Pickpocket on hivescum needs to be nerfed ASAP

Warhammer 40,000: Darktide Gameplay Feedback
1

Ok so hivescum has a few problems:

1:Insane dodge range and DPS in meele with shivs and with the right talents can be the best DPS
2: The whole ranged combo/rocket launcher/meele can create a character which can do all roles which is boring to play with.

3: Needle pistol is broken. A few shots and it kills crushers… Breaks balance
4: biggest problem? PICKPOCKET

So every elite/special kill, get a bit of ammo back under a certain % of max ammo.
Thats EVERY kill. It means you can spam uzis/autogun full auto without any need for skill or worry and makes the game pretty boring to play with/use.
It might not be so agregious on havoc 40, but in aluric its beyond broken.
Games just become hivescum wracking up the kills, being faster then everyone, and OFC not taking any ranged damage, being able to deal with hordes of Metal with a rocket launcher, and the rest with autogun/uzi, and being able to regian ammo back withcooldown? it renders the otherclasses pretty much in the dust.

All that needs to be done to fix this busted fullauto inbalance is to add a cooldown to pickpocket.
They did it to vetern as he was a good example of it early on as well. Just add a cooldown of 20-30 seconds. It means you can get ure ammo back, but you cant just constantly spray and ruin the game for the other 3 people in the lobby. Its meant to be a team game, but if the dodge is on point, you can just fullauto the entire game and kill everything without having to even worry about ammo. its broken.

Hoping that a fatshark dev picks this up as its a simple change that would bring back some resembalance of balance back to the game, as currently with pickpocket its well beyond busted and ruins entire lobbys with main player syndrome in effect.

5 Likes
2

Cooldown is a fine approach but also a little boring to be honest. Would be most fun if the requirement was killing an elite/special with a melee attack and only worked at 0 ammo. That way it would actually feel like you’re scavenging and be rewarding hybrid gameplay

Goes without saying that the current state of pickpocket is incredibly unfun unless the hive scum player is so bad he can’t leverage it, in which case it’s probably also unfun because you’re stuck with a guy who does 0 damage and dies in one hit

7 Likes
3

I’m not sure what the deal is, to be honest.

My veteran also has the option of rolling out with infinite ammo, something no one is talking about anymore.

More than specific demands and buffs, I believe the game NEEDS a true expansion with new locales and new enemy faction/s that are built to lady, so we can have new and exciting things to do for a couple of hundred game hours.

It just feels like all of this buff and nerf comments is so prevalent because people are tired of playing the same maps, Auric Maelstrom, and Havoc versus the same Groaners you’ve hit in the head ad nauseum.

We all know about Inferno Staffs, Arbites bring faceroll class and whatelse.

Fatshark doesn’t want to nerf for some reason that we do not know.

Just release a expansion (can be a paid one) that actually evolves the game and we can talk about balancing.

2 Likes
4

I think the issue is more that you can’t even hit groaners in the head anymore due to pickpocket and how it scales his weapons. No reason for him not to shoot them first

2 Likes
5

I can’t even shoot anything when I play Jado because those two Inferno Staff Psyker’s in my team, snaps their fingers and heretics magically disappear from my screen. :rofl:.

Game expansion is very much needed to breathe fresh air into this game that is stale as old bread currently.

Let Sony buy Fatshark and get some more people on this project :smiling_face_with_horns:

6

No he doesn’t, no build of veteran has infinite ammo that is remotely as easy to achieve as in case of HS. What are you even talking about?

1 Like
7

because that works so well for PBB ogryn right? Oh wait…

8

the problem with scum actually is all the monkey paw stuff cooked in the tree.

Cartel special

75s For max 2 branches is waay too long for an average auric game. Joe casuals will never be able to benefit from that, but then they probably ignore the mechanic altogether, and for high havocs it’s barely better than not taking colored stims at all; so IMO, they should either buff the benefits, specially from the tax nodes, OR, reduce the maximum cooldown to 50s or so.

Auras

All the auras should be reworked entirely, they are too boring and copy-pasted from other classes, not saying they should be buffed or nerfed, just saying they should do something unique like idk, old vet demo-team type aura that replenishes grenades for the team every 60s or something, another aura that interacts with dot damage in some way.

Keystones

The subnodes on Vultures-mark are “ok” but they feel too niche, IMO, Patient Hunter should be reworked into something else, and there should be a subnode for getting marks from other types of enemies, similar to what vet has for exe stance or disrupt destiny on psyker, either that or a subnode that increases mark duration dramatically, and another subnode that allows you to store more marks if they are going to keep the buffs as is. A numbers bump to the buffs wouldn’t be too bad to keep it competitive with chem dep.

Adrenaline frenzy sub-nodes should be scraped and reworked entirely, they are way too niche. The base buff of the keystone is okay, but you should be rewarded more by speccing full into melee by taking this keystone. Frenzy should be easier to trigger, 30 is way too much for low-level stuff, for high havocs is not competitive enough with chem dep buffs, make it more unique buffs that would appeal to melee playstyles, like +toughness replenishment and +TDR/HDR for the “tank side” of the nodes OR you could take damage subnodes that would boost your atk speed and strength, but lock you out of the tank subnodes, all affecting melee attacks ofc.

Other

Rework ability CDR to be able to trigger when ability is active.

Remove pickpocket from the tree and make it base to the class, might as well pull out our masks.

Blackout replenishment should also trigger on a time-basis besides killing basis, takes way too many kills to replenish, it’s not worth taking the grenade pickups if someone else on your team needs them and you should not feel the need to if you are taking these, like zealot nives or ogryn rock, just make me forget about nade pickups if I take this blitz.

