Really doesnt matter what the end game content is as long as it’s there, which isn’t the case atm.
In my world it’s like making a car without an engine but here is some paint you can use on it to make it look good while not driving it.
It can’t be that hard and it isn’t that hard. It might be hard to code it which I know diddly-squat about.
Red items could fx be salvaged into a separate material that could be used to buy whatever from a shop.
Fx 1 red items gives 1 moonstone, it takes 50 moonstones to make x item. Items could be hats with traits or you know. what ever just anythiiiing. END GAME CONTENT PLS.
I remember playing a korean game online ages ago and there were this one guy who had been able to gather all the needed materials for an armor which nobody else had ever been able to create. There were tons of these items just waiting for players to gather enough materials to begin crafting but since it took so long nobody really ever got there before that guy. This was the carrot and it made people whom had reached the end to have something to strive for, a reason for coming back. And that is what people did. They came back again again and again and kept playing. Eventually every hardcore player ended up with the items they wanted to craft but then the devs just implemented more items, horses etc which took even more time to create. everybody was happy. The players where happy thus making the devs happy. win win.
VT2 Community is unhappy or neutral at best when it comes to end game content, but where the other dev studio kept listening and earning income from their happy players, fatshark doesnt seem to listen very much.
Don’t get me wrong the new DLC stuff is cool, but it’s my understanding it’s all cosmetics. I want new gear for different builds. More importantly I want to be able to get the gear I want to make the builds I want. I don’t want reds for the skin I want them for the perfect rolls.
Granted my voice isn’t the only one, and I know. Others player for different reasons. And to each their own. But that’s what I’m hoping they fix.
I understand what your saying, but for me at least I had 2-3 exotics of every weapon I liked to use before I was done leveling all 5 chars. And it was painfully hard to get a single set of reds for my main that fit my play style. I got really lucky and got a red spear as my 3rd elf weapon and that helped a lot since it fit my play style for any of the elf’s careers.
What’s kinda funny is the morning after I made this post I got a set of red daggers. Sword and dagger and single sword still elude me however. Maybe one day Renold you stingy god maybe one day.
These are good points for sure, the only thing I would add is bringing back imbuneing weapons. It sucks when you get the props you want with both at like 75-80% max roll then ( for me at least ) I’m done messing with it as the odds are so crappy I’m going to get better rolls.
But yes I don’t think I ever crafted a charm, trinket, or necklace, and right now I’m sitting on some 4000 scrap …
I like where your going with the temp buffs idea, not sure It’s what they should do. But it’s a good place to start.
While I wouldn’t say Fatshark is quick about patches I wouldn’t say they don’t listen to their player base. Having played both VT1 and VT2 since release both games have evolved and the changes and polish they add raise the Qualify of Life of the game.
I have high hopes some of the few remaining shortcomings of VT2 will addressed. So far I have been happy with all the additions. For me right now I feel like I’m going to have to invest 20-25 hours for each small step of progression I make.
If FS introduces a Korean MMO style grindfest, people will get angry. Or that’s what I would normally think, but people complained about the 100 runs / career taking forever and we have players actively strive for it. So I guess introducing long term goals, no matter how grindy, might be a better option then just RNG-ing for lucky reds.
However, however, however… this will only entice the hardcore players, which is good, because they tend to form the core of the community. But you’d also need short and mid-term goals as well, to make progression feel more fluid. For example, a hat+skin combo that you can upgrade, with ever increasing material costs? People love that kinda stuff, they can see their progress and more or less predict when they will be able to upgrade again.
Implementing this would also be the easiest if FS would take the basic skins and make those upgradeable. Assets are available, although they already look finished, so designing the upgrades might not be that easy, but hey! We all need challenges.
Personally, I would combine this with the temporary buff system, so people would have to decide if they want to invest in long term goals OR if they wish to have a temporary buff for their game in the evening.
I can see something like this working, but of course it’s up to Fatshark to consider these ideas.
And remember kids, you gotta like the posts with the ideas that you find appealing for FS to notice them!
