Theres a difference between Fatshark being predatory and treating us like crap, while a community manager relays a message that not many people like, leading to the community feeling unheard and like crap.
When the latter is the problem, it sounds like a personal problem especially when the message being relayed is a solution meeting us halfway.
“BuT hALfWay Is noT ENoUgH” on sum goofy shi
What is this referencing, specifically? Because without that context this doesn’t really mean anything.
Any problem solved or content added so far. Either we liked it or didnt due to it’s perceived lackluster solution or addition hence it’s percieved uselesness.
The only time the community managers have a net positive interaction with us on the forum is if we hear what we want to hear.
Catfish is ill atm and taking some time off afaik
If your house is on fire for a year, i guess it is to be expected that most people will keep telling you “your house is on fire” when ever you tell them about the nice new curtains and wallpapers that you installed.
If you want people to appreciate those things, maybe you should make sure that your house is not on fire.
Meanwhile look at how absolutely easy it would be to clear it up
Why are you acting like being clear costs them anything? Like do you not understand that when the patch releases and expectations were off that it’s THEM who are hurt by it?
They’re setting THEMSELVES up for failure. It’s upsetting to witness when you want the game to do well.
By acting like this isn’t an issue you’re saying you’re ok with them being locked in a circle of negativity. The circle being:
make update → communicate badly about what it will be, or dont communicate at all because “it’ll be badly received anyway” → the update will be badly perceived because expectations were off no matter how good it is
The circle can be broken but not if they’re secure in believing it’s just a “damned if they do, damned if they don’t” situation. It’s not. Someone who is adept at handling communities and has the social intelligence required to see “hold up, these people are having expectations they should not have” could simply clear it up and avoid this. Of course there’ll be SOME negative sentiment even to twinbeard saying that in my screenshot, however, it doesn’t compare to what negative sentiment there will be if a majority of the community mistakenly believes the patch to be of a way different scope than it will be.
Luckily a dev blog is announced but if they don’t clear it up there I’ll worry seriously about what the hell their CM team is doing.
Yeah but again, the specifics matter. What if it’s a problem they say they’ve fixed that they have, in fact, not fixed? Like the plethora of sound issues, for example. And broadly speaking, the game is still not what it was promised pre-release as the Book of Grudges thread quite clearly proves in pretty definitive terms. It’s both understandable and expected that people will remain generally negative and unhappy until the game is at least close to that originally promised state.
Yeah but isn’t that kind of… normal? I mean in a perfect world, the CM’s and the community would have a sort of chummy relationship, but first and foremost their role is to interface with the community on behalf of the studio. They shouldn’t have some kind of expectation of a positive interaction. It’s not a friend-friend relationship. It’s a customer and service-provider relationship. And I think at this point what the vast majority of players want to hear is pretty reasonable stuff like; here’s what we’re doing and when, etc.
I don’t think there’s any need to pick apart the whole community situation. It’s clear why things are the way they are and what the solution and path forwards is and it’s not to blame the community at large or make a minority of unreasonable and chronic moaners out to be the majority.
“i don’t know anything about game development”
Thinking Darktide is on fire is funny.
Warhammer has never had a massive/mainstream community behind it, more so for games tied to the property.
The only reason why it caught so much buzz in the beggining is because it was a cool space-age horde shooter, but the people who stayed till now are mostly the same fans of other tide/warhammer games.
To say that Darktide is on fire is like saying skateboarding/rollerblading is dying off.
no it aint
Who are you quoting?
Don’t you think if the game was as polished and well developed as they made it seem like it was going to be on release, people would stay behind in greater numbers than they are now? It’s a little reductive to say that the only people who’ve stayed are the old Tide fans. It’s probably true to an extent, but again, is that because the game is so incredibly niche or is it because it came out in a dire state? A state in which it largely still remains, for that matter.
Maybe Warhammer games rarely break through to the mainstream because more often that not, they’re just a couple degrees or more off from being really good?
Buddy ur either in the wrong thread or trolling
thank you for posting, very sorry to hear about it and I hope Catfish is doing well!
Not to turn this into ‘relitigate Fatshark’s absolute incompetence Thread 1 Million’ but…
it really is just incredibly striking how little we’ve gotten to make this what was originally promised to us. And it was entirely avoidable: Fatshark just needed to not make promises they couldn’t fulfill, and if stuff changed during development, they needed to inform us of the change.
But they didn’t and they still don’t. Whether they ran out of money during development, were told to push it out by their owners, or just couldn’t be bothered to tell anyone, it doesn’t matter.
Fatshark lied - whether by omission or deliberately. They continue this same pattern.
Well if it’s “not fixed”, its because it’s not fixed in the way we exactly want it to be fixed.
We’re waaaaaaay past the stage of trying to stay true to pre-release promises.
Nothing was really promised pre-release except fixing bugs, multiple/new classes and a working crafting system. They didnt promise that it was gonna be to our liking or nonpredatory, a reason why theyre now revamping.