9

and thats a problem how?

compared to spampsyker at least melee scum had to put in the footwork and movement to get it done without going down :man_shrugging:

who should be the “best dps” then?

10

I’ve been saying pickpocket (and Needle gun) have been OP since release

2 Likes
11

Works better than pickpocket breaking the game thats for sure. Also total false equivalency, the ogryn node for 10 melee kills = 1 free shot is not remotely comparable to the pickpocket concept where meleeing is required. If Ogryns talent gave him a percentage of ammo rather than just one shot you might actually see it used in a fun way on non-rumbler builds. It’d also be better balance than pickpocket too because it’ll at least be locked to a keystone rather than just being a talent any build can grab.

Explains a lot if you think this is the change to pickpocket that should be made. Or that Hive Scum needs massive buffs like the ones you explained in general.

I believe I pre-empted you here:

You seem a bit like the latter. Maybe Hive Scum SHOULD get an “easy to play” build but just making it even more massively OP isn’t an answer to the problems.

3 Likes
12

You know the Needle pistol can only do 1 single target right? The alternate mode does have an explosion after a kill but it doesn’t do much against Crushers.

Also you don’t need Pickpocket to have unlimited ammo. The Desperado ultimate can give u unlimit ammo in Auric. If they nerf Pickpocket, they also need to nerf this as well.

13

You can also just

Swap modes based on the situation

It takes like 3 shots to guarantee a kill on a crusher in the main mode, then you can swap the mode to deal with everything else

2 Likes
14

My former main is a Veteran who is True Level 1982, but I currently main Hive Scum and the Veteran absolutely have unlimited with my Laspistol MK II build.

Recon Lasgun, Helbore, Infantry Lasgun, and Laspistol were the first weapons in the game, used by the veteran to have unlimited ammo.

I’m not sure whether you played back then, @Torimori, but before ‘Scavenger’ was nerfed, you could use a Recon Lasgun and shoot at absolutely everything in an Auric Maelstrom: No Ammo Pickups/Mostly melee enemies, without ever running out of ammunition.

For the most part, you can still do that: I don’t even have Scavenger on my Veteran and I still never run out.

1 Like
15

Shock trooper + survivalist

Recon or laspistol or helbore or ilas can all go basically the entire mission without picking up ammo

Its funny going into h40 with mmf exe helbore and having an insane amount of ranged damage with 0 ammo taken

3 Likes
16

I do agree that it needs some kind of balancing/nerf.

Like you said, when played to their max potential, scum, especially ranged ones, can kind of make the game a little boring for other people.

1 Like
17

I don’t think Infantry Lasguns are worth mentioning in this case specifically due to their fundamental lack of cohesion/synergy with the current Enemy Density and Gameplay flow.

Both Veteran and Hive Scum need nerfs, and don’t even get me started on Psyker.

18

Damn so I have to hit the special attack button once and my “literally infinite ammo flamer but better” weapon swaps to “literally threeshots crushers” and I can swap it back at will? That’s crazy guess I’ll never press it so it can only do single target

Desperado has downtime, pickpocket does not

5 Likes
19

biggest problem… needle pistol and toxin

Veteran has infinite ammo for a long time… and this is not the problem. Scums have less tbh.
Sure a vet can run out of ammo… if he misses all the time
Do we speak about psyker? * cough * purgatus * cough *

I repeat… having ammo is not the problem… damages dealt may be the problem.

And even needle pistol… I would say that if you meet a skilled player, you kill close to nothing.

But anyways… you loose time. Fatshark never nerf. They buff…
And if they nerf that… seriously. I would not understand how they can let psyker purgatus untouched, buff scums blitzes (unneeded and even it should be reverted), buff rampage (seriously unneded and same as blitzes), and then nerf this talent…
This would be unbearable for me… just cause psykers would have never been nerfed…
Close to all my scoreboards, when I meet a talented psyker, not even a great player, just talented, the psyker deals top damages.
And if the guy is skilled… the mission becomes immediately a walking game.
And read that… even for psyker purgatus, I don’t think it is purgatus the main problem. But as I always say, I don’t play enough psyker to voice an opinion.

But here, on scums, this gameplay is excellent. And there is no problem with it as 2 others classes have similar abilities. One is linked to the class, psykers… the other, veteran, you can get infinite ammos for lasers.

1 Like
20

No they don’t. That makes me question your claim of being so very established vet player.

For vet to be able to have infinite ammo you would need to crit all the time with las weapons what simply won’t gonna happen. There won’t be even those hypothetical numbers of 50% or so crit you (theoretically) can achieve on vet, no, you’ll never achieve even those in real match, unless you will sacrifice a lot in the process (like spreading points all the way to the Weapon Specialists keystone, while also going rather deep to the left lower corner, and taking crit-related perks and blesses which will be suboptimal to damage output on your typical las weapon) and/or will be showing a top notch play all the time (like consistently hitting heads and/or juggling melee/range weapons all the time). We actually could start with the fact that you need to hit something with your critical hit, if you miss that talent isn’t even activated; and one of those weapons is rapid-firing rifle, so you’ll be missing a lot with it.

Moreover , you’ll be forever locked into a particular family of weapons half of which are garbage tier. Good luck if you don’t like those weapons, or are already sick of them.

While HS just needs to kill an elite or specialist once in a while, what is as easy as pressing a button in this game, where at any given moment there will be 10-15 of those around you on higher difficulties. And can use any range weapon they want for that, and just almost never going into melee to boot, if they wish so.

So no, there is no such thing as “unlimited ammo” on vet. And even those options that could be compared to what HS does are just crap, and HS does the same things with them 10 times better.