Then again, not everyone (myself included) considers grinding for equipment fun, or even real content. If it is the developers’ will to use hard-to-obtain stuff top retain players, they can do it, of course. But it can be done through things requiring skill (like the Legend Map Challenges), rather than long grind (like the Deed Challenges, if you start actually aiming for them).
At the moment, the hard-to-get items are hidden behind RNG. That’s not optimal, I think. But adding grind on top that isn’t going to solve the problem of “too little content”, only allowing you to get the last of those items faster, and thus removing even hunting those last ones from the “content”. If loot is what you’re in for, it would hold you in for those 50 more reds, but no longer than that.
I know different people play differently. I would continue to play even if I got every red weapon with perfect stats. Why? Because I really enjoy the gameplay loop.
So your comment got me thinking. Mockingly I thought “Just turn all your reds to dust and you will have reason to play again”. I didn’t post that, because I know that’s not really what you would want.
But it got me to the next thought: In some games it’s possible to “ascend”. Basically you start over from level 1, but you get to keep your gear and you get unique rewards. Could be any kind of cosmetic really.
Or maybe you get to choose one weapon which ascends with you and gets a unique trait/property, but you lose the rest? Seems really harsh considering how long it takes to get all reds.
I think something like this could extend the lifetime for those who need a carrot beyond just the gameplay loop.
I’m with you. I love the gameplay – which is why I’ve stuck around.
But I’m not terribly motivated by cosmetic rewards. Loot is a good way to build progression at endgame, but it’s more satisfying IMO if it impacts gameplay in a meaningful way. Simply doing a prestige or ascended run back up the levels would probably just be frustrating to me – especially if it only rewarded a cosmetic.
My view is unpopular among the purists, but I’d really prefer to see a higher loot tier with unique property combinations, properties, trait combinations, traits. Literally anything that makes me excited or at least curious to see the item drop. Right now, reds are just another skin.
I agree whole heartedly. It is extremely disappointing to reach the end of a run with no incentive because the loot boxes are wholly unfulfilling based on the efforts required. I love this game, but the end game needs to offer a better variety of high tier items. The current RNG system does not work to accomplish this. I can enjoy the game for the sake of enjoying the game for only so long but boredom is starting to set in.
I don’t care if the pay off is more skins, or weapon reskins - I just would love to see more variety available and reworked to give me something to game for.
Fatshark, you are going to start losing your player base because the endgame mechanics currently don’t deliver. Rethink how loot is provided by the dice roll system and add some variety or you will end up with a very dead game. Speaking of behalf of all players, I can tell you that a game like this NEEDS customization options, and a MUCH LARGER variety of customization options. Please listen to the players, I would love for more incentive to play this game and want to feel rewarded for my efforts. I am tired of seeing everyone look almost exactly the same, I want to dress my toon up differently from the masses, and I am not alone! Even some humorous hats, masks, I don’t know what else you can come up with… but your players want more variety. PLEASE give us variety. PLEASE. Even if its some DLC to pay for entire new costumes or hats I will gladly pay for
I agree, we aren’t ever going to have a real solid answer on the % of players that play more for the core game play vs players that play for the core game play combinded with char progression. I just tried to make a post based on the feed back from the pugs I talk to and what my friends tell me and what I feel.
But I mean from a dev stand point what are you supposed to do when you make a suggestion forum ? I mean you are saying the people willing to speak up and ask for something are all asking for the same basic thing as far is end game content and loot. And are agreeing it needs to be expanded, it seems silly to just ignore them when a overall theme is very clear.
I really like the loot system. But I hope FS doesn’t use such thing in Vermintide 3. People can’t seem to come to terms with it. You NEVER play this game for loot, it’s just nice to have. It’s intended to be challenging and that every run is different.
I mean VT2s progression to me seems way better than the first. To me the core problem isn’t a lack of stuff do in th3 end game. It’s that getting the stuff I want as far as loot goes is totally random and in many ways unattainable. Rewards that are not fun to try and earn or totally random as far as acquisition isn’t a good reward system.
Wasnt repliyng to you drclassey. Not sure why it comes off as such… Nothing is worthwhile doing if there is nothing to gain from it. The act itself of whatvever activity you can come up with is not interesting unless there is something to gain from doing it.