Helldivers being brought up a lot make this a perfect world i guess. And true friends fight and have arguments because whats most imprtant is taking the time and effort to understand the other person. But it seems like we’re willing to throw every fault of Fatshark’s as “predatory” which is unreasonable.
No one should have any kind of expectations. It’s not a friend-friend relationship. It’s a customer and service-provider relationship. But this doesnt mean we should want or welcome negative interactions more than positive. If it calls for it sure, but when it doesnt then we need to cool off and just wait. Both sides should at least have the expectation for the best of the other. But it’s like we expect them to royally trip over themselves ad nauseum and they expect us to never be satisfied.
and it ends at “here’s what we’re doing and when.” IMO we shouldnt even be making demands unless its outwardly messed up like not being able to buy the exact premium credits needed.
but we’re all in this together type shi ngl
I’ve shat on Fatshark way more. Even turning their predatory behaviour into a personal problem saying “they’ve essentially spat on us and disrespected us.” But now we’re becoming predatory ourselves, only wanting what we want and immediately hounding on stuff we dont like/doesnt suit us.
No one/nothing should ever be picked apart as a solution, but sometimes it’s needed.
Outrage (or verbal violence for the libs) should never be a solution, but sometimes it’s needed.
It’s because people are gonna like what they like, not like what they don’t like, but most importantly, lose interest ; especially when many many many people’s opinions on things are based on other people’s opinions. (I would say though that the “nicheness” of Warhammer is a waaaay bigger contributor rather than the game being in this state.)
Warhammer in general. It’s very niche, the group of fans even more so. (Theres a proper term to call a group thats niche and also feels exclusive because of its niche, it’s slipping from my brain.)
Clearly Warhammer is really good. We all love it, Henry Cavill loves it. But there is a reason why Warhammer isnt as much talked about as Halo or CoD. Sure if the game were in a perfect state on release, maybe more people wouldve stayed, more problems looked over. But it wasnt. The one thing we can fully control is our reactions, and we’re better off not sulking about the past/what could’ve been. Yes, it is good to voice gripes, but not to the extent of over years. You just gotta get to the last stage of grief before it eats your heart out especially when solutions are currently being made to mend the problems. (Then you look over to that “minority of unreasonable and chronic moaners out to be the majority” thinking theyre the cause of change like martyrs.)
Yes Fatshark lied, but we we’re more affected by their motives to gain as much eyes as possible in the past, sometimes still though minutely. They’ve now clearly changed motive (because that sh!t dont work/wont last) but we’re all still hurt and many still say they lie about things they didn’t exactly/specifically promise. (Please do enlighten me if I’m wrong, I remember the blessing system supposedly being more forgiving, hopefully it becomes so). In the end, as I’ve said in the past, the interaction between us the community and Fatshark staff is a transaction of respect, transferal of energy. It isnt hard to tell when theyre decieving us, but it is becoming hard to look introspectively. We are in many ways entitled to things as customers, and the company is entitled to many things as well, being a business. No there should not be any overtly predatory bs, that’s why we’ve expressed this and they have changed/changing it. Some things just arent predatory and is just part of the system (no matter how many people can see it as predatory), a system which either way is changing no matter the speed. Yes we should be angry/demanding, but not anymore or at least way less. Unless of course things become way worse.
In conclusion, c’est la frickin’ vie.
Edit: I remember the proper term to call the Warhammer community, a fringed group.
If Fatshark didn’t put out multiple vague copy-pasta statements about how they don’t want their itemization and crafting to do what it was clearly explicitly designed to do but yet are somehow looking to change that, and then sit back and leave the void in the discussion space to be filled and directed almost exclusively by people upset about the current system (instead of elaborating further), the responses would probably be less vitriolic.
More to the point, if lots of users and customers are demanding/asking for something, and whatever you’re working on isn’t going to address that, you’re probably going to have upset customers. If whatever you’re doing and communicating is clearly not being conveying what you want properly and is resulting in misunderstanding and false narratives, and you’re aware of that and take no action to rectify that, again, you’re going to have upset customers.
This.
Oh! Dang I hadn’t actually caught onto the fact that she’s Aqshy! I just thought I’d somehow missed an old CM or something.
Either way, that succinctly answers my question, thank you! Happy to let the discourse surrounding Fatshark actually letting people do the jobs they were hired to do and stop screwing around with their CMs continue, mind, but mostly I just was wondering throughout all of this horsecrap “Usually Catfish is answering stuff, but she’s not here. Huh.”
You’re doing the Emperor’s work.
You made a good point I hadn’t thought about. Instead of pointing to games of similar genre, point to games not only of the same franchise?
It is, and that’s a pretty dire thing in itself! Wish this franchise had some higher standards when it comes to video games
(the total war series is a pretty good example of really, REALLY big mistakes too, to the point where at some point they chose to mass refund peoples purchases)
