IB) leaving your only real boon in your elite killing potential. Something that is only valid for Chaos Chosen. as everything else can be killed easily by every other career including IB and RV. A Pyro with beamstaff can defend an entire horde, can protect herself if things get too close (still with the beamstaff), can kill specials, interrupt rats, and rescue allies. A slayer can kill a horde and kill some elites. You’re certainly not the big damage dealing boss killer of your group as you have to deal with a bosses anti-melee moveset.

Boss:
The amount of bosses that aren’t the troll in this game with hardcore anti-melee attack patterns or pushback is staggering. Rat Ogre pushes you away when he’s pounding off of allies, storm fiend climbs into the stratosphere constantly. You can’t even land two charge attacks on the chaos spawn before he decided he wants to target you, allowing you one charged attack ever so often as you quite literally can’t attack otherwise. Just block and backstep as it smashes towards you. Attack twice when it tries to grab you, and repeat if you can force it into a grab, bash, grab loop. No part of this is engaging and it takes forever. Classes with ranged capabilities can shred this. In reference to other builds. A single shade with a concentration potion can kill these situations in seconds. RV can gruderaker in the general direction and put an end to the threat. Unchained still has access to an extremely powerful damaging option. Foot Knight and Mercenary can stagger. Slayer meanwhile has to dance all over the problem because his special without the talent no escape actually kind of sucks.

Damage:
Ranged does equivalent damage to a charged attack with 3 stacks. This is obscene. About the only thing you have is the ability to kill Chaos Chosen, a non issue in Legend games with actual good players. With 3 stacks and 10% to Chaos the 2H hammer should at least have the decency to be able to one shot something during a horde. I’m not going to undersell this though. Armor pen is really good, it’s in high value for two bosses (that being warcamp and Into the nest) and the ability to delete stormvermin and chaos chosen is great.However existing for no other reason than to keep things off of your ranged and 5 shot the occasional Chaos Chosen is not fun.

Stagger:
Why oh why do charge axe attacks not stagger. Anyways things like berserkers and plague monks should maintain their ability to be threatening. That’s why they exist. What is not cool is that your second weapon slot has to be a 2H weapon in order to deal with a swarm of them without spending large amounts of time (that you may not always have) back stepping. What is worse is that 2H attacks don’t just guarantee a stagger. And you have to hold this as a slayer. Nobody else is stuck to such a binary way of dealing with something like this. As RV you can go invisible and club them to death or simply grudge-raker the problem away. Can grudge-raker hordes away too. Hell if you’re really good you can grudge raker elites away as well. Anyways, I’m fine with having to depend on my allies for specials, but this is too much

Leap:
This ability as it it needs some major attention. Skipping into a horde. Being launched into an air. Having the AI of enemies attack with their fastest attacks if you try to jump over or into them. Being completely useless against gatling and gas rats, and not doing it’s knockback until you land. The stagger is good, yes. But this ability is nothing more than an attack speed steroid. You certainly aren’t using it to make up for the difference in not having a ranged weapon as I think was originally intended.

Talents:
In order;
Stunty Saviour sucks
See it Coming still isn’t significant enough to even consider
Crippling Wounds needs to be stronger
Unstoppable still has to compete against Moving Target (ability to have grey health actually matter) and Adrenaline Surge (ability to keep your AS steroid on) and thus still sucks
Crunch is too situational to use and exists only to knock a slave rat behind you, who will then stab you when he gets up. This ability either need to be something completely different or they need to change it so that your attacks do increased stagger for the duration of your AS steroid.
Unstoppable is only good in one single talent build (but it’s very good in said build)
No escape is the only one size fits all option because it allows you to actually melee a boss.

Slayers a blast in Champion. Can just turn your brain off and have a good time once you get used to the playstyle. But it sure could use some love for Legend to brink it up there with your other two allies. Especially when considering the increased number of specials that you won’t be able to deal with. Because I’m not sure they’re actually compensating enough for your inability to do ranged damage.

Solutions?
One of these abilities needs to be tweaked to give more boss killing potential
Leap needs to be fixed and debugged
Useless talents need to be purged
Needs a passive that either reduces damage, increase stagger, increase block strength, or increases cleave.

2 Likes

Or dead enemy rats.

1 Like
Why not join the Fatshark Discord https://discord.gg/K6gyMpu