“You don’t need toughness gating!”
-John Cadia (Circa 2024, master of Voice of Command spam and master of the dueling sword for his last three hundred hours of gameplay)
Okay, I need to stop on the bitter joke bent, it’s just genuinely crazy to me how people can not see how removing core mechanics the game is designed around is a bad idea.
Honestly, this. The higher you get the more you realize that bubble, chorus/shout is the way to go. No wonder jsat was running trauma and bubble. It’s basically a pause button for gunner engagements. The only truly dangerous thing about the entire mode.
I mean… I’m not saying I disagree but, what options are there? Serious question:
I mean… right now they’re trying to balance it by dipping into all of the above equally. But if you remove one, that means doubling down on something else to keep the same overall balance.
And sure, lofty ideals like “just give them better AI” (as people always say when this topic comes up) are all fine and good, but stuff like that takes a ton of time & money to do. There’s a reason few games ever do it that way, at least successfully.
I’m not saying this to defend the way it’s done. Just pointing out that realistically, there really aren’t that many options as long as we want to keep it difficult - which is the whole point.
Entire mode exists because there is a couple of braindead strong talents and weapons which trivialize content.
Next step?
Balance the underperformign weapons up by:
FINALLY realizing ‘balacing’ around special activation is a$$ and that THunderHammer SHOULD ALWAYS BE BETTER than a DUELING SWORD at killing crushers
Nah lets spend months adding a new mechanics and a mode that promotes HARD MINMAXING even more, cuz f-ck the community that doesnt speedrun maps 
This is excelent for the game longevity! A super unfun gunnerspam mode in a 4/10 shooter that is locked for newcomers
I don’t mind shooter being able to shoot faster but combine with grace period removal it started to lean more into opressive territory tbh.
Pre-nerf shoot was the sweet spot imo.
Also light out and Pox gas(Tox bomber) modifier is just annoying.
Bring down player power level because we’re just at the point of massive power creep. The game is increasingly becoming a DPS race between players and enemies. See: Gunner changes.
And/or reduce supplies like medicae and/or require powering them on higher difficulties. There’s very little threat from attrition, deaths are generally due to massive spam. (When it’s not due to someone doing something dumb)
The ammo vet is back bb.
Get shields.
I remember warning people about powercreep with breaking the locks… but here we are.
I think you’re suffering from diminishing returns. I’d suggest swapping out two curios.
Me, the psyker with 83 toughness, enjoying it.
Is the game really designed around toughness gating? Or are you just too used to it?
This guy gets it.
I remember when the locks were broken and people were already complaining of a lack of content, citing the penance as a “joke” of content.
When has this game been anything but a DPS race? If you’re dodging and weaving, you’re minimizing the DPS of the enemy while keeping yours high. If you’re tripping your opponent in a race, it’s still a race. What you’re having to do now is sprint.
I warned people about Meta with the removal of locks with endgame content. Now the meta is here for endgame content. Ah well. Since now everyone has virtually the same level of access to the same tools, meta is readily defined for every stat and talent choice. In Armored Core 6, people complain about meta in the S rank Leaderboard. Few people in S rank are non-meta and those are the chads that people respect. No one looks down on you for using meta. But Sub-S players gripe about the meta in S and never make it to top 100.
The point is, if you want to do the hardest thing in a game, use the Most Effective Tactic Available. You’re welcome to do your own builds, but prepare for them to be harder.
The lack of a toughness gate had me rethink my builds and strategies on my feet. I use Flamestick, Bubble, Greatsword, Brainburst and Bubbleshield. Save for the greatsword, it’s META. I use a health, toughness, and wound curio. IDK if that’s meta or my talent spread for that matter. But I figured it out on my own without looking up youtube videos for how to get where I am, and I had a blast figuring out the puzzle to start winning.
So, I’ll offer the same suggestion I had last time when we had locks… Use grey weapons? Lower your blessings and/or perks? Make the challenge yourself. That’s the stuff youtube content is made of.
i’m at h39, going to finish 40 soon now
i think difficulty is good, makes you play as a team for real, just like in VT2.
should be in base game too, this amount of pressure.
not ironically makes ds kinda feel ok in havoc lol and not that much op, but obviously still good and op regardless.
That’s the exact thing I was afraid of, they’re just enforcing meta even harder and doing nothing about the overall balance by relying on havoc modifiers. It’s just kicking the can down the road.
The powercreep has absolutely nothing to do with the locks. If going from locks to no locks made your power go from 9 to 10, then adding the absolutely stupid busted talents in the game together makes you go from 10 to 71. You could literally clear havoc 40 with grey weapons, it’s not even a factor.
I didn’t need it, what I’m saying is, because people can effectively pick what they want to reach the optimal build every time, rather than being optimal with what they have.
I see power-creep not as a enemy-only dynamic, but inclusive of players as well. Players get stronger through improving the means by which to arm themselves, and thus, the encounters that they get into are easier.
And you mean to tell me now that everyone can pick the optimal build they want to be effective, that didn’t help people reach the breakpoints they sought thereby making encounters easier? That’s an interesting take, assuredly.
Then do it and make the point to fatshark. And post videos.
You completely missed the point of my post, but that’s okay. 99% of the powercreep is in the talents, not in the itemization.
what locks
Weapon locks.
You mean the thing that keeps many people from getting that <10% of power that they deserve to have?
That’s not the source of powercreep.
I’m just not addressing that hyperbolic red herring
People typically already have the optimal choices, the locks only prevented them from getting the level 4 blessings…etc. Going from all 3s to all 4s(for example, going from +4% crit to +5% crit, combined with standard base crit is literally 9% vs. 10%) doesn’t dramatically change weapon perf.
In fact, new system seems to make it impossible for people to get <10% warp resistance on their swords. So it actually lowered the power ceiling for that particular application.
…Yes? It’s been a core mechanic since launch.
This is such a twisting of terms it’s insane. Good lord. Literally any game with combat is a DPS race by that logic.
…Do you even understand the concept I was getting at?
Player power level skyrocketed with the skill tree reworks and has only gone up even more since.
You don’t say. There’s a difference between meta being 5% better than a ‘normal’ non-meta loadout and the meta being 50% better.
And this continues to be an absolutely idiotic suggestion. Which is extra funny to me, because I’m somebody who does things like true solos in these types of games. Keep telling me how it works though, if you keep up that condescension I’m sure you’ll convince someone you know what you’re talking about.
It’s been a mechanic since launch - sure. I don’t think the game is Built around it and/or balanced around it.
Yeah, that’s exactly what I am saying. Are you suggesting that there aren’t different kinds of races? Such as Dirt Rallies versus drag racing? That’s what I’m trying to illustrate here. This is a sprint.
I do, and I think it’s insufficient in its characterization.
Yup. This also effectively gave people more “specializations” to choose from (and the ability to mix-n-match. I don’t deny that. My comment was made post-talent rework.
If it’s 5% better, then the thing that is 5% better is still META. As people have pointed out on this forum, it’s all about the breakpoints and that 5% makes the difference. Only now, you’re balancing your own breakpoints against you AND the enemy.
I’m sorry if anything I said came across as condescending - that wasn’t my intention. I want us to have a respectful and constructive conversation. That said, I find it interesting that your comment suggests condescension on my part while using a tone that could also be seen as dismissive or even condescending itself.
How would you like me to carry my tone with you to avoid this further?
It was told to me back then, that those differences made all the difference in breakpoints. Let’s also not forget that everyone nearly certainly has the modifiers they want for their weapons too with the dumpstats where they want them.