Pyromancer Rework

This is up for debate. But for people who really enjoy the challenge of lacking range (and I know a fair share) 4 is the correct number. With less than that a true melee run is impossible.

The same can be said for ranged careers. Party composition takes a fine balance. Hunstman, Bounty Hunter, Pyromancer and Waystalker for example don’t make for a good team. In my experience a more tanky, melee focus party has better chances, even if the run takes longer.
That’s not to say that full melee is the ideal team composition (it takes all kinds), but I definitely wouldn’t say melee teams are more problematic.
If anything, being unable to snipe a special taught me to think on my feet, to use terrain to our advantage, to coordinate better with my teammates: all of which have been the most valuable lessons vermintide has taught me, and it’s why I occasionally enjoy melee rounds so much.

To clarify: I don’t expect a Sienna to be completely without ranged assets, but I hope we’ll get something different than her regular staves, expecially because it’s supposed to be a knight of myridia. It’s hard to imagine a knight of a goddess of war using the regular staves. What I’m hoping for is a focus on melee, with 2 melee slots (maybe a shield weapon option) and an ultimate able to deal with things, either a destructive close range one (like GK, but flame based) or a movement one (BW, slayer) to close in with threats, or even a ranged one (like engineer. She shouldn’t need a staff to summon fire, right? or the staff itself could be the ultimate).
I think an original approach is needed for this, both to fit the knight theme (assuming that’s what we get) and to differenciate from her other existing careers.

So you don’t want to play with staves but you’re ok with running sword + dagger or something? Wiz melee weapons are terrible. I’m just gonna have to pass on all that.

That’s part of the reason I’m hoping to get a melee career actually, 'cause it would most likely get a melee arsenal, like WP did. Shield and flail, for example, and others.
Of her regular arsenal I think flaming flail would fit myrmidia, flame sword too, possibly more.

Has there been any confirmation from devs that this is actually the case? Honestly asking because I had no idea.

Switching their ults would be awesome. Thematically it makes sense as well. Providing an aggressive movetech playstyle for pryo to get in and out of combat quickly. While also indirectly nerfing BW so she doesn’t have a ‘get out of jail free card’, meaning that positioning becomes a lot more important; as it should, for a primarily ranged dps character.

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There hasn’t, really. But I think it’s the most likely as Lohner’s posts have referenced that.
Wether they translate to actual gameplay is another matter. I hope so, especially as there’s a lot of interesting stuff there: Bardin’s daughter’s subplot, Sienna’s necromancer (probably undead) twin, and something to do with Be’lakor in the chaos wastes.

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Most of what made Pyro broken were the various crit interactions talents and traits used to have, which were changed because of pyro’s interaction with them. Doesn’t help that crits aren’t even that powerful with Sienna’s abundance of low finesse weapons. Outside of chaos wastes which is a bad argument in itself (only shining late game when certain conditions are met) she’s in a bad spot.

The lack of stagger THP on her is my least favorite though, the other Sienna’s throw out 2 dagger/flamesword heavies for a near full THP bar and unlimited magic all game on top of having venting passives/talents. Doesn’t help that one of her best talents requires high HP to function and her main passive requires staying at high heat.

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If they do limit staves, I think they should bite the bullet and limit Coru too. Would be borderline P2W if you could buy your way out of career design rules like that.

(Sort of like the Slayer being melee only unless you buy a ranged attack from a DLC, come to think of it. Throwing Axes really should be Ranger/IB/Engi.)

If they stopped Pyro using Coru I’d be extremely displeased TBH. She has the best meaningful synergy with it (primary fire) and BW sure doesn’t need it. The alt fire really needs to be toned down regardless.

Honestly though I’m not sold at all that limiting staves achieves anything much other than cutting down build diversity further. Most problematic interactions either come straight from BW’s kit or are inherent to the staff itself (eg Coru). No reason to throw the baby out with the bathwater there when some targeted adjustments could fix those issues better.

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It’s a heavy-handed solution, sure. But it would be a quick and easy fix that doesn’t require complex rebalancing. The AoE career gets the AoE staves, the single-target career gets the single-target staves, the melee career gets the close-range staff, and everyone gets fireball. Sienna having access to all of her weapons on all of her careers is an anomaly to begin with.

That said, I wouldn’t mind a more through overhaul instead. Maybe nerf the base damage of all staves, and then have the careers buff the staves they’re supposed to specialize in.

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Crits are probably too good on shotguns in general, and having shotguns for the 2 ranged crit careers should have been an eyebrow raiser (or it would have for the devs who made the 2018 game, if they’re still there). But man the build limits already kneecap the fun potential in the game so hard, what an inelegant solution.

All the best pyromancer players I’ve seen in twitch mode, and ones with that Fortunes of War cata frame seem to play 60/40 melee/ranged at high overcharge; typically using bolt staff + standard sword. Players that main as pyro are uncommon, but I believe people vastly underestimate her potential.

On high overcharge I believe the crit chance is about 65%. That means your light attacks will pierce armor 65% of the time. Combine that with high attack speed and pyro can clear crowds pretty quick. You can get the talent where crits w/ ult refund ult and often chain that ult 3 or more times at high overcharge.

In the hands of a skilled player, a glass cannon is just a cannon, but pyro is overshadowed by the elf classes. Any elf class with javelins + sword and dagger can be set up to fulfill the glass cannon role and survive better while providing greater benefits to the team like amaranthe, stamina aura, healing or stealth revives.

Pyromancer definitely needs a rework.

Batttle wiz is mainly flame dot or ranged spam, unchained is mainly melee and tank. I think pyromancer should be more ranged than melee. She is, after all, a pyromancer, not a swordsman. Give her another career bonus that helps sustain ranged attacks. Maybe upon reaching high overcharge she gets 5 seconds of no overcharge or perhaps kills and headshots refund some overcharge. Rework some useless talents to provide better ranged damage.

A couple small corrections.

55%

5% base + 10% properties + 30% passive + 10% Spirit Casting.

Pseudo-random crit being what it is, it’s just under a 1/3rd chance to crit on that first Burning Head. So getting more than 2 casts in a row is fairly uncommon.

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Thank you yes, and with 40% crits power and the 55% crits chance, I’ve had the warrior priest grant 25% more crit power and damn the regular sword can clear elites on Legend in a few light strikes. The temp health gain is good too.