Just to clarify, I normally enjoy havoc and have a good time, heck, I got to 40 this season in one weekend. Havoc 3.0 is just exhausting if you roll stimms, rotten armor, or encroaching garden, the worst one being rotten armor, combined with encroaching garden, as it mass spams crushers every horde encounter(this update is supposed to have fewer crushers btw), and with a purple enemy in the middle of that, the health is even more inflated. So if you don’t run infinite cleave weapons to counter the rotten armor spam, you’re in for a miserable time.
Tldr: FatShark, please just remove rotten armor from the rotation.
and, along with cranial, these are the only mutators fatshark have graciously given us the RNG chance to get on a randomly selected map, so literally 100% of havoc games are unfun and boring. fatshark really has the worst game design out of any company i’ve ever seen
Doesn’t help the blue eyes white stim glitch hasn’t been fixed when there’s poxgas they are immune to all damage. The blue stim is also insanely overpowered as they get like 80% damage reduction and it lasts as long as they live. Pair a Bulkwark with a healing captain and it can’t die pox gas or not. Is there’s no testing for these things? They take so long to fix even when people make forums about. For example why hasn’t the blue stim gotten nerffed? Why can it combine with healing/pox gas lol. Why is it 80% Damage reduction… why does it last until they die… why does it give them 200% stagger resistance?
Havoc, to begin with, isn’t fun as a base game, even before considering the modifiers. Many players feel that certain combinations of modifiers are simply boring rather than challenging. Fatshark basically throws in new features without much thought. They then rehash them multiple times, and sometimes even rebuild them from scratch, so Havoc still has a long way to go before it’s truly complete.
At the moment, Havoc is mostly just players grinding to rank 40 for skin rewards, or players who were reset to rank 30 by an update, pushing themselves to reach 40 again purely for appearances, and then never playing again until the next update—repeating this cycle over and over.
Now..now. I’m usually pretty critical of what they are doing, but this sounds a bit emotional. Fatshark can as anyone else do some questionable changes to their games, but you would be hard pressed to name another game studio in the horde shooter space which is able to compete against Tide games in terms of the core gameplay.
One could hope Fatshark wakes up to the problem of power creep, and specific outlier weapons and abilities, including those with “infinite” cleave and ability to ignore armour, get “adjusted”. Otherwise they will never be able to improve the overall build/weapon balance in high Havoc, as the only answer so far they had was elite spam and some pretty questionable difficulty modifiers.
The second uncanny strike is fixed to not work on dots.
(And also not giving DS fastes melee oneshot on THE most tough nonboss enemy)
The second gold toughness doesnt exist (and it just maxes out TH and adds some TH reduction)
That second havoc dies, literally falls into mathematically impossible to get through.
Dont ask fatshark to fix havoc, ask fatshark to fix the game.
It’s uncanny that is the culprit here. You’re not gonna melt that crusher train with soulblaze unless you have 10 minutes to spend kiting (especially if they’re Gardened or Rotten).
But you can just switch to dueling sword to stack uncanny and completely negate their armor, and now suddenly all dots tick at full damage.
The mediocre rending and brittleness you gain from talents and weapon blessing has very little effect on crushers. But 3-5 quick strikes with a dueling sword and suddenly all their armor counts for nothing. The “tick” damage suddenly jumps from 50-80 ish to over 350.
The fix is simple. Do not allow dots or ranged weapon attacks to gain the benefit from uncanny applied with a melee weapon.
Interactions between weapon blessings, abilities, and other weapons have to go in general. This is not the first time this is creating “unexpected” results. Silly levels of SB stacking, Vent Shriek and inferno staff need some work too. It leads to psyker doing from 2 or even 3 times as many kills as other classes, while holding Mouse2 in the general direction of the enemy.
Which isn’t really an issue in and of itself. Some classes are built more as tanks, others are glass cannons that clear horde, some are anti-special snipers/assassins, some are boss-deleters.
It’s weird how I can greatly enjoy playing a taunt Ogryn just running around keeping aggro on myself but not really getting much in the way of kills or doing damage, and yet still know I am massively contributing to my team’s effort finishing the map.
Yes it is a major part of it. Ranged SB based psyker builds can clear the screen far quicker than anything else, which leads to Fatshark ramping up enemy numbers, introducing layer enemy buffs, to catch up with the player power creep.
Currently the game is balanced around the outlier weapons and builds, instead of Fatshark stepping in to balance the outliers. This leaves a lot of other build options in the dust and pushing those more and more into obsolesce in high difficulty Havoc, limiting playstyle options. Even if I’m up for a challenge to not run inferno / smite / shriek whatever meta builds myself, this isn’t healthy for the game.
I agree the game has a problem with player powercreep and how this has led to the current situation with extreme numbers of enemies with huge healthpools being thrown at us, but that’s not the point I was objecting to.
It was the idea that one class A killing way more than another class B being a problem that I took issue with, exactly because this is due to different classes being better designed to fulfill different roles.
Shouldn’t the “AOE clear” class actually do 2-3 times more damage and kills than the “taunt and tank” class? It seems to me it should. Perhaps you mean to suggest all classes should have an AOE clear spec, a specials sniper spec, and a tank spec. I’m not sure I agree with that if so, since it would kind of take away the idea that each class is uniquely best at some particular thing. It just seems natural to me that the ogryn would be the best tank, and the psyker the best weapon of mass destruction.
Yes. And I wouldn’t be half so disappointed with the current state of DT of FS hadn’t already proven it can do much, much better. It had its ups and deep crevasses, but VT2 never dug itself into a powercreep pit, then rolled up its sleeves, sold us a DLC, and dug faster and deeper.
DT’s player/enemy balance is broken, and Hvc ‘s “unfun” combos are a perfect demonstration of how difficult it is to solve a problem without really addressing the problem.
It’s not just the bugs, the unintended interactions, some “WTF?” design decisions and the left-to-fester OP-elements. It’s the bugs and the unintended interactions and the decisions and the OP-elements.
This dmg / kill ratio is going to be quite true for dps psyker vs majority of dps builds on other classes. The problem is evident and fairly obvious, infinite cleave, relatively large cone of attack on inferno and Shriek, and/or Smite. What makes this worse how Soulblaze is allowed to stack from different SB sources and how it it is allowed to interact with different weapon blessings etc.
Even if you use few other AoE based builds on other classes you are unlikely to compete vs the psyker hoover builds. Also those builds require ammo. Quite a few of them are going to be squishy too, if you for example went all out on damage with Exec Stance vet. None of them can compete with the AoE size, DoT output, lack of ammo requirements, and how infinite cleave on a lot of weapons like inferno or abilities is not affected by number of enemies those attacks hit.
You have to see the problem here, unless you are simply too invested in maintaining the current status quo.
It pretty much outdamages everything in this case, not just the tank classes.
It might be fine if the AoE wasn’t effective against 90% of enemies, had limited uses, or hard to master but that’s not the case with the Inferno Staff.
Agreed that the ease of use of the inferno staff is an issue, particularly compared to other weapons/builds that can theoretically output similar (or close to it) damage numbers.
But with respect to the comparison in terms of the maximum damage potential I still don’t think it is an issue that one particular class with a specific setup is ahead of everything else. Unless everything is literally created equal, there just is going to be one class with a specific setup which has the highest damage potential compared to all others.
The real issue is if no-one else brings something useful to the team when their niche is maximized. Is the best team one with four psykers on it? Not in my experience.
I can’t think of a single other company that designs their systems this poorly. Do you not remember when the entire community complained about crafting locks for 2 years and they almost kept them in for the unlocked and loaded update? You can see it in the trailer