Nobody works for free. Those that do still gain something on a personal level, otherwise they wouldnt be doing it.
Nobody works out if there where no benifits of doing so.
Nobody would go to school if there where no benifit to gain from it.
Etc etc. Everybody plays vt2 and gains nothing and the dwindling number active players are proof of their discontent. Those few that stay the duration do so bcs they truly get enough out of the game as is or bcs they see potential for a great game and hope the devs at some point stops thinking that they know what the player base wants better than the player base itself, whom has been asking for any end game content since beta.
But why would they fix it. They hsve no reason to. They already sold over a million copies so who cares. Game is missing a critical piece that no game can survive without but unluckily people didnt realize this before it was too late and the game had went viral.
The gaming cumunity is one filled with idiots and by that a mean that companies like ea wouldnt still exits if it werent. With all the stunts they have pulled over the years it never ceases to amaze me thst people continue to buy and endorse their games and thus keeping them in bussiness while sending a clear signal to both them and the industry that its ok to fock us over.
If farshark wants to be a respected brand in the industry they need to listen hard to their costumers kust like every other respected company in the industry.
Sorry about the gramar etc. My phine keeps changing typed words to hungarian and im not from hungary, so wtf phone - why you doing this you piece of shet tech.
I think a lot of us don’t share you feeling that getting better is the main drive. And I think the point with school he was trying to make was lost in translation.
Correct me if I’m wrong but I think he was trying to say. What’s the point of going to school if I’m not going to learn anything.
For myself the game play is fun, but isn’t very rewarding. Once you know you can run any char with any Career in the hardest difficulty theirs not a whole lot left as far as the core game play challenging me or the core game being wholly satisfying by it self. Having a whole bunch of other end game content seems lik3 a great way to make everyone happy. If the loot doesn’t drive you to play, no big deal nothings been taken away from you if it’s simply the core game play that does it for you. And the rest of us that have kinda gotten all we can put of the core game still have something that keeps us coming back too. In the end all it helps do is retain players so the game lasts longer for more people. And allows Fatshark to release more DLC ( paid ) that keeps some revenue coming in.
Side note I love the DLC business model, I feel like in both games the found a great balance of cost of paid DLC for the content with out fractioning the community.
And as you state, the reward of getting better is not a fulfilling reward. Sure it’s nice but so it getting back rub but at least that fulfills something, namely getting rid of the itch.
Getting better is so arbitrary and useless a reward in a pve game that it’s ridicolous.
I’ve been using natural bond since I first got the trinket and I can go through just about every run on legend while taking close to no damage at all or below 150 on avg when not playing 100%
There is nothing left for me to try out or come back to. Some people argue that it’s up to the players themselves to find new ways of challenging them like going true solo or making less than optimal builds. But why the hell what I want to do that ? the entire carrot from the start is to get the best gear and make the best build possible. It’s the only thing in the game. There isnt even a story. So it makes no sense to begin nerfing builds or going true solo. Might as well go ahead and break your fingers then. That’s going to present a real challenge right there or even better yet. Get someone to stab you while playing - real challenge again. The only reason why true solo exits is bcs someone reached the end of the line and thought now what. But that’s not supposed to happen. FS should have accounted for that by adding end game content.
Sorry for the rant but I truly find the lack of end game content to be a deal breaker. If I could I would have gotten my money back from steam but I couldn’t cause it took many hours to reach lvl 30 and figure out that they neglected to care for players that reach lvl 30.
I’m gonna disagree with you a little bit here, their is a bigger story if you go talk to the witch between missions and you talk to the old inn keeper you get back story after each mission, run them in order and you will get more complete picture. Also theirs a larger story going on this game takes place in the “End times” for us Gamesworkshop old heads we have a little more back story about what’s going on. The short of it is this is the transition from Warhammer Fantasy Balttle to Warhammer Age of sigmar.
I do agree that it shouldn’t just be up to player to make their own fun this isn’t a sandbox game. But at the same time it has to be recognized that every player might be playing the game for different reasons. I want to find a solution that gives the greatest amount of players something more to play for with out ruining the game for others.
